When Buddhist and Christian relatives meet ... conflict
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I do have some unpleasant christian uncle last time who come to our house and blabber nonsense in front of my altar and say the good thing of God
i feel heng , becos now he is nine inch under the ground liao
anyway have unpleasant experience with zealous relative who heck care other relative religion ???? -
Errr..... Are you rejoicing that he's dead ? Forget it , diff pple have diff paths.
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Then I hope you can join him soon to make clear your stance on this matter.Originally posted by bohiruci:I do have some unpleasant christian uncle last time who come to our house and blabber nonsense in front of my altar and say the good thing of God
i feel heng , becos now he is nine inch under the ground liao
anyway have unpleasant experience with zealous relative who heck care other relative religion ????
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I do have a cousin who would occasionally tell me to join him in church when we meet and would say this with a smile 'Come to church, come to the light'. To which I would always reply, I am already in the Light (The light of wisdom from the Triple Gems). We would debate further on, till I or he decide to change topics.Originally posted by bohiruci:I do have some unpleasant christian uncle last time who come to our house and blabber nonsense in front of my altar and say the good thing of God
i feel heng , becos now he is nine inch under the ground liao
anyway have unpleasant experience with zealous relative who heck care other relative religion ????
I'm sorry to hear about your uncle's passing away. On the other hand, in relation to your feelings towards your deceased relative, I hope you would try to look upon it as you would now have no chance to introduce Buddhism to him even if and when you have improved in your knowledge of Buddhism and have found better ways to explain the teachings to him.
I would have felt 'heng' too if I were you, but as a Buddhist, I know I have to adjust this feeling or thinking of mine if I want to make progress in my practical application of Buddhist teachings.
Take care, and all the best in your spiritual cultivation.
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TSK TSK TSK! i alway have doubt of u. whenever i see ur posts, u dun seen to practice wat u preach.
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haha , then continue doubtingOriginally posted by 798:TSK TSK TSK! i alway have doubt of u. whenever i see ur posts, u dun seen to practice wat u preach. 
i am fine with that
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For your info , my decease uncle is a diehard .. he was one of the indonesia methodist church Senior Pastor .Well my mum also smiled when He ask weird question abt GuanyinOriginally posted by Spnw07:I do have a cousin who would occasionally tell me to join him in church when we meet and would say this with a smile 'Come to church, come to the light'. To which I would always reply, I am already in the Light (The light of wisdom from the Triple Gems). We would debate further on, till I or he decide to change topics.
I'm sorry to hear about your uncle's passing away. On the other hand, in relation to your feelings towards your deceased relative, I hope you would try to look upon it as you would now have no chance to introduce Buddhism to him even if and when you have improved in your knowledge of Buddhism and have found better ways to explain the teachings to him.
I would have felt 'heng' too if I were you, but as a Buddhist, I know I have to adjust this feeling or thinking of mine if I want to make progress in my practical application of Buddhist teachings.
Take care, and all the best in your spiritual cultivation. -
All the great religious masters always promote religious harmony. See speech of Dalai Lama at http://www.dalailama.com/page.122.htm
I read from Tzu Chi's magazine that there are many cases where Christians and Muslims participate in Tzu Chi relief activities (e.g. in Jordan, Indonesia, South Africa) but remain faithful to their own religions. Recently, Master Chin Kung also led the effort to visit Muslims and Christians to promote religious harmony in Singapore. Therefore, shouldn't we, as buddhists, do our part too?
When talking to Christians, I always try to avoid conflict by highlighting the common things rather than focusing on the differences. When I speak to my Christian colleagues, I would praise what Mother Theresa has done (to me, she is a bodhisattva). I would also highlight that five precepts in Buddhism is similar to the ten commandments and if everybody can truly follow these, it would be a different world.
Part of ten commandments in Christians:
12 Honor your father and your mother, so that your days may be long in the land that the Lord your God is giving you
13 You shall not kill.
14 You shall not commit adultery.
15 You shall not steal.
16 You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour.
17 You shall not covet your neighbour’s house; you shall not covet your neighbour’s wife, or male or female slave, or ox, or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbour.
And it is obvious that it matches the 1st 净业三ç¦� in è§‚æ— é‡�寿佛ç»�:
净业三ç¦�是修æŒ�净业的基础，是过去ã€�现在ã€�未æ�¥ä¸‰ä¸–一切诸佛修æŒ�净业的æ£å› 。三ç¦�的内容是：1.å�养父æ¯�，奉事师长，慈心ä¸�æ�€ï¼Œä¿®å��善业。æ¤å±žäººå¤©ç¦�，亦称世善；
And I was joking with my Christian friends that actually God never said you can kill/eat animals so all Christians should be vegetarians ...
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Actually God did say you can kill/eat animals.
"Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything. But you must not eat meat that has its lifeblood still in it." (Genesis 9:3-4)
God also likes animal sacrifice. He usually blesses people who sacrifice animals to him.
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Early years of Muhammed
According to Welch, the Qur'anic verses at this time were not "based on a dogmatic conception of monotheism but on a strong general moral and religious appeal". Its key themes include the moral responsibility of man towards his creator; the resurrection of dead, God's final judgment followed by vivid descriptions of the tortures in hell and pleasures in Paradise; use of the nature and wonders of everyday life, particularly the phenomenon of man, as signs of God to show the existence of a greater power who will take into account the greed of people and their suppression of the poor. Religious duties required of the believers at this time were few: belief in God, asking for forgiveness of sins, offering frequent prayers, assisting others particularly those in need, rejecting cheating and the love of wealth (considered to be significant in the commercial life of Mecca), being chaste and not to kill new-born girls.
Treatment of animals
It is forbidden to cage animals,to beat them unnecessarily, to brand them on the face, or to allow them to fight each other for human entertainment. "They must not be mutilated while they are alive."
He is also reported to have said: "There is no man who kills [even] a sparrow or anything smaller, without its deserving it, but Allah will question him about it [on the judgment day]," and "Whoever is kind to the creatures of God is kind to himself."
The historian Montgomery Watt states that Muhammad's kindness to animals was remarkable for the social context of his upbringing.
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Extract from an article in Internet http://onthemargins.wordpress.com/2008/02/20/lenten-season-ethical-implications/
We read in Genesis 1:29-30:
Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move on the ground–everything that has the breath of life in it–I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.
As it would seem, God’s intention for all of us, including the animal world, at the dawn of creation, was that we would be herbivores. There would be no cannibalization of flesh–neither human or animal–by the other. We would all share in the abundance God had provided through the plants in the garden. Yet, we must note this is not what eventually happens. In fact, after the flood where God destroyed all who were wicked, it seems that an exception has been made, as God states to Noah and his family:
Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the earth. The fear and dread of you will fall on all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky, on every creature that moves along the ground, and on all the fish in the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I know give you everything.
Why the change of heart? Why the exception to what was previously established? Is this God giving agreement to something which had already been occurring, or is this the first instance of humanity eating the flesh of the animal world? I am not sure we will ever know. What I do know is that this is still an ethical issue, even to this day. For me, if God’s original intent was that the plants God had provided would be food enough for all of us, then should we continue, even with the “God-given” permission, to eat of the flesh of other living creatures?
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Did u counter your uncle with the Da Vinci Code?
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Originally posted by JitKiat:
We read in Genesis 1:29-30:
Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move on the ground–everything that has the breath of life in it–I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.
As it would seem, God’s intention for all of us, including the animal world, at the dawn of creation, was that we would be herbivores. There would be no cannibalization of flesh–neither human or animal–by the other. We would all share in the abundance God had provided through the plants in the garden. Yet, we must note this is not what eventually happens. In fact, after the flood where God destroyed all who were wicked, it seems that an exception has been made, as God states to Noah and his family:
Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the earth. The fear and dread of you will fall on all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky, on every creature that moves along the ground, and on all the fish in the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I know give you everything.
Why the change of heart? Why the exception to what was previously established? Is this God giving agreement to something which had already been occurring, or is this the first instance of humanity eating the flesh of the animal world? I am not sure we will ever know. What I do know is that this is still an ethical issue, even to this day. For me, if God’s original intent was that the plants God had provided would be food enough for all of us, then should we continue, even with the “God-given” permission, to eat of the flesh of other living creatures?
I have same doubt as you, Jitkiat. Did the Biblical God allow its people to eat meat? And why the difference prior and after the Noah's Ark incident?Why the change in God's original intent?
Thanks for pointing out to me. Will go and ask my Christian friends if I meet them.
I have always wanted to ask Christians on the subject of meat-eating but didn't know which bible verses to quote and compare.
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About 90% of my father's side relatives are Christians, but thankfully, they did not ever preach their beliefs to me. Nevertheless, during family gatherings, the Christians tend to bunch togather since they got common talk topic about their church, God and religion. Consequently, I am attending less and less of these family gatherings. Not because I dislike being with Christians, but because there is nothing to "click"..... Sad because we share a common grandfather.
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Originally posted by Spnw07:
I have always wanted to ask Christians on the subject of meat-eating but didn't know which bible verses to quote and compare.
Better not... if you talk discuss religion with Christians (unless using an online forumn), they will likely seize the opportunity to "save" you.
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come on la.
childish (referring to pple who talk nonsense and "curse" other pple's religion and god)
you have your rights to preach but please spare a thought of other pple's feelings.
Some pple, so old already, still behave "childishly"
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Originally posted by Beyond Religion:
About 90% of my father's side relatives are Christians, but thankfully, they did not ever preach their beliefs to me. Nevertheless, during family gatherings, the Christians tend to bunch togather since they got common talk topic about their church, God and religion. Consequently, I am attending less and less of these family gatherings. Not because I dislike being with Christians, but because there is nothing to "click"..... Sad because we share a common grandfather.
Better not... if you talk discuss religion with Christians (unless using an online forumn), they will likely seize the opportunity to "save" you.
Wah, u so good fu qi, beyond religion. Your Christian relatives don't preach to you. My Christian relatives start to ask me to go to church with them liao. I think eventually I will also attend less and less of these family gatherings. And one of my reason is similar to yours: nothing to "click". There are only two or three real Buddhists (not those who practise folk customs but call themselves Buddhists) on my mother's side. My father's side, I do not know any who are real Buddhists yet.
Yup, thanks for the caution. I usually avoid discussing religion with Christians in a church or christian talk setting, as I would usually be the only Buddhist around.
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Extract from Wiki's Seven Days Adventist (a conservative Christian group):
Health and diet
Since the 1860s when the church began, wholeness and health have been an emphasis of the Adventist church.[13] Adventists are known for presenting a "health message" that recommends vegetarianism and expects abstinence from pork, shellfish, and other foods proscribed as "unclean" in Leviticus 11. However according to some studies, the majority of Adventists do eat meat.[14] The church discourages its members from the use of alcohol, tobacco or illegal drugs (compare Christianity and alcohol). In addition, some Adventists avoid coffee and other beverages containing caffeine.
The pioneers of the Adventist church had much to do with the common acceptance of breakfast cereals into the Western diet. John Harvey Kellogg was one of the early founders of the Adventist health work. His development of breakfast cereals as a health food led to the founding of Kellogg's by his brother William K. Kellogg. In Australia, the church-owned Sanitarium Health Food Company is one of Australia's leading manufacturers of health and vegetarian-related products.
Research funded by the U.S. National Institutes of Health has shown that the average Adventist in California lives four to ten years longer than the average Californian. The research, as cited by the cover story of the November 2005 issue of National Geographic magazine, asserts that Adventists live longer because of not smoking or drinking, and their healthy, low-fat vegetarian diet rich in nuts and beans.[15][16] The cohesiveness of Adventists' social networks has also been put forward as an explanation of their extended lifespan.[17]
Ethics and sexuality
The official Adventist position on abortion is that "abortions for reasons of birth control, gender selection, or convenience are not condoned by the Church." At times, however, women may face exceptional circumstances that present serious moral or medical dilemmas, such as significant threats to the pregnant woman's life or health, severe congenital defects in the fetus, and pregnancy resulting from rape or incest, in these cases individuals are counseled to make their own decisions.[18]
According to official statements from the General Conference, heterosexual marriages are the only biblically ordained grounds for sexual intimacy. Adventists do not perform same-sex marriages and gay men cannot be ordained.[19][20] An extramarital affair is one of the sanctioned grounds for a divorce, although reconciliation is encouraged whenever possible. Following biblical principles, Adventists believe in and encourage chastity for both men and women before marriage.
The Adventist church has released official statements in relation to other ethical issues such as euthanasia,[21] birth control[22] and human cloning.[23]
Dress and entertainment
In Western countries, Adventists have traditionally held socially conservative attitudes regarding dress and entertainment. These attitudes are reflected in one of the church's fundamental beliefs:
- "For the Spirit to recreate in us the character of our Lord we involve ourselves only in those things which will produce Christlike purity, health, and joy in our lives. This means that our amusement and entertainment should meet the highest standards of Christian taste and beauty. While recognizing cultural differences, our dress is to be simple, modest, and neat, befitting those whose true beauty does not consist of outward adornment but in the imperishable ornament of a gentle and quiet spirit."[8]
Accordingly, many Western Adventists are opposed to practices such as body piercing and tattoos. More conservative Adventists refrain from the wearing of jewelry altogether, including such items as earrings and wedding bands.[24] Traditionally Adventists dress formally when attending church.
Conservative Adventists also avoid certain recreational activities which are considered to be a negative spiritual influence, including dancing, rock music and secular theatre.[25][26] However, these sentiments are far less common among the more recent generations of Adventists.[26] The Adventist church officially opposes the practice of gambling.[27]
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See how Christians/Muslims become Tzu Chi's members in South Africa, Pakistan, Indonesia, Iran yet they remain faithful to their God:
South African's Christians:
Extract from http://www.newdaai.tv/culture/?mod=tc_monthly&act=detail&id=400
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Building schools for Indonesia's Earthquake victims (Muslims), extracted from http://www.newdaai.tv/culture/?mod=tc_monthly&act=detail&id=208
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Building schools in Iran:
http://taipei.tzuchi.org.tw/monthly/484/mag484.HTM
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pakistan relief work at http://taipei.tzuchi.org.tw/monthly/468/mag468.HTMå�—æ— è§‚ä¸–éŸ³è�©è�¨æ‘©è¯ƒè�¨ ï¼�ï¼�ï¼�
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Originally posted by JitKiat:
Extract from an article in Internet http://onthemargins.wordpress.com/2008/02/20/lenten-season-ethical-implications/
We read in Genesis 1:29-30:
As it would seem, God’s intention for all of us, including the animal world, at the dawn of creation, was that we would be herbivores. There would be no cannibalization of flesh–neither human or animal–by the other. We would all share in the abundance God had provided through the plants in the garden. Yet, we must note this is not what eventually happens. In fact, after the flood where God destroyed all who were wicked, it seems that an exception has been made, as God states to Noah and his family:
Why the change of heart? Why the exception to what was previously established? Is this God giving agreement to something which had already been occurring, or is this the first instance of humanity eating the flesh of the animal world? I am not sure we will ever know. What I do know is that this is still an ethical issue, even to this day. For me, if God’s original intent was that the plants God had provided would be food enough for all of us, then should we continue, even with the “God-given” permission, to eat of the flesh of other living creatures?
God's original intent was for people to go around naked. Will you now take off your clothes and wander around in public bare assed?
We have a choice between eating meat of vegetables because we are omnivores. What about carnivores? Do you mean after the flood, God created carnivores? Or did he convert some of the herbivores into carnivores?
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Hi,
well some of you probably have it easier than me. I'm the only Buddhist in my whole clan, both father's and mother's, of which my dad's side has been christian for more than 4-5 generations, since my great-grandfather was a missionary.The gist is, to avoid conflict, don't talk about religion at all. I just smiled and declined when my relatives or mum's friends tried to convert me back. After a while, they give up. It will take a while, but once they know you're not going to convert, they'll stop pestering you.
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Originally posted by sanath:
Hi,
well some of you probably have it easier than me. I'm the only Buddhist in my whole clan, both father's and mother's, of which my dad's side has been christian for more than 4-5 generations, since my great-grandfather was a missionary.The gist is, to avoid conflict, don't talk about religion at all. I just smiled and declined when my relatives or mum's friends tried to convert me back. After a while, they give up. It will take a while, but once they know you're not going to convert, they'll stop pestering you.
That's right..
http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol6no3c.htm
Mutual respect begets harmony
How may a family whose members have different religions live together harmoniously?
One common principle that mankind all over the world abides by is the freedom of choice of religion and faith. A country may have different religions co-existing at the same time, such as Buddhism, Catholicism, Christianity or Islam. But, we have to understand that it is the condition arising from love that causes people to have families, parents and children. It is a good thing if the family is happy and blissful. However, if the family members bear different faiths, so long as each member keeps his faith to himself, refrain from slandering or debating over each other’s faith, but mutually respecting each other’s faith and character, then the family will naturally be harmonious.
Further, the younger generation ought to refrain from arguing with their elders because it is their parents who brought them up. Moreover, there is no purpose in arguing with them. We have to practise filial piety and be good so that we do them proud. Then, they will feel that their children are righteous, well behaved, and may willingly join us to learn about Buddhism. This will be ideal. Otherwise, it is not filial to constantly argue with them. When we learn and practise Buddhism, we have to exercise wisdom. With regards to differences in religions and faiths, as long as we maintain mutual respect, I believe, the family will be harmonious.
Freedom in choice of religion
If the children of a Buddhist family choose to marry a person of a different faith, will the marriage work out well?
Although a person may be a Buddhist himself, it is not necessary that his children must also Buddhists. We may, of course, promote and encourage our children to embrace Buddhism. However, we cannot force it upon them. Moreover, we should not object to their marriage just because their partners are from a different faith.
In this present age, everybody has the freedom to love and choose his or her own lifetime partner. Similarly, everyone has the freedom of choice of religion and faith. No religion can compel its followers (and their dependants) to only believe in that particular faith, and object to marriages outside that particular faith. I believe, as parents, with regards to their children’s marriages, the primary concerns are the relationship between the two parties and how to guide their children in deciding their lifetime partners. Religion and faith are secondary factors; it is their happiness after the marriage that matters most of all. It would be useful for parents to counsel their children about the code of family ethics, such as the role and responsibilities of a husband and wife, and how to be good parents themselves. If they do not know how to live harmoniously and fulfil their responsibilities as husband and wife, or to be good parents, even if both of them believe in Buddhism, the marriage may still not work out well. If, for instance, the choice partner believes in a different faith, as a parent, one may promote the teachings of Buddhism so that he or she finds it acceptable. It will, of course, be good to establish a household based on the principles of Buddhism. If, meanwhile that cannot be achieved, one should adopt the Buddhist teaching of loving-kindness, compassion and equality towards all beings, in relation to the son-in-law or daughter-in-law. It is a good thing for a couple to bear the same faith and share the same principles and values, with both cultivating together and becoming partners on the Bodhi-path. It would be even better if they were eventually reborn in the Buddha-land. -
Originally posted by sanath:
Hi,
well some of you probably have it easier than me. I'm the only Buddhist in my whole clan, both father's and mother's, of which my dad's side has been christian for more than 4-5 generations, since my great-grandfather was a missionary.The gist is, to avoid conflict, don't talk about religion at all. I just smiled and declined when my relatives or mum's friends tried to convert me back. After a while, they give up. It will take a while, but once they know you're not going to convert, they'll stop pestering you.
Hi, just want to say your story is quite encouraging. You have been handling religious matters within the family in a consistently respectful manner and I hope to be able to follow your example.
All the best for your cultivation, sanath. Amituofo! ^_^
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Love all regligion folk, they love to talk and i'll listen,then i'll brainwash them
ha ha ha -
if science can explained everything, then who would believed in the creator? looks like science is beginning to explain a lot of things...example; clonings, artificial insemination, genetic modified foods and plants etc...so scary sometimes...
