Venerable's question left me dumbfounded...
-
We were escorting two officiating monks for our Taking Refuge in Triple Gems ceremony back to their place of stay last year.
Inside the taxi, after a while, one of them who was sitting just next to me, asked me this:
Why do you young people like to turn to Christianity?
I was caught dumbfounded at the moment. I had some views of my own on that since I think about this question constantly. However, I was caught by surprise and I knew I didn't know how to frame my answers well enough to let the Venerable understand.
What's more, who am I to speak for young people of today? I may be a young adult, but that doesn't mean I know more than anybody else the mentality of young people when choosing between Christianity and Buddhism. I also know too little about the two religions to offer an educated and objective reply.
How would you answer? What would you say?
P.S: Both are Chinese monks in their mid to late twenties, I think. For those who are curious. -
well , if i were to answer
its simple
i found young ppl like simplicity , they found buddhism like an "ah ma ah gong " religion and
the temple is often stuffy and reek of insense
well ,thats when they never step into Buddhist library ,Phor Kark See or other air-conditioned temple
then they like companionship ,like their classmate in the same cell group and fellowship
next , some do like a "live concert " religion
visited City Harvest Church Services before and feel this isnt the kind of services i want .... -
Maybe they asked why some young people turn to christianity, because you are not christian although you are young.Originally posted by Spnw07:We were escorting two officiating monks for our Taking Refuge in Triple Gems ceremony back to their place of stay last year.
Inside the taxi, after a while, one of them who was sitting just next to me, asked me this:
Why do you young people like to turn to Christianity?
I personally know many young buddhist, and I am very sure the number of buddhist turn christian is much less than the other one.
Unless people mistake taoist and "bai-bai"ist as buddhist.
As in why they like christian, I don't know. You may want to ask some christian to answer this question though.
I think maybe bible is much easier to read and doesn't require so much time considering the amount of content inside. During the service, they can listen to concert, mingle around with friends and told that their sin are gone forever and will go to heaven as long as they believe. -
actually I think there is a great rising number of young buddhists in Singapore... trends are changing already.. the image of buddhism in singapore is changing
-
I can think of several reasons:
1. Christianity is seen as hip and trendy, whereas Buddhism (especially the brand of Buddhism portrayed by the joss-stick-buddhists-turned-Christian) is seen as old fashion and superstitious.
2. Christianity is seen as classy. Some Christians like to showcase the VIPs in their church, politicians, doctors and famous university professors etc. Many people like the networking relationship made available in these church gatherings.
3. Spiritually, it is much easier being a Christian than a Buddhist. For the former, all you need to do is to pledge your allegiance to the Christian God, and whatever your past misdeeds will be forgiven. For Buddhists, you have to really work hard to atone for your past negative actions, and even then the negative karma arising from these misdeeds will not be 'forgiven', merely reduced in severity.
4. There is a 'feel good' element knowing that a supposedly almighty being is watching over you. Provides a spiritual 'crutch' to the spiritually handicapped.
5. Aggressive evangelizing. Christianity is a proselytizing religion. They make an art out of defending their faith (Apologetics) and spreading their religion.
6. Emotional elements knowing that Jesus has taken the brunt of our "sins" and died for us on the cross. Many people, especially ladies, will be 'touched' into believing.
7. Remnants of colonial mentality. Christianity is the dominant religion of the west. We were once a British colony. Although we have gained independance for more than 4 decades now, there is still some leftover colonial mentality whereby we think the west is good. We emulate the west, adopting western names and lifestyles, learning English (to the detriment of our own mother tongue etc etc, all under the guise of being cosmopolitan). Naturally we will want to also adopt the religion that is dominant in the west.
8. Christianity provides a convenient pidgeon hole into which all things unexplained, and all unfulfilled wishes etc. can be shoved.
9. Fear of death. Christianity provides comfort in telling believers that they wont die after they die. Similarly, deceased loved ones are not really dead and gone, but are waiting for you by God's side. (provided of course, that you also believe)
Edit: corrected typo and added another point:
10. Fear of hell and eternal damnation. Accordiing to Christianity, non believers will go to hell. Hell isn't a place you want to be. The suffering there is.... intense to put it mildly; Residents there are subject to roasting by the everlasting fire, and the pain is so intense that there is much weeping and gnashing of teeth. Eternity is also a very very very long time. So long, that it defies time itself. Put togather, this creates a very fearsome prospect for an unbeliever. Consequently, some people opt to 'play it safe' and join 'em. -
One more.. fear of eternal hell and damnationOriginally posted by Beyond Religion:I can think of several reasons:
1. Christianity is seen as hip and trendy, whereas Buddhism (especially the brand of Buddhism portrayed by the joss-stick-buddhists-turned-Christian) is seen as old fashion and superstitious.
2. Christianity is seen as classy. Some Christians like to showcase the VIPs in their church, politicians, doctors and famous university professors etc. Many people like the networking relationship made available in these church gatherings.
3. Spiritually, it is much easier being a Christian than a Buddhist. For the former, all you need to do is to pledge your allegiance to the Christian God, and whatever your past misdeeds will be forgiven. For Buddhists, you have to really work hard to atone for your past negative actions, and even then the negative karma arising from these misdeeds will not be 'forgiven', merely reduced in the severity.
4. There is a 'feel good' element knowing that a supposedly almighty being watches over you. Provides a spiritual 'clutch' to the spiritually handicapped.
5. Aggressive evangelizing. Christianity is a proselytizing religion. They make an art out of defending their faith (Apologetics) and spreading their religion.
6. Emotional elements knowing that Jesus has taken the brunt of our "sins" and died for us on the cross. Many people, especially ladies, will be 'touched' into believing.
7. Remnants of colonial mentality. Christianity is the dominant religion of the west. We were once a British colony. Although we have gained independance for more than 4 decades now, there is still some leftover colonial mentality whereby we think the west is good. We emulate the west, adopting western names and lifestyles, learning English (to the detriment of our own mother tongue etc etc, all under the guise of being cosmopolitan). Naturally we will want to also adopt the religion that is dominant in the west.
8. Christianity provides a convenient pidgeon hole into which all things unexplained, and all unfulfilled wishes etc. can be shoved.
9. Fear of death. Christianity provides comfort in telling believers that they wont die after they die. Similarly, deceased loved ones are not really dead and gone, but are waiting for you by God's side. (provided of course, that you also believe)
-
Yah... How can I possibly miss that one out? LOL Probably because I haven't had my morning coffee when I put up that post.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:One more.. fear of eternal hell and damnation -
NUS School of Arts and Social Science did a survey in year 1990
and found that singaporean on the average does not like religion as in Pompous ceremony and elaborate ritual
They want a simple religion which dun really need much thinking and something to be "called upon" in times of need
Interested person can go to look for NUS thesis for year 1990
Looking at the present trend , young people want to be "rebellious" to wear funky shirt to place of worship ,to reflect their frustration on the laid social order .
Buddhism however offers spiritual and insightful wisdom to matters
With the setup of more english speaking dharma class ,especially mahayana based ,Buddhism slowly seeing a large number of converts from the Middle income billingual group ,which need flexibility in worship service rather than a rigid sunday services
-
What to say, you are the man (or girl?), Beyond religion! Your ten points are written in an easy to read and understand format, they are a good summary of various reasons that people turn to Christianity. Of course, they are more, but these ten points are good enough for me to do further research on.Originally posted by Beyond Religion:I can think of several reasons:
1. Christianity is seen as hip and trendy, whereas Buddhism (especially the brand of Buddhism portrayed by the joss-stick-buddhists-turned-Christian) is seen as old fashion and superstitious.
2. Christianity is seen as classy. Some Christians like to showcase the VIPs in their church, politicians, doctors and famous university professors etc. Many people like the networking relationship made available in these church gatherings.
3. Spiritually, it is much easier being a Christian than a Buddhist. For the former, all you need to do is to pledge your allegiance to the Christian God, and whatever your past misdeeds will be forgiven. For Buddhists, you have to really work hard to atone for your past negative actions, and even then the negative karma arising from these misdeeds will not be 'forgiven', merely reduced in severity.
4. There is a 'feel good' element knowing that a supposedly almighty being is watching over you. Provides a spiritual 'crutch' to the spiritually handicapped.
5. Aggressive evangelizing. Christianity is a proselytizing religion. They make an art out of defending their faith (Apologetics) and spreading their religion.
6. Emotional elements knowing that Jesus has taken the brunt of our "sins" and died for us on the cross. Many people, especially ladies, will be 'touched' into believing.
7. Remnants of colonial mentality. Christianity is the dominant religion of the west. We were once a British colony. Although we have gained independance for more than 4 decades now, there is still some leftover colonial mentality whereby we think the west is good. We emulate the west, adopting western names and lifestyles, learning English (to the detriment of our own mother tongue etc etc, all under the guise of being cosmopolitan). Naturally we will want to also adopt the religion that is dominant in the west.
8. Christianity provides a convenient pidgeon hole into which all things unexplained, and all unfulfilled wishes etc. can be shoved.
9. Fear of death. Christianity provides comfort in telling believers that they wont die after they die. Similarly, deceased loved ones are not really dead and gone, but are waiting for you by God's side. (provided of course, that you also believe)
Edit: corrected typo and added another point:
10. Fear of hell and eternal damnation. Accordiing to Christianity, non believers will go to hell. Hell isn't a place you want to be. The suffering there is.... intense to put it mildly; Residents there are subject to roasting by the everlasting fire, and the pain is so intense that there is much weeping and gnashing of teeth. Eternity is also a very very very long time. So long, that it defies time itself. Put togather, this creates a very fearsome prospect for an unbeliever. Consequently, some people opt to 'play it safe' and join 'em.
Your ten points are good reference material for me and if any free-thinkers or members from other religions ask me directly, I would know roughly how to answer them instead of keeping silent, or telling them to google online or to go temple to ask a monk.
Thanks!
-
Talk about it, man, I really dislike pompous ceremonies and elaborate rituals. Hence please do not invite me to join in group chanting sessions/repentance rituals/etc where long verses of sutras or similar verses written and passed by ancient masters, are chanted in a draggy singing rhythm.Originally posted by bohiruci:NUS School of Arts and Social Science did a survey in year 1990
and found that singaporean on the average does not like religion as in Pompous ceremony and elaborate ritual
They want a simple religion which dun really need much thinking and something to be "called upon" in times of need
Interested person can go to look for NUS thesis for year 1990
Looking at the present trend , young people want to be "rebellious" to wear funky shirt to place of worship ,to reflect their frustration on the laid social order .
Buddhism however offers spiritual and insightful wisdom to matters
With the setup of more english speaking dharma class ,especially mahayana based ,Buddhism slowly seeing a large number of converts from the Middle income billingual group ,which need flexibility in worship service rather than a rigid sunday services
Anyway, sunday services are not really that rigid, from what I have heard so far from my Christian friends. There are a few time slots in the day to cater to different groups of people and some churches even teach in certain local dialects for their sunday services. -
well ,its true ceremonial chanting is long and draggyOriginally posted by Spnw07:Talk about it, man, I really dislike pompous ceremonies and elaborate rituals. Hence please do not invite me to join in group chanting sessions/repentance rituals/etc where long verses of sutras or similar verses written and passed by ancient masters, are chanted in a draggy singing rhythm.
Anyway, sunday services are not really that rigid, from what I have heard so far from my Christian friends. There are a few time slots in the day to cater to different groups of people and some churches even teach in certain local dialects for their sunday services.
abt the sunday services ,some of their cell fellowship group stretches beyond evening till midnite , I wonder why they need so long to interact
some families have complained of the long hours children spend in cell group -
btw, how come you need to escort them back home?
they don't know how to go back themselves? -
I would say, "dont ask stupid question. Who am i to speak for young people of today? STFU, go recite your sutras and dont disturb me. Pls ask permission if you want to chat with me next time."Originally posted by Spnw07:We were escorting two officiating monks for our Taking Refuge in Triple Gems ceremony back to their place of stay last year.
Inside the taxi, after a while, one of them who was sitting just next to me, asked me this:
Why do you young people like to turn to Christianity?
I was caught dumbfounded at the moment. I had some views of my own on that since I think about this question constantly. However, I was caught by surprise and I knew I didn't know how to frame my answers well enough to let the Venerable understand.
What's more, who am I to speak for young people of today? I may be a young adult, but that doesn't mean I know more than anybody else the mentality of young people when choosing between Christianity and Buddhism. I also know too little about the two religions to offer an educated and objective reply.
How would you answer? What would you say?
P.S: Both are Chinese monks in their mid to late twenties, I think. For those who are curious. -
It's just a matter of courtesy and respect for the Venerables. We had asked them to officiate our Taking Refuge in Triple Gems at our residence and it is only natural that we see them off personally to the door of their residence.Originally posted by pwnz0r:btw, how come you need to escort them back home?
they don't know how to go back themselves?
I would have done this for an elderly guest if he or she has problems walking. -
I wish to add a point of my own: Difference in manner of interaction among/with fellow religious members.Originally posted by Beyond Religion:I can think of several reasons:
1. Christianity is seen as hip and trendy, whereas Buddhism (especially the brand of Buddhism portrayed by the joss-stick-buddhists-turned-Christian) is seen as old fashion and superstitious.
2. Christianity is seen as classy. Some Christians like to showcase the VIPs in their church, politicians, doctors and famous university professors etc. Many people like the networking relationship made available in these church gatherings.
3. Spiritually, it is much easier being a Christian than a Buddhist. For the former, all you need to do is to pledge your allegiance to the Christian God, and whatever your past misdeeds will be forgiven. For Buddhists, you have to really work hard to atone for your past negative actions, and even then the negative karma arising from these misdeeds will not be 'forgiven', merely reduced in severity.
4. There is a 'feel good' element knowing that a supposedly almighty being is watching over you. Provides a spiritual 'crutch' to the spiritually handicapped.
5. Aggressive evangelizing. Christianity is a proselytizing religion. They make an art out of defending their faith (Apologetics) and spreading their religion.
6. Emotional elements knowing that Jesus has taken the brunt of our "sins" and died for us on the cross. Many people, especially ladies, will be 'touched' into believing.
7. Remnants of colonial mentality. Christianity is the dominant religion of the west. We were once a British colony. Although we have gained independance for more than 4 decades now, there is still some leftover colonial mentality whereby we think the west is good. We emulate the west, adopting western names and lifestyles, learning English (to the detriment of our own mother tongue etc etc, all under the guise of being cosmopolitan). Naturally we will want to also adopt the religion that is dominant in the west.
8. Christianity provides a convenient pidgeon hole into which all things unexplained, and all unfulfilled wishes etc. can be shoved.
9. Fear of death. Christianity provides comfort in telling believers that they wont die after they die. Similarly, deceased loved ones are not really dead and gone, but are waiting for you by God's side. (provided of course, that you also believe)
Edit: corrected typo and added another point:
10. Fear of hell and eternal damnation. Accordiing to Christianity, non believers will go to hell. Hell isn't a place you want to be. The suffering there is.... intense to put it mildly; Residents there are subject to roasting by the everlasting fire, and the pain is so intense that there is much weeping and gnashing of teeth. Eternity is also a very very very long time. So long, that it defies time itself. Put togather, this creates a very fearsome prospect for an unbeliever. Consequently, some people opt to 'play it safe' and join 'em.
If you ask a fellow Buddhist to show you love, they will say to you: "Don't be clingy, don't blame others for not showing you love. Your greed for love will lead you to misery. If you want love, go practise loving-metta meditation." After saying that, they will most probably leave you alone to understand/contemplate with your own 'wisdom'.
If you ask a fellow Christian to show you love, they will say to you: "How can I make you feel better, how can I make you feel loved?" They will start by giving you a little hug, expressing their observations of you, listing out both good and bad points, but focuses on your good points. -
i have friends who join christianity because a girl they liked invited them to. many cases like this. which makes me feel very dots.
well anyway, there are many ppl who turn to buddhism later on in life when they meet with some problems in life. at that time, when shown some buddhist quotations of life, they will find it very very meaningful.
sorry i do not know how to say it well. i am a Buddhist since young. but it was when i started working in the society that i found many things of Buddhism very meaningful. sometimes, just reading one short quotation can make my heart feel very light and not so narrow anymore. and naturally, a lot of things i can put down and not hold on with frustration. life became clearer to me. i must say it was Buddhism which pulled me through when i was really down in the pits.
but anyway, any religion is good if it helps the individual any where in life ba? -
Well, I do not dispute the fact that there are ppl who turn to Buddhism later on life. But if it's from Christianity to Buddhism, and how many such people eventually do continue to stay on, I do not yet have the statistics to support my hypothesis. Will be doing research on that.Originally posted by applesweetgirl:i have friends who join christianity because a girl they liked invited them to. many cases like this. which makes me feel very dots.
well anyway, there are many ppl who turn to buddhism later on in life when they meet with some problems in life. at that time, when shown some buddhist quotations of life, they will find it very very meaningful.
sorry i do not know how to say it well. i am a Buddhist since young. but it was when i started working in the society that i found many things of Buddhism very meaningful. sometimes, just reading one short quotation can make my heart feel very light and not so narrow anymore. and naturally, a lot of things i can put down and not hold on with frustration. life became clearer to me. i must say it was Buddhism which pulled me through when i was really down in the pits.
but anyway, any religion is good if it helps the individual any where in life ba?
I'm glad to read that you are able to appreciate and follow Buddhist teachings since young. I'm also glad to know you have not changed your faith till now. Some of my current experiences so far about the conversion of some of my relatives, friends or acquaintances to Christianity, has given me lots of food for thought.
Indeed any religion is good if it helps the individual anywhere in life.
However, as a fellow Buddhist, I feel we should be more pro-active in letting more members of the public understand Buddhism as it really is. Since Buddhism is really beneficial to all, why wait for people to come to us? We can go to them.
Thanks for sharing with me.
All the best for your spiritual cultivation and your life ahead. Take care. -
Interesting answer.Originally posted by Gasfene:I would say, "dont ask stupid question. Who am i to speak for young people of today? STFU, go recite your sutras and dont disturb me. Pls ask permission if you want to chat with me next time." -
Originally posted by Beyond Religion:I can think of several reasons:
1. Christianity is seen as hip and trendy, whereas Buddhism (especially the brand of Buddhism portrayed by the joss-stick-buddhists-turned-Christian) is seen as old fashion and superstitious.
Christianity to many people is portrayed as a belief for the money-minded and superstitious. Buddhism on the other hand is portrayed as a religion which cannot accept the truth.
2. Christianity is seen as classy. Some Christians like to showcase the VIPs in their church, politicians, doctors and famous university professors etc. Many people like the networking relationship made available in these church gatherings.
Please don't tell me that there are no politicians and doctors and other famous professionals in other religions or are atheists. As I said there are many money-minded people in the Christian religion.
3. Spiritually, it is much easier being a Christian than a Buddhist. For the former, all you need to do is to pledge your allegiance to the Christian God, and whatever your past misdeeds will be forgiven. For Buddhists, you have to really work hard to atone for your past negative actions, and even then the negative karma arising from these misdeeds will not be 'forgiven', merely reduced in severity.
Spiritually, I know Buddhists like to talk nonsense without finding out facts. Christianity is about forgiveness and damnation. If you don't sincerely repent from your sins and accept Christ in XRtianity, then you will surely be damned to eternity in hell even if you accept Christ. Note the word "repent".
4. There is a 'feel good' element knowing that a supposedly almighty being is watching over you. Provides a spiritual 'crutch' to the spiritually handicapped.
If no one knows why, the simple reason being the songs used in their worship is of a 4 by 4 beat which is also the Voodoo beat. This beat is commonly used as it is very attractive to the human ear and allows a person to assume trance easily(slained by the Holy Ghost for the happy clappers).
5. Aggressive evangelizing. Christianity is a proselytizing religion. They make an art out of defending their faith (Apologetics) and spreading their religion.
Irreligionist also make an art of bashing any and every religion they come across, so what's the difference? Duh...
6. Emotional elements knowing that Jesus has taken the brunt of our "sins" and died for us on the cross. Many people, especially ladies, will be 'touched' into believing.
Most people know that Jesus Christ is just a target practice for spear throwing.
7. Remnants of colonial mentality. Christianity is the dominant religion of the west. We were once a British colony. Although we have gained independance for more than 4 decades now, there is still some leftover colonial mentality whereby we think the west is good. We emulate the west, adopting western names and lifestyles, learning English (to the detriment of our own mother tongue etc etc, all under the guise of being cosmopolitan). Naturally we will want to also adopt the religion that is dominant in the west.
If you don't know, the number of atheists and irreligionists in this world is increasing exponentially.
8. Christianity provides a convenient pidgeon hole into which all things unexplained, and all unfulfilled wishes etc. can be shoved.
Isn't that true for all religions?
9. Fear of death. Christianity provides comfort in telling believers that they wont die after they die. Similarly, deceased loved ones are not really dead and gone, but are waiting for you by God's side. (provided of course, that you also believe)
Everyone wants hope mah, even you Buddhists also believe in hope and rebirth.
Edit: corrected typo and added another point:
10. Fear of hell and eternal damnation. Accordiing to Christianity, non believers will go to hell. Hell isn't a place you want to be. The suffering there is.... intense to put it mildly; Residents there are subject to roasting by the everlasting fire, and the pain is so intense that there is much weeping and gnashing of teeth. Eternity is also a very very very long time. So long, that it defies time itself. Put togather, this creates a very fearsome prospect for an unbeliever. Consequently, some people opt to 'play it safe' and join 'em.
Read up Pascal's wager and hope and you'll know why. -
Christianity to many people is portrayed as a belief for the money-minded and superstitious. Buddhism on the other hand is portrayed as a religion which cannot accept the truth.
Wrong.Everyone wants hope mah, even you Buddhists also believe in hope and rebirth.
Buddhists do NOT find comfort and hope in samsaric rebirth. -
youth church mah... reaching out to the youth.. went there before.. the kong guy dam furni!Originally posted by bohiruci:well , if i were to answer
its simple
i found young ppl like simplicity , they found buddhism like an "ah ma ah gong " religion and
the temple is often stuffy and reek of insense
well ,thats when they never step into Buddhist library ,Phor Kark See or other air-conditioned temple
then they like companionship ,like their classmate in the same cell group and fellowship
next , some do like a "live concert " religion
visited City Harvest Church Services before and feel this isnt the kind of services i want .... -
Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:
read the bible!
[b][/b] -
If you do not comfort and hope in samsaric rebirth than how do you cultivate your practice in life?Originally posted by An Eternal Now:Buddhists do NOT find comfort and hope in samsaric rebirth. -
I don't see any contradictions.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:If you do not comfort and hope in samsaric rebirth than how do you cultivate your practice in life?
BTW, Samsara is literally known as the "world of suffering" so how can we find comfort and hope? -
simple fact that everyone by nature do not like to work for his fruits, it's all granted by god
honey, i just screwed around with another girl, the devil made me do it!