Samsara is also not place.. this is not a typo error. You will not understand this until non-duality is experienced.
'Hereness', 'distance' and time are just impressions. They give the 'illusionary' impression of places. This also explains the nature of 'supernatural power' like clairvoyance and seeing things far away, etc.
As i said before, you already have a fixed view of things. We will just leave it as that. :)
http://timesendproductions.com/Buddhism.html
“Based on the Tibetan terms 'lus' (that which is left behind, ordinary body) and 'ja' (rainbow, rainbow hue), the Rainbow Body …is not so much a "body" but
rather a vortex of energy into which certain adepts can apparently
transform themselves on dying. Rather than leaving a corpse behind that
needs to be cremated or chopped to pieces, highly accomplished men and
women rather pass away in a mass of rainbow light. To use a Tibetan
phrase, they "dissolve into space like a rainbow"; a process which -
curiously enough - is reported as leaving the practitioners hair and
nails behind as physical remnants.
http://www.surajamrita.com/bon/buddhahood.html
Indeed Thodgal does possess a method for dissolving the impure physical body at the time of death or even before and then the Rainbow Body of Light manifests. But this is not a process of transforming an impure physical body into a pure Sambhogakaya. The method Proper to Dzogchen is not the path of transformation as is the case with the Tantras but the path of self liberation. So the procedure in Tantra and in Thodgal is quite different. To effect a transformation in vision and in energy Tantra employs visualization in terms of Kyerim and Dzogrim practice. We visualize ourselves in a Sambhogakaya form whether this be a peaceful or a wrathful manifestation. But in Dzogchen there is nothing to be visualized and nothing to be transformed. The visions which arise during the course of Thodgal are not visualizations. Visualization represents the work of the mind; visualizations are created by the mind. But Dzogchen is a state beyond the mind. So these visions which arise in Thodgal are not created by the mind or by unconscious karma but they are a manifestation of what is already primordially present in the Natural State. The vision is not something created by causes but it is Lhundrub (Ihun grub) or spontaneously perfected. Since the Sambhogakaya is already fully inherent in the Natural State it simply manifests. Dzogchen alone discloses our real nature; Dzogchen has already discovered this inherent Buddhahood our real nature and so it can manifest the Sambhogakaya effortlessly. At the culmination of the Thodgal process at the stage of vision called the exhausting of everything into Reality (bon nyid zad pa) all of the visions that the practitioner experiences whether pure or impure dissolve into the Natural State. This includes our physical body which is the result of past karmic causes and represents our impure karmic vision. For the practitioner everything dissolves. This sets the stage for the spontaneous manifestation of the Sambhogakaya which has been present in potential in the Natural State from the very beginning. Since it is already there no primary cause for its manifestation is needed. [The secondary causes for its manifestation however are the purifications of obscurations along the path. This is like the winds removing the clouds from the sky so that the face of the sun becomes visible or like opening the doors to the temple so that the image of the Buddha can clearly be seen].
If we examine the notion of Buddhahood from the logical standpoint we find that the Nirmanakaya and the Sambhogakaya are impermanent whereas the Dharmakaya alone is permanent. But when we further examine the Dhan-nakaya we discover that there are two sides to it. On the side of emptiness it is permanent but on the side of wisdom it is impermanent. The Kunzhi the basis of everything is permanent because it is emptiness but Rigpa is impermanent because it is not always manifest. These two Kunzhi and Rigpa are always inseparable (dbyer med) in the Natural State. On the side of emptiness (stong cha) there is permanence but on the side of clarity (gsal-cha) or awareness (rig-cha) there is impermanence. So the manifestation side is impermanent; it is changing all of the time whereas the emptiness side is constant and permanent. We can logically distinguish these things when we speak about the Natural State but the Natural State is a totality and a perfect unity. Within it emptiness and clarity are inseparable and never otherwise. This inseparability or Yermed (dbyer med) is the essence of Dzogchen. To fall either on the side of emptiness or on the side of manifestation is to deviate from Dzogchen.
.
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This lalu or Rainbow Body can appear in a material sense to sentient beings in order to teach them. The Rainbow Body is not material but appears to be so since it can act on all of the senses of a sentient being simultaneously. The Sambhogakaya can be perceived only by the Aryas the Boddhisattvas who have ascended the third, fourth, or fifth paths [that is the Paths of Vision of Meditation Development and Culmination]. They can hear the teachings of the Sambhogakaya whereas ordinary beings cannot see nor hear this manifestation. So it is the Nirmanakaya that they hear and perceive. To human beings this Nirmanakaya appears as human. In other worlds and with other species of beings the situation will be different. But the Rainbow Body as the potentiality of the Natural State is not limited to any particular form. It can appear in a myriad of different forms. The Natural State has been with us from the very beginning. We have done nothing more than to rediscover it continue in it and allow its potentiality to manifest. That is Buddhahood.
.
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E-Sangha:
Rainbow body is the result of total realization of dharmakaya.
Rainbow
body is a realization of the nature of the union of appearances and
emptiness with the added factor of the total realization that all
phenomena are nothing other than the display of one's own wisdom. In
this case, issues of permanent and impermanent are not longer germaine.
One's realization is permanent, diverse and changing appearances are
all ornaments to that realization. One's physical body vanishes in the
perception of ordinary beings.
.
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Rainbow body is a realization, not a physical process-- but to the deluded, it seems like something physical is happening.
.
This is sort of a misconception (not your fault). When we said 'od
kyi lus, body of light, we mean actually a body which is composed of
the energy of the wisdom of rigpa.
Well, everything, the five
elements already is the energy of the wisdom of rigpa [rig pa'i ye shes
gyi rtsal]. So, actually, a so called rainbow body is merely the
reversion of the bodies elements back into the state of wisdom. There
is actually no transformation at all.
Originally posted by sofital:If you don’t believe what I said, you can ask Theravaddin master or teacher about rainbow body for clarification.
Theravadin does not have the method to realise rainnbow body, hence there is no point asking a Theravadin master about this. They probably will not know what it is and if they think they know what it is, they are mistaken. Hence we should not judge a particular teaching based on other perspectives or misunderstandings.
Originally posted by longchen:
Samsara is also not place.. this is not a typo error. You will not understand this until non-duality is experienced.
'Hereness', 'distance' and time are just impressions. They give the 'illusionary' impression of places. This also explains the nature of 'supernatural power' like clairvoyance and seeing things far away, etc.
As i said before, you already have a fixed view of things. We will just leave it as that. :)
Originally posted by sofital:
In prevoius topics. I mentioned the naming convention to Eternal Now.' Hereness', 'distance' and 'time' are naming convention.We use it for understanding among us. I think Samara is places. As Samara is places , Buddhas taught us 31 planes of existences.
Hi Friend,
Just my understanding only. For discussion sake. Also, I find this topic very interesting.
What appears to us are registered by all the sense organs. The eye sight sees some thing, the ears hear something, etc ,etc. There are not happening in some place. They are the arising of certain conditions.
To illustrate that what we experience is not standardised, we know that human beings see in term of colour range. Some animals are colour-blind. so they see differently. But none of us, is seeing the truth nature directly. The senses of different species of sentient beings experience things differently.
Likewise, the 31 planes of existence are due to different conditions arising. In the jhana meditation, one is said to be able to access these planes of existence. This is because they are not specific locations. They are mental states. In the jhanas, our consciousness changes and 'aligned' more with these other states or planes of existence.
All the planes of existence are simultaneously manifesting, but because our senses are human-based conditioned arisings, we only see the human world and other beings that shared 'similar' resonating arising conditions. But nevertheless, the other planes of existences are not elsewhere in some other places.
What we think of as places are really just consciousness. .. no solidity whatsoever. Even our touch sense is just that. It gives an impression of feeling something 3D with textures and so on so forth. But there is no solid self-existing object there... it is simply the sensation that gives the impression of solidity.
Originally posted by sofital:Right. Buddhas teach us no self. Ananda get the first Enlightenment from mirror Dhamma that is related to teaching of no self.
No self is the foundation for the first Enlighenment. If we have a self , we cannot achieve the goal.
thus heard, Ananda at first could not enter the First council, as he had not attain arahanthood. so he keep trying and trying and keep meditating and meditating; seeking and seeking very hard, but of no use. eventually, Ananda stop trying. the moment he stop trying, Ananda attained Arahanthood!
/\
Ajahn Chah (with Ajahn Liam)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qu7mtlbVBOA
"shouldn't be concern with Nibanna or attaining Nibanna. if you are, then that itself is preventing you from attaining Nibanna. So what's the main comcern of the monk? The aim is to let go. So you have to let go without striving to let go. let go without desire. if there's still desire and persude to do that, then that's not nibanna."
Be mindful and let things take their natural cause, then your mind will be still like clear forest pool. all kinds of rare animals will come and drink at the pool. you will see many things come and go, and you will be still. Problems will arise, but you will see through them Immediately. This is the happiness of the Buddha!"
Ajahn Chah on Trying too Hard
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqyENJk0Bkg&feature=related
/\
Originally posted by longchen:Hi Friend,
Just my understanding only. For discussion sake. Also, I find this topic very interesting.
What appears to us are registered by all the sense organs. The eye sight sees some thing, the ears hear something, etc ,etc. There are not happening in some place. They are the arising of certain conditions.
To illustrate that what we experience is not standardised, we know that human beings see in term of colour range. Some animals are colour-blind. so they see differently. But none of us, is seeing the truth nature directly. The senses of different species of sentient beings experience things differently.
Likewise, the 31 planes of existence are due to different conditions arising. In the jhana meditation, one is said to be able to access these planes of existence. This is because they are not specific locations. They are mental states. In the jhanas, our consciousness changes and 'aligned' more with these other states or planes of existence.
All the planes of existence are simultaneously manifesting, but because our senses are human-based conditioned arisings, we only see the human world and other beings that shared 'similar' resonating arising conditions. But nevertheless, the other planes of existences are not elsewhere in some other places.
What we think of as places are really just consciousness. .. no solidity whatsoever. Even our touch sense is just that. It gives an impression of feeling something 3D with textures and so on so forth. But there is no solid self-existing object there... it is simply the sensation that gives the impression of solidity.
Well said! :)
There is no 'the state'. Simply empty luminousity manifesting according to whatever conditions are. No here, no now, no 'I', no mine, no inner, no outer, no coming, no going anywhere. All these are merely 'impressions'.
Free from all inherent and dualistic views. Mere empty manifestation alone is. Fearlessly and openingly give up, drop and let go....
Originally posted by sinweiy:
thus heard, Ananda at first could not enter the First council, as he had not attain arahanthood. so he keep trying and trying and keep meditating and meditating; seeking and seeking very hard, but of no use. eventually, Ananda stop trying. the moment he stop trying, Ananda attained Arahanthood!/\
Originally posted by longchen:Hi Friend,
Just my understanding only. For discussion sake. Also, I find this topic very interesting.
What appears to us are registered by all the sense organs. The eye sight sees some thing, the ears hear something, etc ,etc. There are not happening in some place. They are the arising of certain conditions.
To illustrate that what we experience is not standardised, we know that human beings see in term of colour range. Some animals are colour-blind. so they see differently. But none of us, is seeing the truth nature directly. The senses of different species of sentient beings experience things differently.
Likewise, the 31 planes of existence are due to different conditions arising. In the jhana meditation, one is said to be able to access these planes of existence. This is because they are not specific locations. They are mental states. In the jhanas, our consciousness changes and 'aligned' more with these other states or planes of existence.
All the planes of existence are simultaneously manifesting, but because our senses are human-based conditioned arisings, we only see the human world and other beings that shared 'similar' resonating arising conditions. But nevertheless, the other planes of existences are not elsewhere in some other places.
What we think of as places are really just consciousness. .. no solidity whatsoever. Even our touch sense is just that. It gives an impression of feeling something 3D with textures and so on so forth. But there is no solid self-existing object there... it is simply the sensation that gives the impression of solidity.
Originally posted by Thusness:Well said! :)
There is no 'the state'. Simply empty luminousity manifesting according to whatever conditions are. No here, no now, no 'I', no mine, no inner, no outer, no coming, no going anywhere. All these are merely 'impressions'.
Free from all inherent and dualistic views. Mere empty manifestation alone is. Fearlessly and openingly give up, drop and let go....
Originally posted by longchen:Hi Friend,
Just my understanding only. For discussion sake. Also, I find this topic very interesting.
What appears to us are registered by all the sense organs. The eye sight sees some thing, the ears hear something, etc ,etc. There are not happening in some place. They are the arising of certain conditions.
To illustrate that what we experience is not standardised, we know that human beings see in term of colour range. Some animals are colour-blind. so they see differently. But none of us, is seeing the truth nature directly. The senses of different species of sentient beings experience things differently.
Likewise, the 31 planes of existence are due to different conditions arising. In the jhana meditation, one is said to be able to access these planes of existence. This is because they are not specific locations. They are mental states. In the jhanas, our consciousness changes and 'aligned' more with these other states or planes of existence.
All the planes of existence are simultaneously manifesting, but because our senses are human-based conditioned arisings, we only see the human world and other beings that shared 'similar' resonating arising conditions. But nevertheless, the other planes of existences are not elsewhere in some other places.
What we think of as places are really just consciousness. .. no solidity whatsoever. Even our touch sense is just that. It gives an impression of feeling something 3D with textures and so on so forth. But there is no solid self-existing object there... it is simply the sensation that gives the impression of solidity.
Hi Longchen,
I can see the synchronization of emptiness view into your non-dual experiences --. Integrating view, practice and experience. This is the essence of our emptiness nature and right understanding of non-dual experience in Buddhism that is different from Advaita Vedanta teaching. This is also the understanding of why Everything is the One Reality incorporating causes, conditions and luminosity of our Empty nature as One and inseparable. Everything as the One Reality should never be understood from a dualistic/inherent standpoint.
This also explains the nature of 'supernatural power' like clairvoyance and seeing things far away, etc.
Indeed! You can see the how the view, practice and experience leading to the understanding of non-locality in terms of views, practices and experience.
Stage 6. The nature of Presence is Empty
Not only is there no ‘who’ in pristine awareness, there is no ‘where’ and ‘when’. This is its nature.
When there is this, that is.
With the arising of this, that arises.
When this is not, neither is that.
With the cessation of this, that ceases.
-- the principle of conditionality
The self-luminous awareness from beginning-less time has never been separated and cannot be separated from its conditions. They are not two -- This is, That is. Along with the conditions, Luminosity shines without a center and arises without a place. No where to be found. This is the emptiness nature of Presence.
Originally posted by Thusness:
Hi Longchen,I can see the synchronization of emptiness view into your non-dual experiences --. Integrating view, practice and experience. This is the essence of our emptiness nature and right understanding of non-dual experience in Buddhism that is different from Advaita Vedanta teaching. This is also the understanding of why Everything is the One Reality incorporating causes, conditions and luminosity of our Empty nature as One and inseparable. Everything as the One Reality should never be understood from a dualistic/inherent standpoint.
Indeed! You can see the how the view, practice and experience leading to the understanding of non-locality in terms of views, practices and experience.
Stage 6. The nature of Presence is Empty
Not only is there no ‘who’ in pristine awareness, there is no ‘where’ and ‘when’. This is its nature.
When there is this, that is.
With the arising of this, that arises.
When this is not, neither is that.
With the cessation of this, that ceases.-- the principle of conditionality
The self-luminous awareness from beginning-less time has never been separated and cannot be separated from its conditions. They are not two -- This is, That is. Along with the conditions, Luminosity shines without a center and arises without a place. No where to be found. This is the emptiness nature of Presence.
Hi Thusness,
Thanks for this post.
To me, the 'emptiness' aspect was the hardest for the mind to be 'convinced'. It was too different/far-away from how the dualistic mind understood things.
But after a while, this truth becomes more clear.
regards
Originally posted by sofital:For me, I prefer to read the original version of Buddha scripture defined by First Buddha Council.Any new words, methods and rules that are not inside in origianl Buddha scripture is rejected.From history of Buddhism, after holding of first Buddha council, The monk original group is divided into two major groups( Theravadda and Mahayana).Now there are so many major buddhism groups due to that some monks want to add ,edit or modify the original version of Buddha scripture.For those who want to add,edit or modify Buddha scirpture form new major Buddhism group.They lost the essence of Dhamma.In this world, as some peope has less knowledge in history of Buddhism, they are easily to be persuaded by new formed buddhism group.
Let's put aside whether all the mahayana translated scripture was discussed in the first buddha council. But if we are to reject all the new words that comes after it, then we cannot read or buy buddhism book anymore, as I am sure more than 99% of the modern buddhism book are written by buddhists.