Originally posted by An Eternal Now:And what do you mean by 'more than just intellectual texts'. What do you mean by experienced? Gaining powers?
The only 'experience' that truly matters in Buddhism, is to realise one's true nature. That is the only experience worth having, and it is not an experience, but an experiential Recognition of what is already always the case. This recognition is nothing close to intellectual, it cannot be accessed by thinking about it.
Anything else is a detour, a distraction, and leads away from enlightenment. Anything else is just more mundane, transient experiences that comes and goes, that becomes the cause of rebirth and sufferings if we are attracted to or attached to or identified with. That is why Buddhists must 'kill the Buddha when they see the Buddha'. All such visions and states are delusional and comes from maras and demons.
Anyway do read this and contemplate on this to realise this in your experience: Some Writings on Non-duality by Ken Wilber
And honestly speaking, I find that most channeled information has very confused understanding about our true nature and does not even lead people in that direction (the only exception we've found so far being Aaron, who is deceased and his last life was a 15th century Thai meditation master, and clearly knows and experiences what he's talking about. most other channelers/channeled beings have very dualistic knowledge and clearly doesnt know their true nature). It goes right off course the path of enlightenment. These channeled information comes from spirits, but are these spirits enlightened? Definitely no (for most I've seen).
Yes, Aaron is the only Being who channel teachings that is very helpful and useful. For that I am grateful. As a meditator and practitioner myself, I can deeply resonate with Aaron's word.
Additionally, his channeled teachings also gave me added confidence in Buddhism. This is because the last life where he gain Enlightenment and become an Arhat was through following the Buddhist Path. His last life was as a Meditation Master of the Theravada Tradition.
BUT, do notice something here. He did not gain Enlightenment by listening to channelled messages. He gained Enlightenment by following a strict Buddhist Path of cultivation.
Originally posted by Fantagf:
You gotta understand, nothing is perfect, be it when you are alive or dead.
Based on that premise, forever, one will have doubts and fear, and that will never reduce, no matter how much one learns. Then what have we truly learnt?
When one is on the right track, things will feel just right, and at equilibrium, at balance. Knowing how to clear obstacles in your path will come naturally to you, as you'll just know what to do, from all that you've learnt. If fear and doubts still keep setting in, then one should probe further into the questions that truly bother him/her and seek the answers that can permanently resolve these doubts. If that can be achieved, the lesson can then finally be said to have been learnt.
Just my view. :)
Originally posted by Beautiful951:
This is really rather scary. But what do we do if we have to beware of them?May I also ask, what harm can they do to us?
Master Chin Kung explained very clearly in the video, so do take a few minutes to watch.
But in short: you must ignore them. Otherwise, they will torture you because they are actually going to take revenge for something you did to them in a past life.
Originally posted by Rainbow Jigsaw:
my personal view, which may not be shared by others in this forum:if one is on the right path, there's absolutely nothing to fear, at any time, whether alive or dying. all that should happen to us for our highest good should happen at the right time, as we'll naturally know what to do.
Usually these spirits come from many lifes ago.
Many people encountered spirits who take revenge on them, not because they were evil while they were alive, but they offended them in a past life which they cannot remember now.
And this has been the experience of many people, so I know it is definitely true. Even my dharma teacher has once encountered such spirits who look like a Tang dynasty warrior with a long sword trying to harm him because he used to be some warrior lifetimes ago and killed some people, but because of his level of practice and insight the ghost failed to harm him.
Originally posted by longchen:Yes, Aaron is the only Being who channel teachings that is very helpful and useful. For that I am grateful. As a meditator and practitioner myself, I can deeply resonate with Aaron's word.
Additionally, his channeled teachings also gave me added confidence in Buddhism. This is because the last life where he gain Enlightenment and become an Arhat was through following the Buddhist Path. His last life was as a Meditation Master of the Theravada Tradition.
BUT, do notice something here. He did not gain Enlightenment by listening to channelled messages. He gained Enlightenment by following a strict Buddhist Path of cultivation.
Yes very true... thanks for mentioning that!
Originally posted by Aloozer:
even if they had been our real relatives, we are also not to follow them what? cos they themselves are ghosts/spirits?
You are perfectly right.
In Buddhism, we musn't attach to relatives and so on.
Know that relatives have already taken rebirth in another realm. If they appear to you, something is wrong. Either someone else is manifesting and pretending to be your relatives with evil intentions, or the relative has fallen into the lower realm of ghosts. Do not follow them in either case.
Originally posted by Dawnfirstlight:Yes, I agree with you. What you said was exactly what the monks told us. If one recites Amitabha, at one's deathbed, one sees Amitabha, Guanyin or Dashizhi or three coming, one can follow them. However, if one sees other Buddhas, we also have to respect them (regardless real or not) and tell them we cannot follow them because we only want to follow Amitabha, Guanyin or Dashizhi.
is it? i have not seen the video, can't see in office. it's blocked. but i think i heard MCK said before.
ya. as they said 礼敬诸佛， 称赞如æ�¥ã€‚we can First, Pay homage and respect to all Buddha’s (including an ant is also a Buddha, Mara and all beings also have Buddhanature ). Second, Praise all the Buddha’s tathagatagarbha. Praise can only Praise the tathagatagarbha, the inner pureness or "goodness"; can't Praise mara or an ant etc that are not enlightened.
there's a story in the record of purelanders achieving pureland, where this practix who practice very well, first saw Guanyin coming with a silver lotus "seat", but he refuse to go, thinking he should work harden to see Amitabha instead. Indeed, Amitabha arived with a GOLDen lotus "seat".
for me, i'd have go humbly with Guanyin. :) Guanyin is also good here.
/\
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:Master Chin Kung explained very clearly in the video, so do take a few minutes to watch.
But in short: you must ignore them. Otherwise, they will torture you because they are actually going to take revenge for something you did to them in a past life.
I did watch it but reading chinese is not one of my strong points.
If it is fine with you, is it possible to briefly describe some encounters or something like that?
Also, you mentioned about some kind of practise and insight. Did you mean insight into the other world?
Thanks
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:You are perfectly right.
In Buddhism, we musn't attach to relatives and so on.
Know that relatives have already taken rebirth in another realm. If they appear to you, something is wrong. Either someone else is manifesting and pretending to be your relatives with evil intentions, or the relative has fallen into the lower realm of ghosts. Do not follow them in either case.
what happens during the death process? or what happens in the 'bardo'?
if we don't 'follow' these spirits/ghosts, then what do we do when we're in the bardo? hope we don't get stuck there or something not knowing what to do or where to go.
Originally posted by Aloozer:
what happens during the death process? or what happens in the 'bardo'?if we don't 'follow' these spirits/ghosts, then what do we do when we're in the bardo? hope we don't get stuck there or something not knowing what to do or where to go.
Regarding the bardo process, see http://www.near-death.com/experiences/buddhism01.html and The intermediate state after death
When in Bardo, you can chant Amitabha Buddha and seek rebirth in pure land.
If you know how to recognise your primordial essence or the Clear Light of Reality, your ever present awareness, just abide in that recognition and be liberated.
You have to practice that in your life otherwise it is very difficult to do that when you're dead.
One evening Paltrül Rinpoche taught the daughter of Chokgyur
Lingpa, Könchok Paldrön, who was to become my grandmother.
She
remembered his words very clearly, and later repeated them to me.
She
imitated Paltrül Rinpoche’s thick Golok accent, and said, “Don’t
entertain
thoughts about what has passed, don’t anticipate or plan what will
happen
in the future. Leave your present wakefulness unaltered, utterly
free and
open. Aside from that, there is nothing else whatsoever to do!”
What he
meant was, don’t sit and think about what has happened in the past,
and
don’t speculate on what will appear in the future, or even a few
moments
from now. Leave your present wakefulness, which is the buddha
nature of
self-existing wakefulness, totally unmodified. Do not try to
correct or alter
anything. Leave it free, as it naturally is, free and wide-open
like space.
There is nothing more to do besides that. These are the vajra words
of
Paltrül Rinpoche, and they are truly meaningful.
~ Tulku Urgyen Rinpoche, Bardo
Originally posted by Beautiful951:
I did watch it but reading chinese is not one of my strong points.
If it is fine with you, is it possible to briefly describe some encounters or something like that?
Also, you mentioned about some kind of practise and insight. Did you mean insight into the other world?
Thanks
When I talk about Insight, I am saying the insight into the nature of mind and reality. Insight into your true primordial essence. Resting in meditation, my teacher saw a spirit in Tang dynasty costume taking a very long sword and slashed him. Because of his samadhi and wisdom, the slashing could not harm him, and after he rose out of meditation the only difference he could see is a bit of swelling on his neck, resembling the slash he got from the spirit.
It also reminded me of Shariputra, resting in Vajra (diamond) Samadhi, could not be harmed by a powerful spirit trying to kill him.
I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was staying in Rajagaha at the Bamboo Grove, the Squirrels' Sanctuary. Now at that time Ven. Sariputta and Ven. Maha Moggallana were staying in Pigeon Cave. Then, on a moonlit night, Ven. Sariputta -- his head newly shaven -- was sitting in the open air, having attained a certain level of concentration.
It so happened that two yakkhas who were companions were flying from north to south on some business or other. They saw Ven. Sariputta -- his head newly shaven -- sitting in the open air. Seeing him, the first yakkha said to the second, "I'm inspired to give this contemplative a blow on the head."
When this was said, the second yakkha said to the first, "Enough of that, my good friend. Don't lay a hand on the contemplative. He's an outstanding contemplative, of great power and great might."
A second time, the first yakkha said to the second, "I'm inspired to give this contemplative a blow on the head."
A second time, the second yakkha said to the first, "Enough of that, my good friend. Don't lay a hand on the contemplative. He's an outstanding contemplative, of great power and great might."
A third time, the first yakkha said to the second, "I'm inspired to give this contemplative a blow on the head."
A third time, the second yakkha said to the first, "Enough of that, my good friend. Don't lay a hand on the contemplative. He's an outstanding contemplative, of great power and great might."
Then the first yakkha, ignoring the second yakkha, gave Ven. Sariputta a blow on the head. And with that blow he might have knocked over an elephant seven or eight cubits tall, or split a rocky crag. But right there the yakkha -- yelling, "I'm burning!" -- fell into the Great Hell.
Now, Ven. Moggallana -- with his divine eye, pure and surpassing the human -- saw the yakkha give Ven. Sariputta a blow on the head. Seeing this, he went to Ven. Sariputta and, on arrival, said to him, "I hope you are well, friend Sariputta. I hope you are comfortable. I hope you are feeling no pain."
"I am well, friend Moggallana. I am comfortable. But I do have a slight headache."
"How amazing, friend Sariputta! How awesome! How great your power and might! Just now a yakkha gave you a blow on the head. So great was that blow that he might have knocked over an elephant seven or eight cubits tall, or split a rocky crag. But all you say is this: 'I am well, friend Moggallana. I am comfortable. But I do have a slight headache'!"
"How amazing, friend Moggallana! How awesome! How great your power and might! Where you saw a yakkha just now, I didn't even see a dust devil!"
The Blessed One -- with his divine ear, pure and surpassing the human -- heard those two great beings speak in praise of one another in this way. Then, on realizing the significance of that, the Blessed One on that occasion exclaimed:
Whose mind is like rock,
steady,
unmoved,
dispassionate for things that spark passion,
unangered by things that spark anger:
When one's mind is developed like this,
from where can there come
suffering & stress?
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:Regarding the bardo process, see http://www.near-death.com/experiences/buddhism01.html and The intermediate state after death
When in Bardo, you can chant Amitabha Buddha and seek rebirth in pure land.
If you know how to recognise your primordial essence or the Clear Light of Reality, your ever present awareness, just abide in that recognition and be liberated.
You have to practice that in your life otherwise it is very difficult to do that when you're dead.
One evening Paltrül Rinpoche taught the daughter of Chokgyur
Lingpa, Könchok Paldrön, who was to become my grandmother. She
remembered his words very clearly, and later repeated them to me. She
imitated Paltrül Rinpoche’s thick Golok accent, and said, “Don’t entertain
thoughts about what has passed, don’t anticipate or plan what will happen
in the future. Leave your present wakefulness unaltered, utterly free and
open. Aside from that, there is nothing else whatsoever to do!” What he
meant was, don’t sit and think about what has happened in the past, and
don’t speculate on what will appear in the future, or even a few moments
from now. Leave your present wakefulness, which is the buddha nature of
self-existing wakefulness, totally unmodified. Do not try to correct or alter
anything. Leave it free, as it naturally is, free and wide-open like space.
There is nothing more to do besides that. These are the vajra words of
Paltrül Rinpoche, and they are truly meaningful.~ Tulku Urgyen Rinpoche, Bardo
what is clear light of reality? When does this happen?
Originally posted by Fantagf:
what is clear light of reality? When does this happen?
(1) The Chikai Bardo (or hChi-kha Bar-do - a number of Tibetan letters are silent) or Intermediate period of the moment of death. This includes the process of dying; and the dissolution of the elements (earth, water, fire, and air) that make up the physical body. During this period one experiences the "Clear Light", one's own innate Buddha-nature. This is therefore a very favourable moment for the attainment of Enlightenment and liberation from the wheel of rebirth.
Ok, in lay man terms it means this:
Usually in our ordinary lives, our attention is totally fixated and focused on our thoughts and feelings that we are totally identified with them. We think that we are just our thoughts and feelings, and we are totally attached to them.
But at the time of death, the gross elements, the thoughts, feelings, everything that we usually experience dissolves. This is where we can discover we are not just mere thoughts and feelings. We discover we are more than just our body or our mind.
In that moment, there is a gap of no-thing, but it is not nothing, it is actually an all-pervading, infinite Presence and Awareness... that is the innate fundamental essence of each being. At this point, if we recognise that this is what our true nature is, then we can abide in that recognition.
Most people don't even notice it, because if they never practiced in their daily lives, this short moment or gap where the Clear Light of reality dawns, just pass by without them even noticing it, as they transition into the next phase of the bardo.
However trained practitioners immediately recognise the Clear Light for what it is. In their daily lives, they do not get fixated on the finite thoughts and feelings, but are aware of/aware AS that infinite, sky-like, open spacious awareness where thoughts and feelings simply float by without being grasped on. The thoughts and feelings are not separate from Awareness but are actually itself the self-luminous expression of Awareness.
If you can abide in that recognition even in daily lives, then in death, no problem.
However, what I just described is just one aspect, the relative aspect of Mind. There are deeper aspects that I have not discussed here, for more info see Happiness, Karma and Mind by Dalai Lama
Originally posted by Larryteo:Yeah it's chemicals in the brain. As I said, all religions are false.
yes, they are all false because they take the form of a concept labeled as "religion". human beings in this realm need all types of "forms" and "concepts" in order to feel comfortable with their experiences, to make things meaningful to them, this crave is the source of all sufferings
the only thing that would liberate us from sufferings is to treat everything as just is, removed from reacting either positively or negatively to it. It is just is - they happen and unhappen due to circumstances falling into place at the right moment
next time your stock price goes down, you celebrate it with the same degree as if it went up, only then you embark on the path of total liberation
this life or next life? I smell fear and anxiety. another crave of the human weakness. does it matter if you dont validate it for yourself?
Originally posted by Larryteo:Because my parents had sex.
precisely. it happened when circumstances fell into place. assigning a meaningfulness to your life is pure arrogance. rather, it is how meaningful you want to make it given your parents had sex
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:You are perfectly right.
In Buddhism, we musn't attach to relatives and so on.
Know that relatives have already taken rebirth in another realm. If they appear to you, something is wrong. Either someone else is manifesting and pretending to be your relatives with evil intentions, or the relative has fallen into the lower realm of ghosts. Do not follow them in either case.
Hi EN,
Sorry to side track...I heard that when one die, his soul will leave his/her body.
And he/she can see himself on the bed with children crying etc...
Then there will be some spirit (be it a evil or god) in a form of his/her relatives (or maybe his late father or mother), and not them, there will be others wanting to take his hand. He will be confused (due to his children crying) and see so many spirits (good and bad). If he do many good things in his life, the god will take his hand and bring him to another world.
If he do many bad things, the evil will take his hand and bring him to hell.
That is what I heard from old pple saying.
How true is that?
Thanks alot.
Buddhism actually has no scientific evidence to backup its ambiguos claims of reincarnation or whatever, it is mainly a false religion concentrating on a man who does not even know about science.
Originally posted by Larryteo:Buddhism actually has no scientific evidence to backup its ambiguos claims of reincarnation or whatever, it is mainly a false religion concentrating on a man who does not even know about science.
oh, yeah, that is your personal distorted way of thinking.
If you think this way, Christianity is worse.
Of course christianity is worser. It is so shitty that I gave up on it. Too many loopholes inside.
Originally posted by Larryteo:Of course christianity is worser. It is so shitty that I gave up on it. Too many loopholes inside.
Larry, since you gave up for reason same as mine. Just be open and give other religions a chance. At least, I encounter so many more good buddhists than christians.
Christianity is worst of all not worser. Basically the problem with it is it preaches grace and ignores good deeds to mankind. So through grace they are saved and so not on good deeds they are saved. Crap. That is why so many evil christians around.
Originally posted by sinweiy:and if a person recite Amitabha most of the time and sometime Guan yin, then the 本尊 should be Amitabha. He/she should see Amitabha coming and/or Guanyin and Dashizhi by the side. if he/she see Shakyamuni or other Buddha, then somthing is wrong. It's good to see all three coming.
to add, i read Ajaan Mun bio that he saw Shakyamuni too, since he's more into the thai tradition.
The Contemplation of Amida Buddha sutra also stated that this grade of people see the original Shakyamuni.
/\
Originally posted by Larryteo:Buddhism actually has no scientific evidence to backup its ambiguos claims of reincarnation or whatever, it is mainly a false religion concentrating on a man who does not even know about science.
Told you, and showed you, how scientific evidence supports rebirth. But you obviously aren't listening.
I suggest you do some research on your own before commenting further.
Originally posted by likeyou:
Hi EN,
Sorry to side track...I heard that when one die, his soul will leave his/her body.
And he/she can see himself on the bed with children crying etc...
Then there will be some spirit (be it a evil or god) in a form of his/her relatives (or maybe his late father or mother), and not them, there will be others wanting to take his hand. He will be confused (due to his children crying) and see so many spirits (good and bad). If he do many good things in his life, the god will take his hand and bring him to another world.
If he do many bad things, the evil will take his hand and bring him to hell.
That is what I heard from old pple saying.
How true is that?
Thanks alot.
First of all: in Buddhism, there is no soul. There is only a stream of consciousness that is insubstantial, impermanent, everchanging, arising due to karmic and mental factors and conditions.
In other words, there is no permanent Self -
Thusness:
Life (Self) is nothing other than the continuous flow of the Now
Moment.
The Now Moment ceases as it arises. This moment must completely
ceased
and serves as the CAUSE for the next moment to arise.
Therefore Self is a process of series Self1, Self2, Self3, Self4,
Self5, Self6...etc
A fixed entity 'Self' does not exist, what really exists is a
momentary Self.
Under deep meditation, one is able to observe and sense the karmic
and mental factors from moment to moment,
it is these factors that are succeeded from moment to moment and
life and life but not a fixed entity.
When the karmic and mental factors subsides, it is known as "The
True and Only (and Inherently egoless) Conscious Light
(Itself)".
Next is: if your relative has already taken rebirth in Heaven, he or she will resemble nothing you recognise. He or she will not look like your old relative. Why? Because beings in heaven have very majestic and beautiful looks, far more beautiful than anything Earthly, far beyond your imaginations. All those who actually saw devas made the same statements. Those beings resemble nothing of earthly beauty. They are heavenly.
So if you saw a relative that resembles what you saw in your earthly life, you can confirm that that is not a heavenly being. Heavenly beings don't look like human. Most likely, it is a ghost realm spirit projecting in the form of a relative. Do not follow them. It is likely as Master Chin Kung said, that they are spirits who are tricking you into following them because they want revenge.
Anyway back to devas and heavenly beings, even if heavenly beings appear to you, in Buddhism we should not follow them. Because in Buddhism we do not aim to go the samsaric realm of heaven. Being reborn in heaven is still temporary, and subject to karma, death, rebirth. The enjoyment is temporary and one will still eventually suffer.
Alternatively it could be that your relative have fallen into the ghost realm. One should avoid being reborn in that realm, which is one of the three lower realms of immense sufferings (along with hell and animal realm).
It is far better to be reborn in Amitabha's pure land, or attain enlightenment and be liberated from the cycle of rebirth. It is in fact, better to be reborn as a human to continue one's path to enlightenment, than to be reborn as a deva in heaven because it is easy to be lost and forget about one's cultivation in heaven since it is too enjoyable.
Originally posted by Aloozer:then regardless of whichever buddhist tradition these buddhist practitioners come from, who may have gained some realisation or insights during the course of their life…how would that help them in the dying process? in the bardo? won’t they need some sort of guidance too or do they have no need to chant Amitabha?
When you become enlightened to your true nature of reality, there is no more grasping, no more samsaric delusion. Everything self-liberates as it arises. When this is realised, then one does not need to rely on anything else, like chanting, nor does one need to wait for Amitabha to appear, since one is automatically liberated. One will no longer be deluded by and cling to anything. One realised there is no self and no dharmas (all phenomena are empty) and no longer attaches to anything. But before that, if there is any attachment at all, it will surely be the cause of rebirth. In such cases, chanting is important, and guidance is helpful, and one can rely on the power and vows of Amitabha and aspire for rebirth in pure land.
Regarding liberation, as Dudjom Rinpoche says,
If I put my finger on the concise essential meaning, it is this: in the gap between the last thought’s cessation and the next’s arising, isn’t there a fresh, present knowing, that has not been modified even in the slightest—luminous, naked awareness? That itself is awareness’ abiding state!
But one does not permanently abide within the nature of reality. Doesn’t a thought suddenly arise? That is the natural display of awareness. However, if you do not recognize thoughts as soon as they arise, they will naturally spread. This is called “the chain of delusion,” the root of samsara. Mere recognition of thoughts as they arise breaks their flow. Release thoughts within that recognition. When you remain in that state, arising thoughts will all be liberated equally within awareness, the expanse of dharmakaya. This is the main practice in which the view and meditation of Cutting Through Solidity, Trekchö, are cultivated as one.