Clarifications on misconception on Buddhism
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If he have made any ignorant remarks, please post it here together with your clarifications!
That would be most helpful!
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Here it goes:
Originally posted by Fantagf:
AS a former christian I know where he comes from when he preached on this - it is stated in the bible. Go do a search in the bible, you will understand why he behaves such. I have to admit, I was once brainwashed and think the same for the bible stated this to be.Wacky Sung's response:
Originally posted by Wacky Sung:LOL brainwashed.Isn't you making personal attack to all Christain down here.I will like to meet you in person in Singapore and upfront talk to you before i departed for my trip.The ways you make your sentence are racism.
There is practically, theoretically no racism in my words.
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Originally posted by Fantagf:
Here it goes:
Wacky Sung's response:
There is practically, theoretically no racism in my words.
Er... Off tangent.
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Originally posted by Weychin:
Er... Off tangent.
He never gives up, still very into troublemaking. Read below:
Originally posted by Fantagf:
Possible, that cross my mind, too.If Rony is right in doing so then why is that Wacky so agitated when people give comments about Rony. If Rony is right, the truth will set him free nobody needs to go to the extent to threaten people.
These nasty christians are just so evil.
Wacky Sung never give up, read below on his response to my post. the post now talked about religious attack, no more racism. He flip flip flop flop, does not even have a sound mind to differentiate the basic, tsk tsk tsk.
Originally posted by Wacky Sung:You are creating a diversification of the Pastor cause of action into a reglious attack and discrimination.I believe Jason will be contacted probably email / phone
and retrieved back all those deleted thread topic.You are just a ring leader starting from those deleted posting thread and now back to Pastor Rony cause of action.Anyway your nick is mentioned as i reported and the case will be refer to Internal Security Department (ISD) for making insensitive remarks.Good luck with all your comments and once i am back to Singapore i believe some others and probably involving you will be dealt with.
What I am saying it is definitely not worse like others but he made his choice to attack. Such speak of the character of his. His motive is purely to attack. Bible speaks of such character and does not approve of such behaviour. -
He has taken offense to your attention to pastor Rony. However, I see no attacks or misconception on Buddhism therefore no clarifications.
He has emotional attachment to Rony Tan's issue, that's why he is reacting so strongly.
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Originally posted by Weychin:
He has taken offense to your attention to pastor Rony. However, I see no attacks or misconception on Buddhism therefore no clarifications.
He has emotional attachment to Rony Tan's issue, that's why he is reacting so strongly.
Up to him. He is accountable for his actions - this is what christians believe - one is accountable for one own's action and on the day of judgement god will judgeHe feels no remorse over the actions and words from Rony against Buddhism. tsk tsk tsk. Instead of doing things or saying things to stop Rony he is in a way condoning his actions and words.
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Probably because he is indoctrinated to accept the views as true, and Rony Tan is a representative of god. Due to that, he is unable to judge rationally. Until he sees things in a wider context, the views will still hold true !
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Originally posted by Weychin:
Probably because he is indoctrinated to accept the views as true, and Rony Tan is a representative of god. Due to that, he is unable to judge rationally. Until he sees things in a wider context, the views will still hold true !
When I was a practising christian I believed that to be true but did not go round telling and condemning people on this. I believe in respecting other religions. -
Originally posted by Fantagf:
Up to him. He is accountable for his actions - this is what christians believe - one is accountable for one own's action and on the day of judgement god will judgeHe feels no remorse over the actions and words from Rony against Buddhism. tsk tsk tsk. Instead of doing things or saying things to stop Rony he is in a way condoning his actions and words.
I had read his post at EH. He said Rony was speaking the truth but presented it in the wrong way. As what Weychin said he has definitely taken offense with anybody who talk against Rony. 黑白�分. -
Originally posted by Dawnfirstlight:
I had read his post at EH. He said Rony was speaking the truth but presented it in the wrong way. As what Weychin said he has definitely taken offense with anybody who talk against Rony. 黑白�分.
He targets me and use ISD to threaten me. He is not a sound person. Way back in Speakers' Corner he already started to stir up trouble. I posted a thread on HDB asking for landlord to inform HDB of rental rooms from Asiaone.com. He insisted I should not post this sort of news as it is not confirmed and that Asiaone.com is not reliable. He said if it is confirmed news will be out in STS. In the end the mod deleted my thread. Obviously, he is a troll here for troublemaking. Frankly, I did not provoke him intentionally, it was him who in his own evil way took offence.He flips flips flop flop, one moment said I am into racism, next moment said it is about religion.
This sort of nasty christian commonly found everywhere
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wacky sung? that guy is wacky, just ignore him. he is entitled to his beliefs, but it doesnt mean they are the reality/truth. if he said Rony is right, he is right, because perception is reality to him. so it depends on which angle you stand.
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Originally posted by Fantagf:
He targets me and use ISD to threaten me. He is not a sound person. Way back in Speakers' Corner he already started to stir up trouble. I posted a thread on HDB asking for landlord to inform HDB of rental rooms from Asiaone.com. He insisted I should not post this sort of news as it is not confirmed and that Asiaone.com is not reliable. He said if it is confirmed news will be out in STS. In the end the mod deleted my thread. Obviously, he is a troll here for troublemaking. Frankly, I did not provoke him intentionally, it was him who in his own evil way took offence.He flips flips flop flop, one moment said I am into racism, next moment said it is about religion.
This sort of nasty christian commonly found everywhere
If he cannot accept others' view which differ from his, forum is not the place for him to chat. I chatted in many forums and have not seen anybody like him before.
During Ven. Ming Yi's court case, there were many who talked bad about Buddhism and Ven. Ming Yi in other forums. We Buddhists just clarified and rectified.
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Originally posted by Fantagf:
Buddhist monk expressed skepticism over the usefulness of inter-faith dialogue to prevent another Rony Tan fiasco
Written by Our Correspondent - 16 Feb 2010, Temasek Review
A Buddhist monk Venerable Dhammika has expressed his doubts about the effectiveness of inter-faith dialogue to prevent another Rony Tan fiasco from arising.
An Australian by birth, Venerable Dhammika have been a Buddhist monk for 32 years and am the spiritual advisor to the Buddha Dhamma Mandala Society in Singapore.
Lighthouse Evangelism Pastor Rony Tan was hauled up for questioning by the Internal Security Department (ISD) last Monday for making disparaging remarks about Buddhism and Taoism during a church session which was video-taped and uploaded to Youtube.
He has since apologized to the leaders of the Buddhist and Taoist faiths and the government has refrained from taking further action against him out of fear of sending “shockwaves” to the Christian community.
The Straits Times carried a report yesterday quoting several religious leaders as saying that inter-faith dialogue may be the way to prevent such unpleasant episodes from recurring in the future.
Venerable Dhammika, however, was unimpressed with the inter-faith dialogues as conducted in Singapore. Writing on his personal blog “Dhamma Musings”, he shared his experience at such sessions:
“I doubt that inter-religious dialogue, at least as it is conducted in Singapore, really brings about a change in how the different religions feel about each other. I have often attended inter-religious gatherings and I have noticed that everyone is friendly, accommodating and open-minded. The participants are already respectful of other faiths. The ones who could do with a bit of tolerance – the bigots, zealots, fundamentalists and the evangelicals, won’t come. Here in Singapore several major denominations have pointedly refused to join the Inter-religious Organization which they see as fratranizing with Satan.”
The Singapore government frequently organized such inter-faith dialogues to promote interaction between leaders of various religious faiths in Singapore.
As they are not compulsory, the participants are usually those who are tolerant and respectful of other faiths, as pointed out by Venerable Dhammika and as such is “all too often just an exercise in the converted preaching to each other.”
Venerable Dhammika proposed the government rewards tolerant leaders to marginalize those who are intolerant:
“The government should consider something like the Public Service Award, the PBM or the BBM, but to be given for service to interfaith understanding. When such people are looked upon as commendable, socially responsible and worthy, the bigots gradually come to be seen as out-of-step, as a public nuisance, as un-respectable. You can marginalize the intolerant by rewarding and lauding the tolerant.”
While the state media has been quick to sweep the saga under the carpet, religious fault-lines still lurk beneath the veneer of normalcy in Singapore, waiting to be exposed once more.
Pastor Rony Tan’s running down of other religions would not have come to light had he not video-taped his preaching and uploaded it to Youtube where it was subsequently circulated in cyberspace.
With the combustible situation exacerbated by the relentless influx of foreigners in Singapore, the social tension in Singapore society is set to grow in the years ahead.
Read rest of Venerable Dhammika’s post here
I have similar views too. I have a Buddhist friend who is working for a well-known Buddhist temple and is regularly selected to attend inter-faith dialogues over lunches or dinners. He knows very clearly that there are irreconcilable differences between each religion, especially between Buddhism and monotheistic religions such as Christianity and Islam.
There are indeed many Christian and other religious denominations who choose not to attend any single inter-faith dialogue so we cannot really give a clear proclamation of how successful inter-faith dialogue has really been for Singapore.
Both the government and the media are very eager to sweep everything under the carpet and we are persuaded to think everything is back to normal once more, since apologies have been made and the government continues to reiterate its strong commitment to maintaining inter-religious harmony.
Indeed if Pastor Rony Tan had not video-taped his speech and released it on his church's website, we would not have the chance to know what is really being preached behind each church's doors.
Pastor Rony Tan is not first one to do this, and neither will he be the last. The leaders of the inter-religious organisation had expressed their wish for such incidents to never happen again. To me, they are just making politically correct statements to show magnimousity and forgiveness, while deep inside their hearts and minds, they know this won't be the last of such cases.
But no matter how forgiving we are, there are limits that can't be tolerated further for the sake of appearing to be forgiving. Appropriate punishments that send a very strong and consistent signal to the public have to be enforced decisively at some point in time. The difficulty is in judging what is considered severe enough to merit a jail sentence or a mere official warning.
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Originally posted by Spnw07:
I have similar views too. I have a Buddhist friend who is working for a well-known Buddhist temple and is regularly selected to attend inter-faith dialogues over lunches or dinners. He knows very clearly that there are irreconcilable differences between each religion, especially between Buddhism and monotheistic religions such as Christianity and Islam.
There are indeed many Christian and other religious denominations who choose not to attend any single inter-faith dialogue so we cannot really give a clear proclamation of how successful inter-faith dialogue has really been for Singapore.
Both the government and the media are very eager to sweep everything under the carpet and we are persuaded to think everything is back to normal once more, since apologies have been made and the government continues to reiterate its strong commitment to maintaining inter-religious harmony.
Indeed if Pastor Rony Tan had not video-taped his speech and released it on his church's website, we would not have the chance to know what is really being preached behind each church's doors.
Pastor Rony Tan is not first one to do this, and neither will he be the last. The leaders of the inter-religious organisation had expressed their wish for such incidents to never happen again. To me, they are just making politically correct statements to show magnimousity and forgiveness, while deep inside their hearts and minds, they know this won't be the last of such cases.
But no matter how forgiving we are, there are limits that can't be tolerated further for the sake of appearing to be forgiving. Appropriate punishments that send a very strong and consistent signal to the public have to be enforced decisively at some point in time. The difficulty is in judging what is considered severe enough to merit a jail sentence or a mere official warning.
I fully understand what you are driving at. Sad to say that is the teaching in the bible. The have to be making politically correct statements to the public and govt if not they will not have peace.
As an ex christian, I know why they do so. Peace and respect are important that is why I had never made such statements to non christians in my past christian life.
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Originally posted by Spnw07:
I have similar views too. I have a Buddhist friend who is working for a well-known Buddhist temple and is regularly selected to attend inter-faith dialogues over lunches or dinners. He knows very clearly that there are irreconcilable differences between each religion, especially between Buddhism and monotheistic religions such as Christianity and Islam.
There are indeed many Christian and other religious denominations who choose not to attend any single inter-faith dialogue so we cannot really give a clear proclamation of how successful inter-faith dialogue has really been for Singapore.
Both the government and the media are very eager to sweep everything under the carpet and we are persuaded to think everything is back to normal once more, since apologies have been made and the government continues to reiterate its strong commitment to maintaining inter-religious harmony.
Indeed if Pastor Rony Tan had not video-taped his speech and released it on his church's website, we would not have the chance to know what is really being preached behind each church's doors.
Pastor Rony Tan is not first one to do this, and neither will he be the last. The leaders of the inter-religious organisation had expressed their wish for such incidents to never happen again. To me, they are just making politically correct statements to show magnimousity and forgiveness, while deep inside their hearts and minds, they know this won't be the last of such cases.
But no matter how forgiving we are, there are limits that can't be tolerated further for the sake of appearing to be forgiving. Appropriate punishments that send a very strong and consistent signal to the public have to be enforced decisively at some point in time. The difficulty is in judging what is considered severe enough to merit a jail sentence or a mere official warning.
The problem is the authorities is unable or unwilling nip the bud at the helm,
Probably, it is easier for them to send a message through the shrimps and the ikan bilises, then maybe they will be more mindful without the confrontational rally they plan to do with the Rony. Then, perhaps they may review their preaching approach.
Newer generation of Singapore lay Buddhist a more educated, articulate and assertive, who refuse to go away or be sweep under the carpet. This is our home. We expect the same respect and dignity to be the same as all Singaporeans.
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Originally posted by Weychin:
The problem is the authorities is unable or unwilling nip the bud at the helm,
Probably, it is easier for them to send a message through the shrimps and the ikan bilises, then maybe they will be more mindful without the confrontational rally they plan to do with the Rony. Then, perhaps they may review their preaching approach.
Newer generation of Singapore lay Buddhist a more educated, articulate and assertive, who refuse to go away or be sweep under the carpet. This is our home. We expect the same respect and dignity to be the same as all Singaporeans.
Actually I hope to be part of a group of Buddhists, not just in the context of Singapore, but internationally, who are sincerely respectful, loving and wise in their approach towards members of other religions, but at the same time be firm and proactive in clarifying misconceptions about Buddhism. But of course everything has to start somewhere and since Singapore is my homeland, then let me start with me at home.
By the way, here's another link from a Buddhist blog that gives a point by point clarification of misconceptions found in Pastor Rony Tan's videos:
I find that the clarifications from the above link can supplement and complement what AEN or others have already written as some misconceptions that are given in short explanations are further elaborated in the above web article.
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Below is the post I saw at Eternal Hope from the Rony's thread on buddhism:
Originally posted by 1985ong:Actually Pastor Rony is right.He shouldn't apologise.He should stand firm in his faith.Do you know that Buddhists cannot enter heaven?
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Originally posted by Fantagf:
Below is the post I saw at Eternal Hope from the Rony's thread on buddhism:
Yah, he's right, we cannot enter heaven, because we don't aspire for birth in heaven anyway as it's still within the cycle of birth-and-death!
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Originally posted by sanath:
Yah, he's right, we cannot enter heaven, because we don't aspire for birth in heaven anyway as it's still within the cycle of birth-and-death!
Well said.
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Originally posted by sanath:
Yah, he's right, we cannot enter heaven, because we don't aspire for birth in heaven anyway as it's still within the cycle of birth-and-death!
I am confused. I taught buddhism teaches that if possible not to go rebirth over and over again but to go pureland and whatever for obtaining nirvana. Isn't pureland heaven? -
Originally posted by Fantagf:
I am confused. I taught buddhism teaches that if possible not to go rebirth over and over again but to go pureland and whatever for obtaining nirvana. Isn't pureland heaven?Pure Land and heaven are two different things. Heaven, like i pointed above, is still within samsara, whereas the Pure Land(s) is the manifestation of the Buddha's Enlightened Mind, thus it is a realm of Enlightenment and synonymous with Nirvana or Enlightenment itself.
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Originally posted by Fantagf:
I am confused. I taught buddhism teaches that if possible not to go rebirth over and over again but to go pureland and whatever for obtaining nirvana. Isn't pureland heaven?Pure Land is not samsara.
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Originally posted by sanath:
Pure Land and heaven are two different things. Heaven, like i pointed above, is still within samsara, whereas the Pure Land(s) is the manifestation of the Buddha's Enlightened Mind, thus it is a realm of Enlightenment and synonymous with Nirvana or Enlightenment itself.
Sorry, I still don't get it. The xi fang mentioned in Mandarin, is this pureland?Does it mean no buddhist will go heaven except Buddha?
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Xi fang (西方淨土) is one of the Pure Lands, but also the most predominant one, presided by Amituofo (Amitabha, Amida 阿彌陀佛). Beings are able to attain birth in the Pure Land if one aspires to. As said, Pure Land is not "heaven", as even the Buddhas don't want to go to heaven. The "heaven" concept in the monotheistic religions, to Buddhists, would still be under one of the 33 forms of existence, and would thus still be within the circle of birth-and-death, and not the liberation (Nirvana) that Buddhists aspire for.
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Originally posted by sanath:
Xi fang (西方淨土) is one of the Pure Lands, but also the most predominant one, presided by Amituofo (Amitabha, Amida 阿彌陀佛). Beings are able to attain birth in the Pure Land if one aspires to. As said, Pure Land is not "heaven", as even the Buddhas don't want to go to heaven. The "heaven" concept in the monotheistic religions, to Buddhists, would still be under one of the 33 forms of existence, and would thus still be within the circle of birth-and-death, and not the liberation (Nirvana) that Buddhists aspire for.
Thanks, now I get it.
