[Sunday Times] Unhelpful students on bus
-
The point now is it doesn't really matter if she generalise or assume them (students) as Uni. students or not....y you take it so hard? Just becoz you're an Uni. student also??? The point made is that it's really disappointing to see how those students have reacted towards her......Originally posted by casshern:lotsa experience to share and think about.
quite sad how singaporeans still act in an indifferent manner despite behind a world class country etc etc
rmb the Singapore country club incident? disturbing. and now, the students referred to are really Uni students.
top echaleon people behaving selffishly. what happens when they have to take part in decision making for the country?
would they do it for the greater good? or would they do it for themselves?
nevertheless, from here we can see there at least there's a few bright spots in the darkness -
some of you here say things like "why do you bother about other people's stares when you do something good?"
dun tell me you wun loh... come on. its not hard to imagine yourself in those shoes, unless you've never been in them before (never given your seat before). lolz... personally, i do give my seats to pregnant ladies or young children. those people are more appreciative and then i feel less affected by the stares. but to some older people or mothers with children.... well... i only do so once in a while, after i have gotten over the past embarrassment.
seriously guys... it's not as easy as you think it is. if you think it is, why don't you all start showing this graciousness around. maybe you can start a gracious society with it. -
I never care what ppl think about meOriginally posted by starblue:some of you here say things like "why do you bother about other people's stares when you do something good?"
dun tell me you wun loh... come on. its not hard to imagine yourself in those shoes, unless you've never been in them before (never given your seat before). lolz... personally, i do give my seats to pregnant ladies or young children. those people are more appreciative and then i feel less affected by the stares. but to some older people or mothers with children.... well... i only do so once in a while, after i have gotten over the past embarrassment.
seriously guys... it's not as easy as you think it is. if you think it is, why don't you all start showing this graciousness around. maybe you can start a gracious society with it.
maybe it is my nature not give a hoot what ppl care.
my life is short enough, if i have to give consideration on what others think.
I might as well let them live my life
-
ok loh.. go and give up your seats loh...Originally posted by Kenashi:I never care what ppl think about me
maybe it is my nature not give a hoot what ppl care.
my life is short enough, if i have to give consideration on what others think.
I might as well let them live my life -
no, what i'm trying to put across in my above post is that the uni students are going to be in the top echaleon in the future. and their disgusting behaviour reflects well enough of our so-called "well-educated"Originally posted by dcx:The point now is it doesn't really matter if she generalise or assume them (students) as Uni. students or not....y you take it so hard? Just becoz you're an Uni. student also??? The point made is that it's really disappointing to see how those students have reacted towards her......
imagine them as MPs. i think they would be happily eating their peanuts -
come to think of it... which MP doesnt eat their peanuts happily? lolz... wad has this got to do with uni or not?Originally posted by casshern:no, what i'm trying to put across in my above post is that the uni students are going to be in the top echaleon in the future. and their disgusting behaviour reflects well enough of our so-called "well-educated"
imagine them as MPs. i think they would be happily eating their peanuts -
true, if you say so, but think hard and see if the environment changed you or you had changed the environment.Originally posted by Kenashi:I never care what ppl think about me
maybe it is my nature not give a hoot what ppl care.
my life is short enough, if i have to give consideration on what others think.
I might as well let them live my life
alot of pple, including me proclaim that i dun give a hoot how pple think about me when i behave, wear, speak etc. but after sometime that sense of embrassement/awkardness sets in ....
of cos some pple are much bolder then others to actually lead life their way and our society would often outcast them. how sad, cause they are often the bright and creative ones -
True.Originally posted by casshern:no, what i'm trying to put across in my above post is that the uni students are going to be in the top echaleon in the future. and their disgusting behaviour reflects well enough of our so-called "well-educated"
imagine them as MPs. i think they would be happily eating their peanuts -
can i ask a qn..? why must it always be students to give up their seats..? there are some adults who are freaking fit.. do they deserve the seats then..? why nobody wrote into ST Forums to scold e hell outta them..?
"Hey, i'm 25 yrs old.. my legs have weathered for 25 yrs.. you.. tt 14-yrs old nerd with the big schoolbag.. stand up and give up your seat!" -
Originally posted by ^HaRu^:can i ask a qn..? why must it always be students to give up their seats..? there are some adults who are freaking fit.. do they deserve the seats then..? why nobody wrote into ST Forums to scold e hell outta them..?
"Hey, i'm 25 yrs old.. my legs have weathered for 25 yrs.. you.. tt 14-yrs old nerd with the big schoolbag.. stand up and give up your seat!" I definitely agree with this! Perhaps people think that students have the obligation to give up their seats? If not, it depends on your upbringing? -
I give them blank stare since I am always in my own thoughts.Originally posted by casshern:true, if you say so, but think hard and see if the environment changed you or you had changed the environment.
alot of pple, including me proclaim that i dun give a hoot how pple think about me when i behave, wear, speak etc. but after sometime that sense of embrassement/awkardness sets in ....
of cos some pple are much bolder then others to actually lead life their way and our society would often outcast them. how sad, cause they are often the bright and creative ones
society want to cast me out is their problem not mine. -
Originally posted by ^HaRu^:can i ask a qn..? why must it always be students to give up their seats..? there are some adults who are freaking fit.. do they deserve the seats then..? why nobody wrote into ST Forums to scold e hell outta them..?
"Hey, i'm 25 yrs old.. my legs have weathered for 25 yrs.. you.. tt 14-yrs old nerd with the big schoolbag.. stand up and give up your seat!"
like that oso can!!
the qn is not about who deserve the seat more, it is about who really need it. -
ok what i mean is.. cant those adults give up their seats too..?
-
to me , the lady is just giving a passing remark.
of course generalise UNi students as such is not appropriate.
this kind of situation happens anyway, from high class well dress workers to housing estate.
the lady should have written in such a way to address others to give up seats to people they see in need and not like condemn uni students.
have any one taken transports with foreigns shopping from little india, none of them will give a seat to even a dying or sick person that has treatment.
in singapore need seat for any valid reasons, just ask they will give.
anyway giving children seats is not neccesary as they are okay but not the below 5 years old. those need seats. the rest are just wild and having fun in the trains.
i have seen young professional foreign workers try to snatch Bus seat from an elderly old man. he can tell the old man to go behind seat even though the old man about to seat in the front seat. the old man ignore him and sat down.
that Pro foreigner wanted the front seat so that he and his GF or wife can seat together. If that old man is weak, he would have walk back end of the bus to get seats. fortunately this old man has guts to snub off this guy.
so the man and his wife with sour face walk right all the way back to teh end of the bus to get seats.
one thing for sure , if the old man give way, i would be the first out of so many singaporeans to scold that foreigner man. not to mention the bus driver.
in other countries they bully weak, old and helpless, hear, we defend.
next time observe and see how foreigners treat singaporeans in buses and trains. they snatch the seats right in front of everybody faces and so proud of it.
not sure if the lady that wrote article here is a foreigner or local. here , want something just ask. -
there can be so many people, each are tired in their own ways or even sick or just plain selfish and have the right to chose to give. except the seats meant for needy.Originally posted by Kenashi:
like that oso can!!
the qn is not about who deserve the seat more, it is about who really need it.
i am sure if ask, someone who thinks these people needs the seat they will normally give.
i have seen a lady 5 seats away say " pls someone give a seat to the old lady" 4 to 5 young adults nearest to the old lady stand up and volunteer.
weak or persons unable to secure/stand themselves steadily need to be seated so as no to be easily injured in case of misfortune or sudden brake, even for short distance. -
oh yah hor.. last time i was standingf on the bus. then got this pregnant lady board.. of cos i alwas give my seats to pregnant ladies one, but cos i also standing mah, so no seats to give. then i see npbody giving.. i wanted to ask that **JC student to give, but then i also paiseh... haiz.. why am i so liddat ah??Originally posted by AF2005:there can be so many people, each are tired in their own ways or even sick or just plain selfish and have the right to chose to give. except the seats meant for needy.
i am sure if ask, someone who thinks these people needs the seat they will normally give.
i have seen a lady 5 seats away say " pls someone give a seat to the old lady" 4 to 5 young adults nearest to the old lady stand up and volunteer.
weak or persons unable to secure/stand themselves steadily need to be seated so as no to be easily injured in case of misfortune or sudden brake, even for short distance. -
u can always ask!!Originally posted by starblue:oh yah hor.. last time i was standingf on the bus. then got this pregnant lady board.. of cos i alwas give my seats to pregnant ladies one, but cos i also standing mah, so no seats to give. then i see npbody giving.. i wanted to ask that **JC student to give, but then i also paiseh... haiz.. why am i so liddat ah??
I lost count on the number of times I ask ppl to give up their seats to the needy
once I got really angry when I saw a guy who saw the pregrant lady in front of him clearly in need of the seat n he can bo chap as if the lady wasn't there at all.
I asked in the most sarcastic manner "I think she need this seat more than u do, rite?"
He opened his mouth but no word came out when he took a look at me, then finally got his ass off the seat, I think he could have thought of telling me to mind my own business or whatever. -
Yep, it's indeed, why must students be the one who give the seats?Originally posted by starblue:oh yah hor.. last time i was standingf on the bus. then got this pregnant lady board.. of cos i alwas give my seats to pregnant ladies one, but cos i also standing mah, so no seats to give. then i see npbody giving.. i wanted to ask that **JC student to give, but then i also paiseh... haiz.. why am i so liddat ah?? Anyway, use your powerful "electric eye contact" to psycho him lah....
Back on topic. Of course, I appreciate the idea of respecting your elders, but it does seem to me nowadays, the adults are overusing it.
As in, they expect to have their way in every teeny, weeny little situation they come across with "gin na". The crucial word is "expect". Don't tell me those people, when they were young, they always gave seats to the elderly.
An experience of mine: Not related to bus. I once saw an elderly woman, jump queue when it is a long queue to buy something. I see liao quite surprised. The lady asked her "auntie, wu bai dui boh?" The reply was "wu la, wu la...."
I was even more surprised to hear that. Kaoz, ah mm ah, everyone bai dui, come on lah, just because you "old bird" doesn't mean you don't need to bai dui, right?
I went home, told my dad, he said this is very common.... -
For me i would, especially if my wife was in the same predicament.Originally posted by Kenashi:if it was u in the situation, would u ask someone to give up their seat to u???
think about it b4 u answer.
There should be no animosity over giving up a seat for a genuine reason if asked.
While it is hoped that we evolve as a people and become more gracious, these things will take time.
We have to stay patient and react accordingly. -
Too true.Originally posted by Kenashi:demand is too harsh a word.
wasn't morals taught to u during school or in yr life journey?
what is the use of being taught on something that u don't practise???
Demanding something of others is indeed callous, especially when they are strangers.
But if you refer to the article she carefully penned, you will detect "automatic expectations" brewing from her experience on the bus...and by following up with a letter to express her obvious displeasure, it already implied a demand. -
Put aside the sympathy clause for a moment.Originally posted by loudmonkey:On the bus, the woman did not get her seat right? She kept quiet, did she not? So she did not demand any courtesy orally. She "expected" courtesy in her mind - but who could tell? Is it even relevant that she "expected" or "demanded" courtesy? I doubt so.
But on the other hand, no kind-hearted soul offered her a seat. No one offering courtesy to her.
The gist of her letter is: why are people not giving help, when help is clearly appreciated? Surely you don't need people to tell you when help is appreciated, right? C'mon, you need to be TOLD to give up a seat for a woman who has a child in her hands?
I mean, so what if you have been snubbed before, without a word of thanks from the person who took the seat? You want something in return for the good deed? Is this becoming more like a moral transaction?
The writer of the letter has a good point to make. The students are not being magnanimous to her. And c'mon, don't tell me that the people may not be students - GOOD chance that they are, and let's not avoid the reality ya?
If on the other hand, if the woman orally demanded a seat, I would actually feel embarassed! Wouldn't you?
You need to be TOLD to give up a seat????
Where is the sense of a good heart, the sense of magnamity, the sense of courtesy?
Let's look at the underlying reasons why she wrote that letter.
1: She wanted to finger the degrading standards of courtesy in Singapore Society.
2: She experienced first hand the problem faced and therefore duly suffered what others have perhaps suffered before her.
For item 1, there is no doubt that our standards have dropped. The point of contention is: is this a new wake-up call or is it a prevalent issue transparent to our society despite its obvious signs?
We are fully aware of it but change and ethical improvement is not something that can be achieved overnight. What she has written is nothing new and was published as a gradual tool in the hopes that we as a people would be nudged in the right direction. Again i stress, it is a slow and painful process.
Item 2: It is always difficult when you experience it personally. It might sound disbelieving when you hear it from someone else but experencing the difficulty is always the alarm bell. There is a lot of anger and resentment in the manner in which she was treated by strangers and therefore, her letter lambasting the undergrads who failed to deliver on her expectations is somewhat concealing the fact that it would all have been avoided had she or her husband simply asked.
You DO not need to ask for courtesy?
Perhaps the correct statement is : You SHOULD NOT have to ask for courtesy.
But then again, we are all humans, some selfish and unkind, others gracious and polite. -
Originally posted by CoolMyth:Yep, it's indeed, why must students be the one who give the seats? Anyway, use your powerful "electric eye contact" to psycho him lah.... scully he thinks i like him wor...
seriously though... singapore needs to evolve lah... so people, let's start the trend. -
hmm...for me, it is almost automatic for me to give up my seats to those who are less unfortunate...I dun see why some people find so much trouble just to do dat...
-
If you were busy rushing through your report (because you have to submit your report later) on the bus or MRT (esp.) , and you see those unfortunate one. Will you give up your seat to them in exchange for being fired/scolded for not finishing your report or you will just hack it and continue with you work?
We can don't talk about report. Some other more important thing to do lo. Cannot do while standing. -
First of all, u shudnt be doing those things in the bus anywayOriginally posted by The return:If you were busy rushing through your report (because you have to submit your report later) on the bus or MRT (esp.) , and you see those unfortunate one. Will you give up your seat to them in exchange for being fired/scolded for not finishing your report or you will just hack it and continue with you work?
We can don't talk about report. Some other more important thing to do lo. Cannot do while standing.