Braking/Slowing down/Stopping with Manual Cars
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Originally posted by Gosu.:
Ya that's what I thought.
I passed my BTT already, taking my FTT tomorrow and making my PDL too(couldn't make on the day I passed my BTT because I didn't have glasses)Having booked my driving lessons like I said above because my BTT and FTT was only 3 days apart so I figured I'd take both first and since my PDL isn't made I might as well make it tomorrow and then book my lessons.
Wouldn't it take damn long to change down? 4 - 3 - 2 - 1? I see taxi drivers just intermittent brake then from gear 4, depress clutch, switch to gear 1.
It wun take damn long to change down... usually pple change down to 2 and then brake all the way liaoz...
u see taxi drivers do tt cos they already passed the tp... even so.. it depends on the situation if u want to do what they did..
if going downhill... if u clutch in all the way... the car might pick up speed veh fast... and u might lose control of the car...
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Originally posted by Gosu.:
What's an engine break?! Advanced theory book says it's the best way to break so it doesn't wear off your break lining too.
Though my sister says that you don't/hardly use it/not tested. But good if I know.
if u can use the net to post in sgforums..
spend as much time dong some research of your own too...
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Originally posted by mamamamama:
i was like you before i learnt to drive too, started forming theories inside my head of different "how to". coz i was thinking that i better familiarize and prepare myself before the actual lessons.
turns out that after i started my lessons, those silly theories that i formed are useless. just go for the lessons and you'll natually understand everything.
I agree with this, back when I was taking my theory tests I was trying to follow all the theories and instructions on things like Braking/stopping etc with manual cars and i found it pretty confusing, but once you atcually start driving it becomes very clear and you get very used to it quickly.
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Originally posted by n0x:
i think the theory you posted here is entirely wrong..
read up more b4 posting...
i'm no expert in mechanics or whatever. just reiterating what i understand in simple terms. you're welcomed to correct me then, or anyone else in this case. -
Originally posted by n0x:
which 'rod' are u talking about??
crank shaft?? prop shaft ( in rwd cars)??? wheel axle?? differential?? connecting rods in the engine??
sorry , i meant the gear box aka transmission could be damaged or fractured due to frequent neutral-switching while car is not yet 100% standstill.Is it true the gear in the gearbox of auto car can fracture after some time, especially when at higher speed switching to neutral all of a sudden?
thanks in advance.
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Originally posted by balance_else_complacent:
sorry , i meant the gear box aka transmission could be damaged or fractured due to frequent neutral-switching while car is not yet 100% standstill.Is it true the gear in the gearbox of auto car can fracture after some time, especially when at higher speed switching to neutral all of a sudden?
thanks in advance.
Mistake
I'm not sure about the mechanics but the way I look at it, there should be no damage and if there is it would be directed to the engine due to the high frequency revolutions switching to low, the gearbox/transmitter works to regulate the amount of power transmitted to the engine and thus should allow power(electricity or valve for air/fuel combustion ratio release? not sure.) to transmit without failure and with be able to adhere the frequency of change.Sorry correction, from wikipedia:
Engine braking beyond normal engine drag (i.e., shifting into a different gear only to decelerate a vehicle) can increase the cost of owning and operating a vehicle:
- It applies stopping forces directly to the drivetrain(gearbox and transmitting related parts), transferring wear and tear to parts that are an order of magnitude more expensive and difficult to replace than brake parts.
Firstly it will wear it off and secondly it is far more expensive if it gets damaged and by recklessly engine braking from a high gear to neutrel. I presume you are very prone to such damages.
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Originally posted by n0x:
if u can use the net to post in sgforums..
spend as much time dong some research of your own too...
Can't believe I forgot wikipedia. Okay I have read and would like to pose a few questions. Basically what I have learnt is that engine braking is allowing the engine to brake itself via 'changing-down' aka decelerating due to the limit of the fuel/air compression pressure from each gear.So in application, say on a level road where the lights are red, roads are clear and you're a good 100m away at 70km/h at gear 4(someone correct me if I'm wrong).
Do you
release acceleration first then depress the breaks; slowly releasing pressure, while depressing the clutch, down gear to 3; release and depress; down to 2; release depress down to 1?
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Originally posted by Gosu.:
Mistake
I'm not sure about the mechanics but the way I look at it, there should be no damage and if there is it would be directed to the engine due to the high frequency revolutions switching to low, the gearbox/transmitter works to regulate the amount of power transmitted to the engine and thus should allow power(electricity or valve for air/fuel combustion ratio release? not sure.) to transmit without failure and with be able to adhere the frequency of change.Sorry correction, from wikipedia:
Engine braking beyond normal engine drag (i.e., shifting into a different gear only to decelerate a vehicle) can increase the cost of owning and operating a vehicle:
- It applies stopping forces directly to the drivetrain(gearbox and transmitting related parts), transferring wear and tear to parts that are an order of magnitude more expensive and difficult to replace than brake parts.
Firstly it will wear it off and secondly it is far more expensive if it gets damaged and by recklessly engine braking from a high gear to neutrel. I presume you are very prone to such damages.
Thanks Gosu for providing your views and helped me clarify this aspect.
As for braking, I normally use pedal breaking. I would 1st release the gas pedal, apply intermittent braking and when about 50m, apply stronger braking and at 10 m away, gracefully release pressure on the brakes before bring the car to a standstill. Not much issue for me there. Paiseh, i cannot offer much help. Mine is auto only. But as far as I know, even for manual, my instructor ever said can stop at gear 2 just that remember to move off from gear 1. else problem to car somehow.
cheers.
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Originally posted by balance_else_complacent:
sorry , i meant the gear box aka transmission could be damaged or fractured due to frequent neutral-switching while car is not yet 100% standstill.Is it true the gear in the gearbox of auto car can fracture after some time, especially when at higher speed switching to neutral all of a sudden?
thanks in advance.
ever hear is tendency towards Auto transmission vehicles -
when approaching junction:
1)come in fast
2)down shift to 2nd gear
3)release clutch and tap brake lightly with your toe, while heel on accelerator
4)drift thru the corner
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Originally posted by sbst275:
ever hear is tendency towards Auto transmission vehicles
you mean its true huh? its true that it'll fracture in time? -
Originally posted by Gosu.:
Can't believe I forgot wikipedia. Okay I have read and would like to pose a few questions. Basically what I have learnt is that engine braking is allowing the engine to brake itself via 'changing-down' aka decelerating due to the limit of the fuel/air compression pressure from each gear.So in application, say on a level road where the lights are red, roads are clear and you're a good 100m away at 70km/h at gear 4(someone correct me if I'm wrong).
Do you
release acceleration first then depress the breaks; slowly releasing pressure, while depressing the clutch, down gear to 3; release and depress; down to 2; release depress down to 1?
Actually i don't depress the brakes too hard at the start, more like a gentle press of the brakes at the start and then down shfiting accordingly. No need to intermittent braking at all as most cars nowadays got ABS so just keep the right foot on the brakes. As for whether when reach closer to the junction must depress brakes harder, that will depend on other factors concerning driving experience, a bit hard to bring the point across in words. Even when I describe how I brake, it probably will still leave you in a state of blurness. Hard to describe lah, a lot of this is second nature to me and it will be second nature to you in time to come as well.
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Originally posted by balance_else_complacent:
sorry , i meant the gear box aka transmission could be damaged or fractured due to frequent neutral-switching while car is not yet 100% standstill.Is it true the gear in the gearbox of auto car can fracture after some time, especially when at higher speed switching to neutral all of a sudden?
thanks in advance.
nope... it wun happen... it doesnt work quite as same as an auto box...lets put it his way... in a manual box.. pple will need to change gear... and when u are in the process of changing gear.. u need to disengage the clutch... at that moment.. u are in neutral and crusing at some speed right...
and u probably has to do it a few gazillion times in the course of driving tt car..
so if by going by ur saying is true... then we no need change gear liaoz?? or the gear box needs to be changed once a year??
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Originally posted by balance_else_complacent:
Thanks Gosu for providing your views and helped me clarify this aspect.
As for braking, I normally use pedal breaking. I would 1st release the gas pedal, apply intermittent braking and when about 50m, apply stronger braking and at 10 m away, gracefully release pressure on the brakes before bring the car to a standstill. Not much issue for me there. Paiseh, i cannot offer much help. Mine is auto only. But as far as I know, even for manual, my instructor ever said can stop at gear 2 just that remember to move off from gear 1. else problem to car somehow.
cheers.
can stop at gear 3 also...but not during TP test la. -
Originally posted by Gosu.:
Can't believe I forgot wikipedia. Okay I have read and would like to pose a few questions. Basically what I have learnt is that engine braking is allowing the engine to brake itself via 'changing-down' aka decelerating due to the limit of the fuel/air compression pressure from each gear.So in application, say on a level road where the lights are red, roads are clear and you're a good 100m away at 70km/h at gear 4(someone correct me if I'm wrong).
Do you
release acceleration first then depress the breaks; slowly releasing pressure, while depressing the clutch, down gear to 3; release and depress; down to 2; release depress down to 1?
yes.. u need to release the clutch to engage the trasnmission to the engine so tt the engine brake can take effect...
there is no need to go all the way to 1... 2 will suffice... and then u can slowly brake then clutch in all the way
rationale being should the light suddenly turn green... u can continue moving with enough torque in gear 2 since ur car is still in motion...
as rule of thumb... gear 1 is for when the car is stationary....
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When you learn driving, they'll tell you to slowly downshift all the way to the 2nd gear. For example, if you're in the 4th gear, you gotta downshift to 3rd gear, then after awhile downshift to the 2nd gear and let engine braking take effect. If you're still travelling too fast, then you gonna depress the brake pedal. And just at the point when the engine is going to stall, depress the clutch and brake to a stop.
But honestly speaking, many experienced drivers just depress the clutch pedal and let the car free-wheel and brake to a stop just by the brakes itself. Helps to save some fuel, but brake pads wear out faster too. Depends on how you look at it. And if your control of the brakes is poor and you ain't got enough experience, free-wheeling is dangerous and not recommended.
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Originally posted by Gosu.:
Mistake
I'm not sure about the mechanics but the way I look at it, there should be no damage and if there is it would be directed to the engine due to the high frequency revolutions switching to low, the gearbox/transmitter works to regulate the amount of power transmitted to the engine and thus should allow power(electricity or valve for air/fuel combustion ratio release? not sure.) to transmit without failure and with be able to adhere the frequency of change.Sorry correction, from wikipedia:
Engine braking beyond normal engine drag (i.e., shifting into a different gear only to decelerate a vehicle) can increase the cost of owning and operating a vehicle:
- It applies stopping forces directly to the drivetrain(gearbox and transmitting related parts), transferring wear and tear to parts that are an order of magnitude more expensive and difficult to replace than brake parts.
Firstly it will wear it off and secondly it is far more expensive if it gets damaged and by recklessly engine braking from a high gear to neutrel. I presume you are very prone to such damages.
acutally engine brake should be used in tandem with normal foot braking...
why??
bcos using engine brake along will cause excessive wear to the clutch...
and using foot brake alone will cause excessive wear to brake pads...
so they reccomend engine braking...
furthermore.. its safer than if u cltuch in all the way...
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Originally posted by balance_else_complacent:
Thanks Gosu for providing your views and helped me clarify this aspect.
As for braking, I normally use pedal breaking. I would 1st release the gas pedal, apply intermittent braking and when about 50m, apply stronger braking and at 10 m away, gracefully release pressure on the brakes before bring the car to a standstill. Not much issue for me there. Paiseh, i cannot offer much help. Mine is auto only. But as far as I know, even for manual, my instructor ever said can stop at gear 2 just that remember to move off from gear 1. else problem to car somehow.
cheers.
u can move off from gear 2 at stationary.. u can even move off at gear 3...thing is... gear 1 is there for a reason..
moving off at higher gears will result in excessive clutch slippage... and hence.. premature wearing off of clutch...
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hey, I got a question. i want to downshift.
do i:
let go of the brakes and clutch in,
or can i clutch in while depressing the brake?
Sorry if this has been answered above, I find this whole thread confusing.
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Originally posted by CasperV:
hey, I got a question. i want to downshift.
do i:
let go of the brakes and clutch in,
or can i clutch in while depressing the brake?
Sorry if this has been answered above, I find this whole thread confusing.
Ya, I'm confused again. I know that I should use the footbrakes along with engine brake.
Would like the answer to the above question.
And what do you mean by clutch in all the way? Meaning gear down to 1 or depend only on engine brakes?
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FTT today! HUAT ARH!
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errr? u break first, to a certain speed,
eg. gear 3 - 2
Speed - 60, brake till 40, stop pressing brake
clutch in, change to gear2......
if need stop, press break, and slowly stop, it's pointless to stop at gear1...
If after u step brake, traffic begin to move, just let abit of clutch and press the oil pedal
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Actually I feel no matter what we say here, it will be hard for TS to remember. Coz you can't expect him/her to like memorise the steps when driving. Best is to consult your instructor. He will be the best person to help you.
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- Double Post-
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Originally posted by Gosu.:
Ya, I'm confused again. I know that I should use the footbrakes along with engine brake.
Would like the answer to the above question.
And what do you mean by clutch in all the way? Meaning gear down to 1 or depend only on engine brakes?
Scenario: I want to downshift in sequence from 4 to 3 to 2.
1. 4th gear
2. Brake with minimal force
3. Clutch in
4. Shift down to 3
5. Let go of clutch
6. Clutch in
7. Shift down to 2
8. Let go of clutch
9. Let go of brake
Meaning I'm depressing the brake all the way. IS that possible?
I'm trying my best to make things very clear
