I hear of a Bjj dojo in Chinatown with an instructor who...
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Their guys won most of the medal tallies in the sub grappling comp, so naturally this shows that their team is one of the best in that comp. They are just showing proofs.Originally posted by point:Frankly, compared to the medal tallies boasted by the specific group of supporters, this is really nothing.
But it shows how bias YOU are. Oops!
Compared to the medal tallies?..this is two different ballgames altogether,man!
You know this is like "but he said that first!" ..ARE you like 7yo?
If he is a purple then he is expected to tap out whites. But to come on here and state that he taps out the poor guy 4x in a min..jesus..
And i also realised that you like to put words like 'boasted' in your comments to make them look bad. Are you one of jason's students? I want to know if their school have students like you. -
Nah i'm not going to back to read all the 150replies. If you said that then i believe you. I'm just writing out how i feel as an outsider.Originally posted by NoRiceBoys:I think you should go back and re-read what was posted. Many of us gave Darren's students credit for winning. -
The fighter's name is Zack. He's a local boy.Originally posted by samadhi_fire:Nitpicking at statements can also hide lots of untruths.
Your statement insinuates that the competition was not fair and accurate depiction of the quality of Darren's students' wins because BXG, a major Muay Thai gym in S'pore, did not send any representatives at the amateur level.
Perhaps they had to help them move. Perhaps BXG fitness students weren't ready to fight yet. Perhaps BXG doesn't have the students. We don't know.
You also say that BXG sent one professional fighter who won by KO. Wow, so we are to think from your statement that BXG fighters are all good, when they choose to send fighters to compete. Who is this fighter? Was he trained by BXG only or has he been overseas trained all this while, coming back to Singapore and choosing to represent BXG? Is he a trainer who was imported from overseas? We don't know.
You too, make nice sweeping statements. Again, the ball is in your court. You can make this thread meaningful by taking up my offer. Or, we can continue to bicker like children and nitpick at each other's statements until the cows come home.
That's a lot more information I've given you then we've had from the original poster about the said grappling tournament where a white belt submitted a purple belt 4 times.
What is your offer? -
>>Thanks for the link. We all know Jason is a legit purple belt but if you go back to the first post, the thread starter was asking about rumours he or she heard about Jason being submitted by a white belt.. 4 times or something. He was questioning his skill, not his belt. <<
So are you saying that John Will gives out BJJ belts when the person is not deserving, is that what you're implying?
If the question is with Jason's skill level, Albino could easily have requested to have a friendly roll with Jason and find it out, or even just ask to roll with his students to find out their skill level, not post a backstabbing email and be a keyboard cowboy here on the forums. That is the polite thing to do.
I think there are no rumours, you guys could easily have verified the truth if you wanted to. Let me know if you'd like me to pull up all the previous posts to prove this to you.
This smells to me like a personal vendetta. And I think you guys know each other, it's clear that you are from MMA Academy, and Albinogorilla is affilated with the gym. In fact, I have a good idea who he is.
>>There is no contention about Jason's belt.<<
Then you do know that in BJJ, a person's belt is representative of his skill level don't you? This can be easily resolved if you have any contentions.
>>As for Darren, he teaches submission grappling and MMA. He doesn't teach BJJ. If you come down to the gym, you will see that we train no-gi. Nobody ever said Darren taught BJJ. So what's your beef?<<
http://www.mma-academy.com/coursesched.htm
See BJJ there?
http://www.combatacademy.com.sg/index.html
See Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu there?
My beef is with someone badmouthing a legitimate practioner/instructor by someone else without providing any kind of proof, in the false pretense that it is for the reason of "clearing up a rumour."
The irony is that the person doing the badmouthing is the one from a gym which has no verifiable credentials at all in the said art.
So my beef is with bullshat.
On hindsight it was wrong of me to bring Darren into this discussion. He has nothing to do with this (I hope) and I apologize.
>>Clearly, you seem to be well-versed in the MA scene here. <<
No I'm not, it's nothing that a few phone calls and some research will not dig up.
>>You would also know that online documentation is poor, if any of it even exists. Your link is to an Australian website - the sport is highly developed there. Do you see many kung fu schools with websites up? Not many.<<
I'm not asking for a website. I'm asking for the name of the person who awarded him his said belt in BJJ, and his contact info if any. It is not difficult to find out if this person is legit and did give out the belt, as long as I can have his name.
>>So, stop asking for ONLINE proof.<<
See above. You know, if I really had certifications and someone asked me to prove it, I will have no problems proving it to you.
>>You clearly know that none of it exists and you are using that to your benefit. <<
I know that the legit belt rankings don't exist? I know that what doesn't exist?
>>If you are genuinely not trying to stir shit, PM me and I'll bring you down to Darren's and you can have a go. Perhaps we can also visit the other schools together and we can come back here to give a fair assessment of the various schools. <<
I'm not trying to stir shit. I'm trying to clear up an allegation that was started by someone else. Do not change the subject. While you're at it, pls invite him back to clarify the questions we have for him.
Define "fair assessment." So far, nothing that I've seen that's been posted has been fair. And that's the reason this thread has dragged on so long.
>>The ball is in your court.<<
Now it's in yours. -
Did you not attack darren with the questions you asked? You, questioning his skills and belt is also attacking another instructor.Originally posted by point:Since you are unable to fathom, it is understandable why you were agreeing.
The fact is, this thread was started by Darren's student(s) and attack ANOTHER instructor. They kept on harping about Darren not being well-liked.
Just like you claimed people are jealous of his achievement.
The fact remains the same, Darren's student(s) cum die-hard supporter(s) had been the one telling others Darren is not well liked and explain why, just like what you are doing. So far, no one attacked Darren but his student(s) had been attacking another instructor who is even listed in a legitimate BJJ academy.
The question remained unanswered --- where did Darren learn his BJJ and what belt is he holding?
Till now, I think I have asked 3 times and no answer but the usual derailing to what people dun like darren, people jealous of him.
For goodness sake! I even praised Darren for his impressive profile in Combat Academy's site! But BJJ is missing from his profile. And the issue here is BJJ right from the start.
Who has been picking? Right from the start, it is obviously this is targeted at the purple belt. He was insulted. His class was insulted. His students were insulted.
Why are Darren's "loyalists" so against the purple belt? Could it not be the same reasons they gave for people "against" Darren? If they felt Darren suffered prejudices from others, then why are they commiting the SAME onto others?
It's a shame, and this reflect badly on Darren. And this is totally unfair to Darren too.
sigh
Yes you did praised him but you also insinuate slyly that bjj is missing from his profile. Don't make yourself look good.
The rest about darren i'm not commenting b/c i'm not his student, so i don't know much. I'm not siding with any one here. Just feeling some of you so-called "defenders" are guilty of bashing others too. -
So are you saying that John Will gives out BJJ belts when the person is not deserving, is that what you're implying?
I don't think John Will gives out belt when the person is not deserving. But there has been cases where a practitioner stops training or hasn't been training much so that causes a dip in skill level. I'm not saying that jason's skills has dipped, in case "point" quote and pick a quarrel with me again. I'm just showing that's another scenario to consider.
Then you do know that in BJJ, a person's belt is representative of his skill level don't you? This can be easily resolved if you have any contentions.
Yes that's what i mean. -
Sigh... an extremely long post to reply to.
First up, thanks for the name of the BXG fighter. Was he trained up by BXG or did he go overseas to train and compete, came back and chose BXG to represent? I'm asking becaue I don't know.
>>So are you saying that John Will gives out BJJ belts when the person is not deserving, is that what you're implying?<<
Nope, that's what the thread starter implied.
>>I think there are no rumours, you guys could easily have verified the truth if you wanted to. Let me know if you'd like me to pull up all the previous posts to prove this to you.
This smells to me like a personal vendetta. And I think you guys know each other, it's clear that you are from MMA Academy, and Albinogorilla is affilated with the gym. In fact, I have a good idea who he is.<<
Good for you. Settle this with him. I have no idea.
>>Then you do know that in BJJ, a person's belt is representative of his skill level don't you? This can be easily resolved if you have any contentions.<<
Maybe that's the issue. So since Brenden, a multiple white belt champion from Melbourne, from the same lineage, is here. Why don't you ask him what he thinks? I'm sure he should be a good judge. He has chosen not to train with Jason. What are Jason's competitive credentials anyway. I can't seem to find them online.
A BJJ belt is indeed supposed to be a representative of a person's skill level. I have a friend who was under Bruno Pano of Gracie Sydney. He's not there anymore - working in HK. He's a white belt still and according to him, Bruno only promotes you to the next belt if you top your division in your state, i.e. u become the white belt champion, then u get promoted. That's a high standard to uphold and maybe not all practioners follow that. So some blue/purple/etc belts are harder to come by then others.
>>On hindsight it was wrong of me to bring Darren into this discussion. He has nothing to do with this (I hope) and I apologize.<<
Actually, it was his students who did that and we kind of cornered ourselves Mr. Logical Proof. So no worries.
>>No I'm not, it's nothing that a few phone calls and some research will not dig up.<<
Dude, not so free leh.
>>I'm not asking for a website. I'm asking for the name of the person who awarded him his said belt in BJJ, and his contact info if any. It is not difficult to find out if this person is legit and did give out the belt, as long as I can have his name.<<
Darren is currently a blue belt and was awarded the belt by Andrew Gorton of Roots Academy in Sydney under Paulo Guimaraes. Andrew Gorton was a former BJJ blue belt world champion. He's a purple now. Did some quick googling and here's what I found: (search for "Andrew Gorton" on the pages)
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2003/campeonatosem2003/copadomundo2003/resultados.htm
http://www.onzuka.com/news_2004July2.html
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2004/copadomundo2004/resultados.htm
Paulo is a 2nd generation Rickson Gracie black belt. Our gym is affiliated to the Roots academy.
>>I'm not trying to stir shit. I'm trying to clear up an allegation that was started by someone else. Do not change the subject. While you're at it, pls invite him back to clarify the questions we have for him.
Define "fair assessment." So far, nothing that I've seen that's been posted has been fair. And that's the reason this thread has dragged on so long.<<
I have no idea who the thread starter is and I couldn't care less.
It seems that this thread is going to go nowhere if you keep on arguing with him. As Darren's student, I'd like to help clear up this mess. What I'm suggesting is that WE visit the two academies and see/test for ourselves. And then, we come back here and talk about the quality of training/people/instructor/etc instead of letting rumours fly around.
The ball is still in your court actually but I'll be nice and drop you a PM. =) -
Well that pretty much sums it up..Originally posted by samadhi_fire:Darren is currently a blue belt and was awarded the belt by Andrew Gorton of Roots Academy in Sydney under Paulo Guimaraes. Andrew Gorton was a former BJJ blue belt world champion. He's a purple now. Did some quick googling and here's what I found: (search for "Andrew Gorton" on the pages)
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2003/campeonatosem2003/copadomundo2003/resultados.htm
http://www.onzuka.com/news_2004July2.html
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2004/copadomundo2004/resultados.htm
Paulo is a 2nd generation Rickson Gracie black belt. Our gym is affiliated to the Roots academy. -
Thank you for sharing. It just show how bias you are.Originally posted by BlackbeltJones:Their guys won most of the medal tallies in the sub grappling comp, so naturally this shows that their team is one of the best in that comp. They are just showing proofs.
Compared to the medal tallies?..this is two different ballgames altogether,man!
You know this is like "but he said that first!" ..ARE you like 7yo?
If he is a purple then he is expected to tap out whites. But to come on here and state that he taps out the poor guy 4x in a min..jesus..
And i also realised that you like to put words like 'boasted' in your comments to make them look bad. Are you one of jason's students? I want to know if their school have students like you.
Compared to showing off medal tallies of unknown competitions, it is obvious.
Why do you have to resort to personal attack against me? I am just comparing since you accused the purple belt of being proud because he mentioned a little incident.
And you must be aware, it is taka who mentioned and taka admitted he is a student.
I am sorry if "boast" hurt, but so far everyone can see how you guys attack another and kept on promoting Darren by "sharing proudly without shame" (this is not boasting?) about their "achievements" but unable to tell which particular competitions. However, thank you for showing how bias you are since using "joker" to insult another is acceptable but using "boasting" hurts you badly.
I am not sure about his students, but there are all kind of students in a school. And how do you judge? Bringing it to a personal level because you are unable to deal with the issue itself? Avoid my questions?
You are indeed shameless to simply avoid, twist the entire thing around and then blame ME. WOW!
PS: Till now, you and your buddies avoid answering my frequently asked questions. By now, we know why. Blackgorilla must have shared REAL information about the respective backgrounds of the instructors. -
samadhi_fire,
Thanks for clearing that up for us. You're the first one who has provided any concrete information of any sort.
I did not realize that a blue belt in BJJ can award another a blue belt, but I may be mistaken.
Thank you for your PM and your invitation to visit your gym.
I think it will be more productive if you invite Albinogorilla to visit Jason's gym to roll with him and access his skill level, since that was the original assertion on this thread.
Being totally clueless about grappling, I can offer absolutely no judgement of who's training is better. My google-fu is strong, but my grappling-fu is not.
Or as the thais like to say, "Leave it for the ring." The best way to judge will be in future grappling tourneys. -
Excuse me, but asking what belt he is holding and where he previously trained in BJJ is ATTACK?Originally posted by BlackbeltJones:Did you not attack darren with the questions you asked? You, questioning his skills and belt is also attacking another instructor.
Yes you did praised him but you also insinuate slyly that bjj is missing from his profile. Don't make yourself look good.
The rest about darren i'm not commenting b/c i'm not his student, so i don't know much. I'm not siding with any one here. Just feeling some of you so-called "defenders" are guilty of bashing others too.
I am just finding out more since it was not available on his profile. I even praised he got an impressive profile! But nothing about BJJ.
Make myself look good? I am not the one boasting about my medals! How can this make me look good? I just saw a thread here with one aim that is to bash a purple belt and then filled with baseless and contradicting attacks. So to be fair, I asked anyone to share their background. Blackgorilla shared a summary of it and I thank him for that.
To be fair to Darren, I cannot simply take blackgorilla's words. I mean, he mentioned Darren learnt from books and DVDs. So I was asking, hopefully Darren's supporters can share the truth. How is this attacking? Unless, what blackgorilla shared is the truth, and Darren indeed learn BJJ from books and DVDs, otherwise this is a good chance for Darren's supporters to show to everyone.
Until now, how did anyone bash Darren? By asking? While what did you do? Mockery at the purple belt?
Sorry folks, I do not look down on Darren, I do not dislike him either. I would say the same about his students HERE base on their behaviour here.
I saw his profile and it was quite impressive. But the fact remain, he is obviously proficient in Boxing, Hapkido and probably self-defense. The issue here is however regarding BJJ. Therefore, if I were to train with him, I will learn boxing, hapkido and maybe self-defense too. If I were to train BJJ, I will find a legitimate instructor with proper background from a genuine academy.
And since the students of Darren HERE are bashing the purple belt Jason, why not go there and experience the truth? It is not some underground training as suggested by you guys, the address is there, available to everyone. Go there and make Jason tap out! Prove yourself! No one can argue anymore if you succeed. If you fail to, what will that show?
BTW, I am just speaking from a neutral point of view as a stand up MA practitioner who had very limited grappling training. I just cannot stand people manipulating on forums to attack another. Not happy, go challange. Talk is cheap! And the school is not very far from North Canal Road either.
Please share when you guys going down. I am sure some members here would like to be witness for you guys. And we can share the evidence! -
Originally posted by samadhi_fire:
Thank you for sharing these information. And I agree with you, visit both and test if ourselves and not spread rumour or bash one another.
Darren is currently a blue belt and was awarded the belt by Andrew Gorton of Roots Academy in Sydney under Paulo Guimaraes. Andrew Gorton was a former BJJ blue belt world champion. He's a purple now. Did some quick googling and here's what I found: (search for "Andrew Gorton" on the pages)
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2003/campeonatosem2003/copadomundo2003/resultados.htm
http://www.onzuka.com/news_2004July2.html
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2004/copadomundo2004/resultados.htm
Paulo is a 2nd generation Rickson Gracie black belt. Our gym is affiliated to the Roots academy.
Define "fair assessment." So far, nothing that I've seen that's been posted has been fair. And that's the reason this thread has dragged on so long.<<
I have no idea who the thread starter is and I couldn't care less.
It seems that this thread is going to go nowhere if you keep on arguing with him. As Darren's student, I'd like to help clear up this mess. What I'm suggesting is that WE visit the two academies and see/test for ourselves. And then, we come back here and talk about the quality of training/people/instructor/etc instead of letting rumours fly around.
The ball is still in your court actually but I'll be nice and drop you a PM. =)
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Happy training! -
Oops,Originally posted by BlackbeltJones:So are you saying that John Will gives out BJJ belts when the person is not deserving, is that what you're implying?
I don't think John Will gives out belt when the person is not deserving. But there has been cases where a practitioner stops training or hasn't been training much so that causes a dip in skill level. I'm not saying that jason's skills has dipped, in case "point" quote and pick a quarrel with me again. I'm just showing that's another scenario to consider.
Then you do know that in BJJ, a person's belt is representative of his skill level don't you? This can be easily resolved if you have any contentions.
Yes that's what i mean.
I think you forgot to change your login nick to reply to this....LOL! -
OMG! using multiple accounts is sooooooooooooooooo LAME!Originally posted by BlackbeltJones:So are you saying that John Will gives out BJJ belts when the person is not deserving, is that what you're implying?
I don't think John Will gives out belt when the person is not deserving. But there has been cases where a practitioner stops training or hasn't been training much so that causes a dip in skill level. I'm not saying that jason's skills has dipped, in case "point" quote and pick a quarrel with me again. I'm just showing that's another scenario to consider.
Then you do know that in BJJ, a person's belt is representative of his skill level don't you? This can be easily resolved if you have any contentions.
Yes that's what i mean.
It is dangerous too, I advise strongly against such practise since one moment of folly and you will expose yourself and send everything you have said earlier down the drain.
Now I am wondering who is albinogorilla...........hmmmmmmmmmm
Anyway, Darren? or Darren's student? We do not know why you need to do this.
See you on Friday, if you are going.
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who cares la, they can still kick our arses
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True, imagine if they can do the same in real and turn into multiple opponents. That's frightening!Originally posted by Simon Dean:who cares la, they can still kick our arses -
Friday go where huh?? You all going down to darren's place or jason's place to try?? I want to go see see leh
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But i will Love to see darren n jason have a go and see who is the better grappler.But who win also no different to me, the most important who is the better teacher...
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Can you please make a trip down and tell him personally?Originally posted by Brend:Keep it up guys, You people are doing a great job and i think we can hit 200posts.
Students of jason: pls tell him to return my Mark Kerr's smashing maching dvd to me. Don't make me report to the police.
brenden -
If this discussion is going nowhere, the thread will be closed any time without warning. Please settle all these peacefully. No vulgarities please.
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finally this forum have some activity but now the moderator cease it.
Anyway dont see whats the big deal abt a high rank being defeated by a white belt such things isn't uncommon. The white might be skill in other forms of art -
I have not ceased it till it gets worse.
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LOL!! I smell BULLSHIT!Originally posted by samadhi_fire:Sigh... an extremely long post to reply to.
First up, thanks for the name of the BXG fighter. Was he trained up by BXG or did he go overseas to train and compete, came back and chose BXG to represent? I'm asking becaue I don't know.
>>So are you saying that John Will gives out BJJ belts when the person is not deserving, is that what you're implying?<<
Nope, that's what the thread starter implied.
>>I think there are no rumours, you guys could easily have verified the truth if you wanted to. Let me know if you'd like me to pull up all the previous posts to prove this to you.
This smells to me like a personal vendetta. And I think you guys know each other, it's clear that you are from MMA Academy, and Albinogorilla is affilated with the gym. In fact, I have a good idea who he is.<<
Good for you. Settle this with him. I have no idea.
>>Then you do know that in BJJ, a person's belt is representative of his skill level don't you? This can be easily resolved if you have any contentions.<<
Maybe that's the issue. So since Brenden, a multiple white belt champion from Melbourne, from the same lineage, is here. Why don't you ask him what he thinks? I'm sure he should be a good judge. He has chosen not to train with Jason. What are Jason's competitive credentials anyway. I can't seem to find them online.
A BJJ belt is indeed supposed to be a representative of a person's skill level. I have a friend who was under Bruno Pano of Gracie Sydney. He's not there anymore - working in HK. He's a white belt still and according to him, Bruno only promotes you to the next belt if you top your division in your state, i.e. u become the white belt champion, then u get promoted. That's a high standard to uphold and maybe not all practioners follow that. So some blue/purple/etc belts are harder to come by then others.
>>On hindsight it was wrong of me to bring Darren into this discussion. He has nothing to do with this (I hope) and I apologize.<<
Actually, it was his students who did that and we kind of cornered ourselves Mr. Logical Proof. So no worries.
>>No I'm not, it's nothing that a few phone calls and some research will not dig up.<<
Dude, not so free leh.
>>I'm not asking for a website. I'm asking for the name of the person who awarded him his said belt in BJJ, and his contact info if any. It is not difficult to find out if this person is legit and did give out the belt, as long as I can have his name.<<
Darren is currently a blue belt and was awarded the belt by Andrew Gorton of Roots Academy in Sydney under Paulo Guimaraes. Andrew Gorton was a former BJJ blue belt world champion. He's a purple now. Did some quick googling and here's what I found: (search for "Andrew Gorton" on the pages)
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2003/campeonatosem2003/copadomundo2003/resultados.htm
http://www.onzuka.com/news_2004July2.html
http://www.cbjjo.com.br/resultados/campeonatos2004/copadomundo2004/resultados.htm
Paulo is a 2nd generation Rickson Gracie black belt. Our gym is affiliated to the Roots academy.
>>I'm not trying to stir shit. I'm trying to clear up an allegation that was started by someone else. Do not change the subject. While you're at it, pls invite him back to clarify the questions we have for him.
Define "fair assessment." So far, nothing that I've seen that's been posted has been fair. And that's the reason this thread has dragged on so long.<<
I have no idea who the thread starter is and I couldn't care less.
It seems that this thread is going to go nowhere if you keep on arguing with him. As Darren's student, I'd like to help clear up this mess. What I'm suggesting is that WE visit the two academies and see/test for ourselves. And then, we come back here and talk about the quality of training/people/instructor/etc instead of letting rumours fly around.
The ball is still in your court actually but I'll be nice and drop you a PM. =)
Suddenly Darren is a blue belt. 10 posts ago he was "only" a submission grappler. Well, in the Stritstimes he claimed to be a greco-roman wrestler.... His legend is rising faster than Bruce Lee. Imagine a blue belt that has never participated in a tournament.....hehe.
Waiting for more legendary bullshit. Call the Mythbusters from Discovery Channel! -
Well, perhaps it's time to take up grappling then. =)Originally posted by NoRiceBoys:samadhi_fire,
Thanks for clearing that up for us. You're the first one who has provided any concrete information of any sort.
I did not realize that a blue belt in BJJ can award another a blue belt, but I may be mistaken.
Thank you for your PM and your invitation to visit your gym.
I think it will be more productive if you invite Albinogorilla to visit Jason's gym to roll with him and access his skill level, since that was the original assertion on this thread.
Being totally clueless about grappling, I can offer absolutely no judgement of who's training is better. My google-fu is strong, but my grappling-fu is not.
Or as the thais like to say, "Leave it for the ring." The best way to judge will be in future grappling tourneys.
Anyway, Andrew awarded Darren his belt as a purple belt, not a a blue belt. Notice I said FORMER blue belt world champion. As for albinogorilla, still don't know who he is but I'll be sure to give him a good kick if I do. Hehe -
I hope you're not referring to me. I, for one, do not have a black belt, much less an afro.Originally posted by NoRiceBoys:Oops,
I think you forgot to change your login nick to reply to this....LOL!