Making Room for Atheism
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Due to the recent debate on atheism, I have just read an interesting post from a believers standpoint that I thought I would post up for those who are interested in the debate.
By John Piper
The church exists “to spread a passion for the supremacy of God in all things for the joy of all peoples through Jesus Christ.” That is our mission. “All things” means business, industry, education, media, sports, arts, leisure, government, and all the details of our lives.
Ideally this means God should be recognized and trusted as supreme by every person he has made. But the Bible teaches plainly that there will never be a time before Jesus comes back when all people will honor him as supreme (2 Thessalonians 1:6-10).
So how do we express a passion for GodÂ’s supremacy in a pluralistic world where most people do not recognize God as an important part of their lives, let alone an important part of government or education or business or industry or art or recreation or entertainment?
Answer: We express a passion for the supremacy of God...
1) by maintaining a conviction at all times that God is ever-present and gives all things their most important meaning. He is the Creator, Sustainer, and Governor of all things. We must keep in our minds the truth that all things exist to reveal something of GodÂ’s infinite perfections. The full meaning of everything, from shoestrings to space shuttles, is the way they relate to God.
2) by trusting God in every circumstance to use his creative, sustaining, governing wisdom and power to work all things together for the good of all who love him. This is faith in the future grace of all that God promises to be for us in Jesus.
3) by making life choices that reveal the supreme worth of God above what the world values supremely. “The steadfast love of the Lord is better than life” (Psalm 63:3). So we will choose to die rather than lose sweet fellowship with God. This will show his supremacy over all that life offers.
4) by speaking to people of GodÂ’s supreme worth in creative and persuasive ways, and by telling people how they can be reconciled to God through Christ, so that they can enjoy GodÂ’s supremacy as protection and help, rather than fear it as judgment.
5) by making clear that God himself is the foundation for our commitment to a pluralistic democratic order — not because pluralism is his ultimate ideal, but because in a fallen world, legal coercion will not produce the kingdom of God. Christians agree to make room for non-Christian faiths (including naturalistic, materialistic faiths), not because commitment to God’s supremacy is unimportant, but because it must be voluntary, or it is worthless. We have a God-centered ground for making room for atheism. “If my kingship were of this world, my servants would fight” (John 18:36). The fact that God establishes his kingdom through the supernatural miracle of faith, not firearms, means that Christians in this age will not endorse coercive governments — Christian or secular.
This is why we resist the coercive secularization implied in some laws that repress Christian activity in public places. It is not that we want to establish Christianity as the law of the land. That is intrinsically impossible, because of the spiritual nature of the kingdom. It is rather because repression of free exercise of religion and persuasion is as wrong against Christians as it is against secularists.
We believe this tolerance is rooted in the very nature of the gospel of Christ. In one sense, tolerance is pragmatic: freedom and democracy seem to be the best political order humans have conceived.
But for Christians it is not purely pragmatic: the spiritual, relational nature of GodÂ’s kingdom is the ground of our endorsement of pluralism, until Christ comes with rights and authority that we do not have.
Originally published in A Godward Life (Multnomah, 1997) -
This is why we resist the coercive secularization implied in some laws that repress Christian activity in public places. It is not that we want to establish Christianity as the law of the land. That is intrinsically impossible, because of the spiritual nature of the kingdom. It is rather because repression of free exercise of religion and persuasion is as wrong against Christians as it is against secularists.
what happens when other religions also want to do the same on the same piece of ground? esp religions opposed to christianity? for eg, Islam? Or if Satanists wish to do the same? Or Pagans? Wiccas?
do they all not deserve the same rights as christians? or are christians just finding thinly veiled excuses for something else? -
but in everything that has been done, do you see anyone trying to phase out islam or paganism or the satanists? the whole aim of secularization is to phase out christianity, but has there ever been legislation phasing out islam or paganism etc? Other relisions have been given the same rights as christianity, but are now using those rights to quash christians rights.Originally posted by HENG@:what happens when other religions also want to do the same on the same piece of ground? esp religions opposed to christianity? for eg, Islam? Or if Satanists wish to do the same? Or Pagans? Wiccas?
do they all not deserve the same rights as christians? or are christians just finding thinly veiled excuses for something else? -
phase out? just like how Xtianity phased out paganism and other keltic and anglo saxon related religions?Originally posted by breytonhartge:but in everything that has been done, do you see anyone trying to phase out islam or paganism or the satanists? the whole aim of secularization is to phase out christianity, but has there ever been legislation phasing out islam or paganism etc? Other relisions have been given the same rights as christianity, but are now using those rights to quash christians rights.
how does simply not having any sort of religious displays in a public area count as phasing it out? for eg, im aware that in America, they're fighting to remove things like the 10 commandments from courtrooms and schools etc. Christians can hang them in their homes and in church for all anyone else cares.
Why isn't the 11 Satanic commandments or Islamic Laws displayed in public schools and government buildings then? unfair?
its simply leveling the playing field for everyone. if Secularism really wants to phase out christianity, shouldn't they be arguing for churches to be demolished and attending church to be outlawed instead?
Xtians have to stop having this "victim syndrome" attitude. I dun see the people of religion they've phased out and oppressed for thousands of years doing the same thing. Xtians seem to take every request for them to respect the religions of others as an affront to them. Maybe in all honestly, u lot are just far too sensitive towards yourselves, and far too insensitive towards others. -
I love the irony. That a religion that once phased out so many other religions now finds a need to complain about being phased out by secularism. Secularism is certainly not trying to phase anyone out. However, it IS trying to distribute an equal amount of respect and rights to every religion.
then again, good for u lot to feel this way. maybe now xtians understand how all the Kelts, Pagans, Wiccans, Crusade victims - Cathars and Muslims alike, felt all those years ago. -
Nice way of putting things into prospective...Originally posted by HENG@:I love the irony. That a religion that once phased out so many other religions now finds a need to complain about being phased out by secularism. Secularism is certainly not trying to phase anyone out. However, it IS trying to distribute an equal amount of respect and rights to every religion.
then again, good for u lot to feel this way. maybe now xtians understand how all the Kelts, Pagans, Wiccans, Crusade victims - Cathars and Muslims alike, felt all those years ago. -
Well put HENG@!! Clap clap clapOriginally posted by HENG@:I love the irony. That a religion that once phased out so many other religions now finds a need to complain about being phased out by secularism. Secularism is certainly not trying to phase anyone out. However, it IS trying to distribute an equal amount of respect and rights to every religion.
then again, good for u lot to feel this way. maybe now xtians understand how all the Kelts, Pagans, Wiccans, Crusade victims - Cathars and Muslims alike, felt all those years ago.