City Harvest church founder Kong Hee and 4 others arrested
-
Originally posted by laurence82:
are peranakans christian btw?
er....they can be all in one...but not one for all... -
Originally posted by Be Objective:
Thanks for the objective feedback to my opinions.
Yes, "big is better " mentality has taken a hold on the church leaders ...agreed ..in fact for Singapore, there is no need to build big buildings.. look at so many buildings that are under utilized during the weekends and what the church needed is some kind of creativity... and you know whether they need to build even bigger buildings....
Yes, proof is needed for the "good that CHC has done". looking at those numbers presented, it seems that there is poor stewardship of the money being allocated to the respective causes. The issue is poor allocation. Unless poor allocation leads to mistakes and mistakes leads to mischief which eventually leads to misappropriation. What I was pointing out that in the initally years of CHC, they are well known to every youth (which has Christian background) in town. The youth found a new meaning and relevance in going to church to worship. That is already a big achievement and cannot be measured in terms of funds allocation. Many churches have failed in reaching to the next generation and CHC has in a way succeeded. Hence, I measure this by the fruits. In other aspect, I measure it according to motivation. If the motivation behind the "give more" sermons is to accumulate more funds for the church so that they can squander and allocate wrongly to the inappropriate causes, then the motivation is wrong. If the motive is for the benefits of the individual , then it is a different story. The result of big funds coming in is as a result of the right sermon.
I have helped youth in the past and have big problems dealing with committees in churches who are too conservative and irrelevant in reaching to today's youth. What CHC has achieved , just by looking at their sheer youth population mix already put many churches to shame. However, the issue here about CHC is mis-management and probably poor stewardship since the wrong doing is not yet proven in court.
So, we should instead help them back to the right motivation back in their early days. Where things are much simpler and motives are pure.
1. I wouldn't say that "reaching the youth" is an achievement of CHC. It is more accurate to say CHC has reached a "section of" the youth. practices are well known. CHC members invite their friends to Church, those who repulsed soon leave and those who are not repulsed become fervent members. Only a section of those "reached out to" are kept.
2. The issue goes beyond "allocation and motivation of funds" to the fund raising practices themselves.
By focusing on the allocation alone, we are leaving out that the congregation was not informed of the allocated purposes in the first place. Any attendee of CHC can attest that CHC takes pride in pointing out that no funds go to KH's personal expenses, his weekly first class travel, his wife's career and so on. So the alleged diversion is deception.
3. In addition to alleged deception, there is alleged diversion of funds from one account to another, to conceal the act from donors towards one specific purpose.
Lastly, I suggest you refrain from pronouncing whose feedback is objective and and whose is not.
-
i repeat
closet CHC member
life in sgforums is surreal
-
Ha ha, perhaps I have been too technical and objective in my approach.... leading to the suspicion from someone who thinks i am a closet CHC member. Perhaps i should also consider some of the emotions beneath this forum.
Anyway, I am just a professional based in China for some years now , and looking at this saga from afar. I confessed that I did not know about his first class travel, and I clearly agreed that we must also look at the fund raising practices itself.
As I have said, I am not for raising funds for big buildings , because from my assessment of the property landscape in Singapore, we have too many buildings that are under utilized during the weekends that can be used for Church worship and activities... and I am not saying that they are not guilty in the first place , because indeed technically they are not unless proven and sentenced in court. I am definitely not for the reported mansion that they rented in USA .... Even a listed company , if properly managed , the management during travelling or based overseas do not spend such money recklessly, and there is so much to say about the leadership of the church..
What I was trying to say is that CHC as an organization has many other aspects that are positive, and the "project of using Sun as an outreach to the youths and certain part of society" is indeed questionable from the way it is being carried out. In fact, instead of raising a new star, if they wanted to use this path for evangelism, there are many stars that are converted christians that they can use in Hongkong and Taiwan.
Hence, it is better to set this apart so that the gangrene part of the body can be removed and the whole body can still be healthy.
Lastly, I have been to big churches when I was in Singapore many years ago and have seen how the inner circle breaks down when the congregation goes beyond a certain size .... due to selfish ambitions, jealousy, ...etc
But I have also seen many other churches , who could not keep up with the big churches , speaking unkindly of the big churches....
Singapore by nature is a compettive place. This spirit of competitiveness can lead to many evils....if not managed properly. The church is not spared of this.... Many years ago, someone has prophesied that unless the churches in Singapore learn how to sacrifice and give, ie. instead of having the "fish tank" mentality... , the leadership will always be subjected to the temptations and sometime yield to it.... as we have seen....
Asking God for success is easy, because He will give if we humbly ask .... Consistently Attributing the successes to God after obtaining it is difficult....
-
life in sgforums is surreal
where is char?
-
Hey, takes time to log into a new account, you know.
-
whether one has a religion or not, the basic courtesies, morals and civic mindedness, and thus character of every individual has to be re-inculcated since young...but sadly this responsibility has been pushed to schools, and vice versa, the schools pushes back with only getting the students pass their exams and with flying distinctions for the name sake of the school.....
the question does not rest on religion to make a person better, in fact, religious establishments in competitive rivalries only inculcate values to enhance the growth and their reputation...now this is an unfortunate development for religious developments...it is the horn of plenty and power which dictates their agenda...instead of spiritual growth....
thus, not just religions, schools, parents all play a significant part in shaping the mentality and character of the future gens....
-
i know, so i gave up my other 3 clone accounts
-
they were sillypig82, oinkoink82 and toopidzhutou82
-
at least they are not professortoopidvu, taonaopaivu, and silverpantspermedhairvu
-
i will surely ask fifi bite your 12 teats off your chest
-
so much angst.
-
life is tough like overcooked beef
-
we dun need s3x becos the gahment fuck us everyday
-
Life is suffering.
-
Originally posted by charlize:
Life is suffering.
And u laughing?
-
Parents cannot take it for granted that their children are good just because they join a certain religious group and let them go without understanding the changes in their personality and character development.
-
Originally posted by Honeybunz:
And u laughing?
Will crying relieve you of your pain?
-
Some people like to give until tears roll down.
-
knn char
-
charlize is so humorous
-
And that is the next thing we will shut down - mark my words - hahahaha
A local YouTube parody channel ‘DiarySG’, has officially been shut down as of 10 July. The channel started broadcasting two years ago.
The channel specializes in making parody videos based on local happenings in Singapore, particularly those pertaining to the political scene and social issues.
No one has been spared DiarySG’s brand of humour, everyone from Nicole Seah to Ronaldo, Wayne Rooney and even president Tony Tan, has been given a go over by them.
According to their Facebook page, the YouTube channel, with over 800 videos, was shut down because of alleged copyright infringement filed by Pastor Kong Hee of City Harvest Church (CHC).
DiarySG supposedly received a letter from CHC asking them to cease using the Church’s material.
The day after the letter arrived, the channel officially shut down due to copyright infringement claims being filed with YouTube and its parent company Google.
In a statement released to the public, Bobby Chaw, the pastor in charge of missions at CHC expressed disappointment with some of the media's coverage so far, particularly in relation to the COC inquiry
-
Let's look over Donkey's quotes, powerpoint slides and speeches and see if there is any copyright infringement.
Never mind if we don't sue. We put it together in a video and just publicise it. Hypocrisy.
-
Dun tell me CHC go copyright ChinaWine and DiarySG go do parady on ChinaWine...
DairySG is known for funny parody for quite alot of stuff...