Police involvement on TDs cases
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Over the years I have encountered many fare cheat cases and 1 road rage case. Of the fare cheat cases I only reported 3 cos above $10. It seems the reaction from different police stations are different and there's no SOP. One time the officer advised me this is more of a civil case and were not keen to even record my case and asked me to go to LTA there's a counter can get refund? I didn't check whether there's such a counter as seems unlikely. Others just record my case but all no outcome. Seems no action/investigation whatsoever. As for the road rage case I reported my case with the private car to Tanglin Police station. I was fetching 1 tourist to AP on PIE near Tampines. I kept safe distance from car in front. The private car (Honda Fit) cut in without signalling and I slowed down let him in. Later when there's no traffic in front he slowed down and road hog. After a while, I signal left and want to filter out. He immediate filter left and block me. To avoid collision I filtered to 3rd lane and then overtook him to remain on PIE (3rd lane exit to TPE). The car than tailgate me to AP. At AP I took a spot in full view of camera. After Pax settled, 2 big guys came out and gestured aggressively and shouting at me like hooligans. I locked the doors and ignored them. Later one of them kicked my taxi at the front above the tyre causing a big dent..
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After reporting the case, the police managed to find the driver of the registration no. But I gave the wrong model (Honda Jazz) and the driver denied kicking my car. I wasn't sure they found the right car but the police arranged a meeting at the station. At the station I recognised the driver and told the police so. Then the officer said that his job is just to arrange the meeting and to make sure we don't fight?!! He said this is a civil case and I have to find a lawyer to get compensation from him. He will not take any action or investigate further and we can discuss on the settlement outside the station. I was quite pissed but no choice kept cool. I threaten to find the best lawyer to sue him if he doesn't admit. I bluff him that I had checked with the AP police who had video of the incident. Later outside the station the driver admitted that his son the other guy did kicked my car and than bargain over how much to pay me.. Though I managed to get compensation I was not happy with the police's handling...if he continue to deny I might not get anything done..!!
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Does any members have such experiences? I'm still wondering what role the police play in such cases. Do they get involved only when TDs chase after Pax/fare cheats and get beaten OBK? Then they are encouraging TDs to confront fare cheats.
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police cannot gao tim ah long alr, this kind of case even peanuts to them.. not really sure what the role of police.. but the budget for them keep increasing.. just in case they all also take mc..
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Police is can siam they siam....For the road rage is definately NOT A CIVIL case. Road rage can end up in jail one. If the IO is on one then they will take action.
Got once I had an incident. I jio one motorbike rider because he KNN road hog I honk he buay song. That time I am driving my own car. Then he buay song jio me stop one side talk. The place of incident is YCK Road towards Lentor Ave before the traffic light. He damn yaya so I whack him jia liat. By right this kind is civil case. But the CB Kia hum ji go report police. Then I go down KPKB the IO then she buay song charge me Road Rage. I engage lawyer fight they amend the charge to affray then charge both of us. Then in the end drop charge cos my lawyer ask them SMLJ affray? Only 2 of us fighting mah....btw affray in penal code is "Where 2 or more persons disturb the public peace by fighting in a public place". KNN that place is empty piece of land so where got disturb public peace?
But the other party no lawyer kanna fine $2K for affray....Lol
Singapore is like that one. Protect rich people who can afford lawyer. Btw I not rich and the lawyer is FOC one....haha
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Originally posted by hammerhammer8888:
Police is can siam they siam....For the road rage is definately NOT A CIVIL case. Road rage can end up in jail one. If the IO is on one then they will take action.
Got once I had an incident. I jio one motorbike rider because he KNN road hog I honk he buay song. That time I am driving my own car. Then he buay song jio me stop one side talk. The place of incident is YCK Road towards Lentor Ave before the traffic light. He damn yaya so I whack him jia liat. By right this kind is civil case. But the CB Kia hum ji go report police. Then I go down KPKB the IO then she buay song charge me Road Rage. I engage lawyer fight they amend the charge to affray then charge both of us. Then in the end drop charge cos my lawyer ask them SMLJ affray? Only 2 of us fighting mah....btw affray in penal code is "Where 2 or more persons disturb the public peace by fighting in a public place". KNN that place is empty piece of land so where got disturb public peace?
But the other party no lawyer kanna fine $2K for affray....Lol
Singapore is like that one. Protect rich people who can afford lawyer. Btw I not rich and the lawyer is FOC one....haha
Aiyo.. People see ur size sure scared one la!
btw i heard u stay at river valley near taka rite?
haha where got not rich? Can quit ur previous job become taxi driver le..
Last time u cell 8 rite?
kekeke
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Originally posted by Ohyaitsme:
Aiyo.. People see ur size sure scared one la!
btw i heard u stay at river valley near taka rite?
haha where got not rich? Can quit ur previous job become taxi driver le..
Last time u cell 8 rite?
kekeke
But last time I see his size, I not scare leh, I just laugh and laugh...kekeke
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Originally posted by Ohyaitsme:
Aiyo.. People see ur size sure scared one la!
btw i heard u stay at river valley near taka rite?
haha where got not rich? Can quit ur previous job become taxi driver le..
Last time u cell 8 rite?
kekeke
Haha St Thomas Walk to be exact. Stayed there a while. Anyway not my house.
You know I cell 8? Then I machine owner for which tool you know? Lol
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Originally posted by bowah:
But last time I see his size, I not scare leh, I just laugh and laugh...kekeke
I look comical meh?
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Originally posted by hammerhammer8888:
I look comical meh?
No lah, but cute cute like a panda.. -
Ya, for road rage case, think they would probably take more action if I was driving private car or some other issues involved. Saw in newpaper recent case, motorcyclist use helmet smash Taxi's side mirrors and windscreen. The motorcyclist was charged and fined $2000 for road rage. But this case TD smart make big issue, and he went see doctor say truamatised and managed to get 1 day MC even though no physical injuries!! Otherwise maybe also classify civil case go take own legal action.. Fare cheat cases- cases increasing. Saw one guy wrote about this issue in ST Forum or is it Today, for his father who is a taxi driver.Also highlighted lack of police assistance action. Few months already, I didn't see any reply... There's another case reported in Wanbao? Lady Taxi driver picked Ang Mo from AP to Changi Village Hotel. Ang Mo kept quiet throughout journey, reached destination say TD noisy talking on phone and refused to pay$ about $14 then rushed inside hotel. TD chased into hotel but hotel refused to entertain and reveal guest information. TD called Police, later they arrived listened to case and advised her take legal action , civil case..in the end no outcome.. Like that more paxs will be encouraged to take free taxi and the just complain this that..
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Originally posted by bowah:
No lah, but cute cute like a panda..KK or JJ? Or KKJ?
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Knn AP to CV so taiko trip also want to run fare....this AMK really is cheapo to the max. Imagine kanna taiko trip already tulan liao still run fare. Lucky I am not the TD...
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Actually I was hoping to see some comments/advice from Bro JoeRaj (cos he mentioned he's ex-police in 1 of his posts), if he's ok with it. His post reminded me of all these cases and prompt me write all these....
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Originally posted by Kenluc2000:
Actually I was hoping to see some comments/advice from Bro JoeRaj (cos he mentioned he’s ex-police in 1 of his posts), if he’s ok with it. His post reminded me of all these cases and prompt me write all these….
Ya think he is ex police...dunno is small fry or big dog?
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small fry or big dog, also can bite u..
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We taxi driver also need self defense... If pax or other rider/driver wack us or vehicle first.. We have the right to wack them back within 5 secs..
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Originally posted by hammerhammer8888:
KK or JJ? Or KKJ?
KK lah, from the back view only. ..kkj i not sure, haven't visit them to see it -
Originally posted by hammerhammer8888:
Ya think he is ex police...dunno is small fry or big dog?
Yes, he was a police before, if he stayed on, now should be commissioner liao, what a waste, if not can get free BJ. -
Originally posted by bowah:
Yes, he was a police before, if he stayed on, now should be commissioner liao, what a waste, if not can get free BJ.In fact there was a rumour about a former Commissioner (who has since retired) who was having an affair, so maybe it's true 1 of the perks of being CP is getting free BJs!!
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Originally posted by Kenluc2000:
Over the years I have encountered many fare cheat cases and 1 road rage case. Of the fare cheat cases I only reported 3 cos above $10. It seems the reaction from different police stations are different and there’s no SOP. One time the officer advised me this is more of a civil case and were not keen to even record my case and asked me to go to LTA there’s a counter can get refund? I didn’t check whether there’s such a counter as seems unlikely. Others just record my case but all no outcome. Seems no action/investigation whatsoever.
As for the road rage case I reported my case with the private car to Tanglin Police station. I was fetching 1 tourist to AP on PIE near Tampines. I kept safe distance from car in front. The private car (Honda Fit) cut in without signalling and I slowed down let him in. Later when there’s no traffic in front he slowed down and road hog. After a while, I signal left and want to filter out. He immediate filter left and block me. To avoid collision I filtered to 3rd lane and then overtook him to remain on PIE (3rd lane exit to TPE). The car than tailgate me to AP. At AP I took a spot in full view of camera. After Pax settled, 2 big guys came out and gestured aggressively and shouting at me like hooligans. I locked the doors and ignored them. Later one of them kicked my taxi at the front above the tyre causing a big dent..
By special request, here's my observations:
a) This is not road rage. In fact there's no specific law as road rage, it's a word coined by the press just like burglary.
The law as far as road rage (and all assault cases) cases usually would be:
a) VCH Sec 323 Cap 224
b) VCGH Sec 325 Cap 224 or
c) VCH by Dangeorus means or with dangerous weapons ( I forget the exact section)
b) and c) are seizable offences - means the police can arrest without warrant, and these kind of cases almost certainly will be pursued and the offender charged in court.
For a) VCH - this is not seizable and the victim will have to seek medical treatment and then lodge a complaint at the Crime Registry at the Sub Courts. The Magistrate then may direct the police to investigate this case. Or if the case has some public implications, the police themselves may decide to investigate the case. Either way the decision to prosecute the offender in these cases, lies with the DPP, not the police. If the DPP declines to pursue, then the victim may take a civil suit against the offender.
I shall not go into details as to what these may be, as there are a lot of factors that go into this.
Once the cases goes to court, it lies entirely with the judge to impose sentence if he finds the offender guilty.
For a) VCH - can range from a fine for non serious injury or a short jail term, alternatively this case can be compounded (settled out of court) if the offender pays the victim who agrees. The court must also agree to this, or the court can deny this and instead call the offender to stand trial.
b) and c) - longer jail term and almost certainly caning, for VCGH and most VCH by dangerous waepons. Sentences can range from weeks to months even years depending on injuries.
Serious injury here means broken bones, fractures, loss of use of limbs, permanent disfiguration of face - a swollen nose or eye that heals is not serious injury under the law. The offender will be charged under Sec 323 and likely be jailed but no caning.
The Courts have ruled that cases of assault resulting from incidents on the road (hence the term road rage) will almost certainly result in imprisonment unless there are compelling mitigating circumstances. Furthermore Courts also have taken a very dim view of assaults of public service drivers (inc TDs). Jail is also the norm for these cases. Length of jail term depends entirely on the charge and degree of injury. So that's why you see some cases, sentences appear lighter then others.
For Kenluc's case, this is not a case of assault, and hence the advice given by the policeman was correct. This was a dispute on the road, albeit one which traffic offences may have been committed. The police can only advice to lodge a report for civil action for damages (to the vehicle) and traffic offences for the others (also subjective here, because person reporting is not a police officer, TP will call both up and see what transpires. if both give conflicting views without independent evidence, then most probably just a stern warning).
As serious as it may look to you, under the Law that's what it is, definitely not road rage. If he hit you, then it may become road rage. But also as is aid, it depends which category the assault comes under. You may have to first lodge a report at the Sub Courts. Only if the offender is found guilty of a charge of assault resulting from an incident on the road, is that 'road rage' which would result in higher penalties.
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Originally posted by hammerhammer8888:
Police is can siam they siam....For the road rage is definately NOT A CIVIL case. Road rage can end up in jail one. If the IO is on one then they will take action.
Got once I had an incident. I jio one motorbike rider because he KNN road hog I honk he buay song. That time I am driving my own car. Then he buay song jio me stop one side talk. The place of incident is YCK Road towards Lentor Ave before the traffic light. He damn yaya so I whack him jia liat. By right this kind is civil case. But the CB Kia hum ji go report police. Then I go down KPKB the IO then she buay song charge me Road Rage. I engage lawyer fight they amend the charge to affray then charge both of us. Then in the end drop charge cos my lawyer ask them SMLJ affray? Only 2 of us fighting mah....btw affray in penal code is "Where 2 or more persons disturb the public peace by fighting in a public place". KNN that place is empty piece of land so where got disturb public peace?
But the other party no lawyer kanna fine $2K for affray....Lol
Singapore is like that one. Protect rich people who can afford lawyer. Btw I not rich and the lawyer is FOC one....haha
Yes you got lucky here, affray is when 2 persons are fighting. Assault is when only 1 does the hitting. If the other party did not retaliate, then you could have been charged for 1 of the 3 assault charges I listed, and very likely - jail.
Affray if did not involve weapons usually is a fine. Again you got a lawyer, who managed to convince the Court that the circumstances it happened failed to meet the legal ingredient (a public place or in the view of the public). You got lucky there, but would you risk a similar circumstance and a different judge?
There was 1 judge (dunno if he is still on the bench) who was related to Poh heng jewellers (i think). 1 of their shops got robbed, so every case of robbery that went before him, the offender kena jialat. Another judge had his car stolen, you can imagine offenders of vehicle theft facing him on trial and the consequences!
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But hammer2 is quite right also. IO if can siam will siam, depends on the type of IO you get or the division it falls under.
You kena ON IO, then he (esp a she will die die pursue) or if you made the IO pissed off with you. Alto the final decision lies with the DPP, the IO's (or his superior's) recommendation plays a crucial part.
And also if it's a busy division like A, E or G divisions, a lot of cases, your affray or assault might be a 'small case' so go on the back burner or the IO too busy or lazy to go all out, then chances are a leser charge or warning. But if your case came under F, D or J divisions, then not so busy division, chances are it will be pursued.
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Thankyou for yr most helpful, insightful and detailed clarifications. I've clearer picture and sets me thinking how to best react/deal with future cases of road rage or when there's no injuries, shud it be called "act of mischief" which I read somewhere... How about ways to deal with fare cheats. Trust u agree with rising COE, rental and big amount of fare needed to cover costs, this is a big concern for TDs. Bye for now... got to go even though raining now.. Once again thks bro... and no hurry..
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Ya the IO is a she....AMK Police Station.