19 Steps to becoming City Harvest Church member.
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if the authorities had spent 2 years investigating the matter, it will not be a 2 months conclusion or that simple...
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Originally posted by Fcukpap:
if the authorities had spent 2 years investigating the matter, it will not be a 2 months conclusion or that simple...
realli ?
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as u said it.....life is damn sure real...lol
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I can only said, let the law take it course and we will find out whether they are guilty . Just a personal thot, money is most of the time the root of all evil .
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are there any prominent singaporeans like Ministers, MPs, academics, artists, singers that are CHC members?
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CHC City Harvest Cult is a cult NOT a church.
Iaveapinion that is why you had so much pressure on you. CHC wants to control every pew warmer and squeeze you into their cult's mold. They want to make you into Kong Hee idol worshippers and Sun Ho Cd purchasers. The Bible in Romans says "Be not conformed to this world (or Kong Hee's world), but be you transformed by the renewing of your mind..."
CHC merchandises products of Phil Pringle another cult leader (C3). Pringle has taught Kong Hee a lot of his money scamming tricks and how to twist scriptures to manipulate cash out of the followers.
Crossover is a Conover and CAD and the police have a good case about money being stolen to fund Sun Ho's career. It's amazing that Phil Pringle believes Sun Ho is doing God's work when she prostitutes herself with her music, sings about murdering husbands, acts like a slut, and wears nipple revealing outfits! Pringle has conned the CHC Cult members to think the same.
Certainly the authorities wouldn't have released the info to the media if they didn't have a solid case against con man Kong Hee. CHC cult members...GET OUT WHILE THERE IS TIME...REPENT!
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CHC issues statement supporting Kong Hee
'Suspensions were A SURPRISE'
CHARGED: City Harvest Church founder Kong Hee outside court on Wednesday. TNP PICTURE:GARY GOH
REPORT: JOYCE LIM AND EUNICE TOH
CITY Harvest Church (CHC) founder Kong Hee will continue preaching at the church despite facing three charges of criminal breach of trust as an agent.
And so will his deputy pastor, Tan Ye Peng, 39, who faces 10 charges.
The church's executive pastor, Mr Aries Zulkarnain, said this in a statement issued by the church to the press last night.
He also said that the church is standing by its five members who were charged on Wednesday.
They faced several counts over the misuse of funds with the purported intention to finance Ms Ho Yeow Sun's secular music career to connect with people.
Ms Ho, 42, who goes by the stage name Sun Ho, is Kong's wife.
The court was told that $24 million was allegedly siphoned off in alleged sham bond investments and another $26.6 million was then used to allegedly cover the first sum.
Referring to the allegations, Mr Zulkarnain said: "It has been suggested that the church has been cheated of $50 million. This is not accurate.
"The $24 million, which went to investment bonds, was returned to the church in full, with interest. We didn't lose the $24 million, nor did we lose 'another $26.6m' as alleged.
"The church did not lose any funds in the relevant transactions, and no personal profit was gained by the individuals concerned."
Mr Boddy Chaw, the pastor in charge of missions at CHC, said that actions had been taken over the past two years in accordance with the Ministry of Community Development, Youth and Sports' code of governance.
Speaking on behalf of the CHC board, he added: "We replaced 50 per cent of our board with new members. We engaged RSM Chio Lim to do a full internal audit and we have been putting their recommendations into action, and will continue to do so."
He said the church was surprised that the Commissioner of Charities (COC) chose to implement the suspensions of the members invloved without prior notice.
"We have been co-operating with COC for two years since the start of the case, so these sudden suspensions came as a surprise to us," he said.
CHC's advisory pastor, Rev Dr Phil Pringle-who has travelled here from Sydney, Australia, to support the CHC leadership - said that he and CHC advisory chairman, Dr A.R Bernard, fully believe in and endorse the church's Crossover Project as a mission to reach the world.
Fundmental mission
The church states that the Crossover Project is not about one person's singing career but a mission that is fundamental to CHC's congregation.
The Business Times (BT) yesterday reported that it had earlier asked the police if the initial $24 million allegedly misappropriated was returned to the church.
Replying to this, a police spokesman told BT: "Generally, in law, the offence of criminal breach of trust of monies is established once there is misappropriation of the monies with the requisite intent, regardless of whether there have or have not been subsequent attempts at restitution by the accused."
After the news broke about the case, there have been mixed reactions online, including from church members.
Ms Ho and Kong, 47, are still active on Twitter, and Kong continues to receive many likes for his tweets, which are forwarded to his Facebook account.
A Kong supporter, Liza MCkenzie, wrote on his Facebook page: "There is a BIG DIFFERENCE in KNOWING A PERSON and KNOWING ABOUT A PERSON...and Pastor Kong is someone that I know, not someone that I know about...you have our support Pastor Kong! Don't give up."
But some church members have been questioning the money used to promote Ms Ho's singing career.
One church member who wanted to be known as only Mr B. Luo, 23, a student, told The New Paper yesterday: "If the funds were really used to fund her career, a lot of us would be disappointed.
"People starved themselves and sold their houses just to give to the fund. Before she went to Hollywood, the church fasted and prayed over it."
Some church members also see their pastor's wife as provocative and controversial.
A delivery assistant who wanted to be known only as Mr Vince, 33 said: "Before she became a singer, I found her a nice person. After she went into entertainment, we were told by some like Pastor Kong not to call her 'Pastor'."
Recalling how Ms Ho had worn an evening gown with a plunging neckline to the Hollywood Film Festival in 2003, he said: "I didn't feel shocked, but I found it provocative. I felt like she was no longer the person I used to know."
Not only was Mr Vince uncomfortable with Ms Ho's sexy dressing, he also did not like her song lyrics which he had heard in her music videos.
"I respect her as a pastor's wife, but not as a singer," he said.
Criticised
Some netizens have criticised Ms Ho for being untalented and having bought her way into Hollywood.
Earlier, in 2003, some CHC members had complained to the media about how Kong would show videos of Ms Ho and praise her at the start of the church service.
The members also expressed their displeasure over their church being used to drum up votes for Ms Ho at the MTV Asia Awards in 2003.
Mr Chua, 58, who used to attend CHC for six years, said he had felt "some sort of pressure" to buy Ms Ho's music CD albums.
"The church was very good at persuading the members to do so," said Mr Chua, a retiree, who paid about $20 for a CD which he has not listened to.
In 2003, a church member, Mr Roland Poon Siew Kay, complained to the press about how money was allegedly misused to fund Ms Ho's singing career.
He later had to apologise publicly to the couple in newspaper advertisements.
Investigations on church funds began years ago
REPORT: JUDITH TAN
CITY Harvest Church executive member Christopher Pang has questioned the Commissioner of Charities' (COC) motive for posting its findings before the five accused are convicted, calling it a pre-judgment that is defamatory.
He was also unhappy that the COC had suspended the five and three other church leaders from their roles in CHC.
But under the law, the COC has the right and authority to do so, as explained below.
Who is the Commissioner of Charities and what are his powers?
Before 2005, the Comptroller of Income Tax doubled as the COC.
He was charged with promoting the effective use of charitable resources by encouraging the development of better methods of administration, and investigating and checking abuses.
In September 2006, the Government appointed Mr Low Puk Yeong, then first deputy secretary at the Ministry of Environment and Water Resources, as the first full-time COC to oversee Singapore's charity groups.
Under the Charities Act, he has to promote compliance by those in charge of the charities, promote effective use of charitable resources and enhance the accountability.
He has the authority to identify and investigate apparent misconduct or mismanagement and disseminate information as he sees fit.The 15-member Charity Council advises the COC on areas such as the administration of the Charities Act.
The council also makes sure that regulations on charities are not too harsh.
Why did City Harvest Church come under the COC's microscope?
The COC kickstarted the investigation after receiving complaints on the misuse of church funds some years ago.
In 2010, the police rounded up 17 people, including pastor Kong Hee, for the alleged misuse of church funds.
The scope of the investigation then went beyond the church to include other companies related to the church.
When did CHC first come under COC's scrutiny?
CHC was one of the five Christian groups picked for the COC's first "governance review" in 2007 as it had the largest income among the charities under the Commissioner's purview.
Three auditors from Deloitte & Touche were stationed at the church to see how budgets were approved and how payments were made.
The COC found that the church had largely complied with regulations, but asked for more attention to be paid to loan policy and monitoring, donations to external parties and board members' objectivity.
Why is there a need for external auditors to examine the books of charities?
The measure was introduced with the overhaul of the charity sector after the 2005 National Kidney Foundation (NKF) scandal.
The lack of these checks had allowed the NKF to pay its former chief, Mr T.T. Durai, more than $600,000 a year, a sum which outraged Singaporeans.
Since 2008, more than 2,000 charitable organisations here have been automatically exempted from paying income taxes.
This means the nation indirectly becomes a stakeholder and there is a need for public accountability.
The charities not only owe their members an explanation, they also owe it to the public to come clean.
News, The New Paper, Friday, June 29 2012, Pg 2-3
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wot.
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@James_Tan_1983
Hi,
Thank you for your sincerity in sharing without resorting to inane name calling and baseless shouting and screaming.
Thank you for sharing your concerns and care about your friend. Thank you for your sensitivity and civility. Our hearts are with your friend, his wife and children.
I urge you not to give up on your friend. Believe that one day your friend will come to his senses. Like someone said, it’s like dealing with a loved one (family or friend) who is in gambling, drugs or in deep depression. It is hard to reason with them when they are in a spaced out state. It is even harder to see them reject and abuse you when you know that your intentions for them are good. But be strong and be there for him when he is ready.
Also get a support group amongst his friends or even amongst professionals to support his wife and children because indeed your friend is not the only one suffering, his family is too. They too need your help. I suggest a group as you should not bear the whole burden by yourself.
Caring phlxgm
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Originally posted by Zeeleewong:
CHC is My Home, My Family, My Church, My Life.
Pastor Kong dedicates his life to us. He is transforming so many lives by bringing hundreds of thousands of people around the world to Jesus. Did you know that he is not receiving any payments? Did you know he went through a lot of suffering and hardship for us? Pastor Kong lives up to his promises. He promised us a place to worship, and God gave us Suntect City. What more do you need?
You have been to our services but could not feel the presence of the Lord? I have no explanation. We can all feel the Holy Spirit, like a fire in our heart, talking through Pastor Kong. You have hardened your heart. When you open up your heart, you will feel what all of us are experiencing every week. God is good. God is love. And God will bless us financially, because He wants us to prosper. God is our father and he will not short-change us.
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quote
" The charities not only owe their members an explanation, they also owe it to the public to come clean." unquote
Kong Hee needs to come clean and REPENT of his criminal activity.
Sun Ho needs to REPENT of her senseless, mindless and needless prostituting of herself to a dead loss music career. Instead of acting like a two bit slut she should become a real Christian AND LIVE LIKE ONE!
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Church's remarks raise questions
It could be seen as interfering with judicial process, say some lawyers
BY LEONARD LIM
AND BRYNA SIMTHE unusual move by City Harvest Church to issue a statement dismissing the allegations of misuse of funds before the case has gone to trial has fuelled questions of its intent.
Insiders said the church, now headed by executive pastor Aries Zulkarnain, 39, deemed the statement necessary to allay the concerns of its 30,000 members.
An executive member who has been with the church for more than a decade said City Harvest, in making that strongly worded statement, was seeking to lift the congregation's spirits and "unite them".
The church's founding pastor Kong Hee and four others, charged in court on Wednesday, could face lengthy jail terms - even for life - if found guilty.
Lawyers yesterday said that the statement by the church was risky - if not reckless - because it could be construed as interfering with the judicial process.
The statement, posted on the church's website and sent to the media on Thursday, said the church stood with those involved in the case, including Kong.
It added that church activities were unaffected and that Kong, 47, and his deputy Tan Ye Peng could continue to preach at the church.
The pair have been charged with criminal breach of trust as agents.
They, with three others, are alleged to have funnelled $24 million into sham bond investments to further the music career of Kong's pop singer wife Ho Yeow Sun, and alleged to have misappropriated a further $26.6 million in church funds to cover up the first amount.
The five have not entered pleas and are due in court on July 25.
What surprised many was that in the City Harvest statement, Mr Aries addressed the allegations and maintained that the church did not lose any funds in the alleged transactions.
He also said the accused did not make any personal profit.
Lawyers interviewed were divided on whether his comments constituted subjudice, a legal concept referring to words or actions that may affect or prejudice the outcome of court proceedings. It is an offence to do so.
The president of the Association of Criminal Lawyers of Singapore Subhas Anandan said: "To address the allegations is subjudice, as the evidence has not been heard in court."
But others said it is debatable whether Mr Aries' comments were in contempt of court.
Criminal lawyer R. S. Bajwa said that while the church has said no funds were lost, it remained up to the prosecution to decide if that will be a point of contention.
"If the prosecution decides to debate on whether restitution was in fact made, then what the church has said would be considered subjudice," he said.
The Attorney-General's Chambers, asked to respond to the church's statement, said that criminal charges were before the court and that neither the prosecution nor any other party should comment on issues which will be subject to adjudication and on which evidence will be led in court.
The police gave a similar response: "Generally, in law, the offence of criminal breach of trust of monies is established once there is misappropriation of the monies with the requisite intent, regardless of whether there have or have not been subsequent attempts at restitution by the accused."
Meanwhile, church members The Straits Times spoke to said the statement had reassured them and clarified the situation.
Communications manager James Yan, a 31-year-old who has been with the church for more than 10 years, said: "The statement was helpful. It did not speculate, but merely clarified certain facts."
Church members say they back their leaders
BY NG KAI LING
AND BRYNA SIM
WHILE five City Harvest Church leaders have been charged with criminal breach of trust (CBT) as an agent, many of the congregants interviewed appear to be supportive of them.On Wednesday, founding pastor Kong Hee and four others were charged with conspiracy to commit CBT as an agent under section 409.
Court documents state that $26.6 million was allegedly used to cover up an initial $24 million which they had taken from the church's building fund and put into sham investments.
These investments in turn were alleged to have been used to finance the music career of Kong's wife, pop-star Ho Yeow Sun.
According to the Penal Code, CBT happens when a person, entrusted with a certain property, purposefully and dishonestly failed to carry out what was expected of him.
Giving an example, Associate Professor Mak Yuen Teen of the National University of Singapore Business School, said: "If I man a till, and I decided to take the money in the till to spend on myself, and the next day I put back the money, it is still criminal breach of trust."
But even before the case goes to trial, some congregants have stated online and elsewhere that they have no problem with the use of church funds to finance Ms Ho's music career.
They said it was the church's intention to reach a wider audience through her music.
Said marketing specialist Charlene Sng, 26: "When I gave, I believed I was sowing in God's kingdom and I trust the pastors to use the money in whatever way it should be used."
Lawyers, however, pointed out that the issues before the court have nothing to do with whether or not the congregants mind how the church used their money, but whether they had been properly informed of what the money collected was for, and how it would be used.
A lawyer said that it is for the prosecution to prove that the five accused had actively misled church members to think that the money was going to be used on the church but was instead spent elsewhere.
She explained that if proven that the money was not used as it was intended, a crime had been committed.
Top of the news, The Straits Times, Saturday, June 30 2012, Pg A6
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wot.
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Sammi Cheng, the cantopop queen has converted to become a Christian a couple of years ago . This is one for her songs that talk about God Love ! Wonder why someone cannot sing this kind of songs as well . Please enjoy Sammi Cheng Songs . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTgE--X-0oo&feature=fvwrel
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charge them for contempt of court
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Hi,
I'm a newbie here...
Been following this thread and I managed to speak to a colleague who sometimes attends CHC.
Not sure if she's the exception but she never felt the pressure to give tithings.
Her point of view is that in the bible, God mentioned about giving tithings and she gives as she follows God's instruction. To her, she doesn't need to know how the money is being used. In her mind and heart, she's doing something according to God's will. And how the receiver uses the tithings, he is answerable to God. I'm perplexed by this way of thinking but she's very sure of her thinking.
She was giving tithings for some building project thing and when she realised the church was quite well to do, she stopped giving the tithings and she never felt pressured to give.
Has anyone else heard of similar experiences or is my colleague the exception?
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Originally posted by Skyeburn:
Hi,
I'm a newbie here...
Been following this thread and I managed to speak to a colleague who sometimes attends CHC.
Not sure if she's the exception but she never felt the pressure to give tithings.
Her point of view is that in the bible, God mentioned about giving tithings and she gives as she follows God's instruction. To her, she doesn't need to know how the money is being used. In her mind and heart, she's doing something according to God's will. And how the receiver uses the tithings, he is answerable to God. I'm perplexed by this way of thinking but she's very sure of her thinking.
She was giving tithings for some building project thing and when she realised the church was quite well to do, she stopped giving the tithings and she never felt pressured to give.
Has anyone else heard of similar experiences or is my colleague the exception?
I used to be like her... free spirited, kind, forgiving, not much financial obligations to be able to tithe. Naive enough not to think about the evils done in the name of God...
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A lot of the videos asking people to donate money all taken down from youtube.
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*removed*
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*removed*
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No alize her post isn't defamatory it's dumb, just like.
If she really has 'proof' like she claims why tells us? Tell to the CAD lah, call them directly or go down Cantoonment and have her statement recorded and evidence presented to clear Kong Hee.
All this name calling and accusations, like the brain of a 12 year old. A 12 year old say supports Man Utd, no matter what you tell him, that Man City are better or Chelsea have won 2 trophies last season compared to Utd's 0, he will still say man utd the best.
If she really say her Ah Kong innocent, then why ask dimb questions like why is kong's house under hanafi's name? Why kong praise hanafi? 1 moment she say kong hee innocent, then she ask these dumb quwatiosn which implies more guilt on kong hee's part!
Kong hee himself praise hanafi many times, and is he an idiot to allow his house to be under hanafi's name? Is he an idiot to channel money to hanafi's co? Is an idiot to accept hanafi's love gifts?
Her pastor call hanafi great things, she call him evil? So is her pastor an idiot or a liar? And she say she love her pastor above all things? So how can she contradict her darling pastor?
Brains and talk of kid, contradicting herself. Got proof some more, go clear his name la, why come here and spout rubbish?
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These CHc ppl think just because we all raise questions, condemn the actions of CHC staff including her pastor and disagree with some of CHC's concepts and teachings, we are all devil worshippers!
Is that a Christian thing to do first of all?
Yeah some ppl say spiteful things but many are just concerned citizens. CHC is not a closed group where you have to buy membership, it's not an investment company that you buy shares, not an insurance company that you buy policies from and hope it matures and get your returns back.
It is an open church! Anybody can walk into it's services and rest assured the CHC will try it's best to make that person a convert to them. Anybody that attends it's services are strongly encouraged to donate to help the church grow or spread the Gospel.
It has a charity listing, large portions of it's takings (if not all) are tax exempt. Why shouldn't the public at large question them?
You wanna let your pastor live in Sentosa, by all means, register it as a society, investment company or business entity that is closed to the rest of Singapore. Charge membership, entrance fees, etc. Comply with the Laws regarding running a business, make clear all monies collected will be used as the Board sees fit, whether to buy a house or promote Sun or whatever.
Nobody can say anything, but don't be 'double or multi faced' 1 moment you say you a church promoting the gospel, next minute say CHC members gave willingly and don't mind how it's used. 1 moment say Sun is pastor, next say she isn't. 1 moment say Sun is not connected to the church, next moment say she's helping to promote the church grow.
You want to do that, comply with the rules.
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Nobody is saying Kong Hee and CHC never do any good.
For sure they have fed the poor, helped the sick, provided moral support for the depressed, donated to various charitable movement.
And if 1 is a Christian, one can't deny they have 'saved many souls' by getting people to follow Christ, which is the primary duty of any church or Christian, be it here or abroad.
Npbody is saying Kong hee and the members who did this, shouldn't be praised or get their rewards for it, especially in God's eyes. Nobody is saying all this must be forgotten.
All that is being said by a vast majority, is that some mistakes were made despite the good, and one shouldn't just excuse such conduct based on the good done. God is also justice, if not every thief, murderer, con man etc, all shouldn't face justice if at some point they did good things before, after or during their crimes.
And it is alleged that these mistakes made by Kong hee and/or his co-accused are criminal acts within the meaning of the Law, so it's ectremely proper that they must answer these allegations. If they are found innocent, good for them, but if they found guilty then they must be punished.
Even good people make mistakes or commit crimes.
The money raised and used doesn't belong to the church or Kong hee to do as they please. They have to follow the proper rules. Even if it has been returned that doesn't mean no crime has been committed. It will help to lower sentences for sure if no loss is reported, but doesn't mean no crime was done.
Like that all of us who handle money for our organisations can use it for any purpose we like and return it later, with no consequences. Or if we use the money not once for ourselves but for the company's good, then it's alright.
If it is an offence for someone in a private company to do this (use money without authorisation even for the company's benefit), then what more a church? A church's action must be whiter than white. It must be transparent, more so if it has charity status.
But explain this to CHC members, they all say persecuted, we are evil.
Are they so dumb and blind the truth? You think we after Kong hee's blood? We would demand the same justice if this happened in a mosque, another church, a temple or any organisation.
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Originally posted by JoeRaj:
Nobody is saying Kong Hee and CHC never do any good.
For sure they have fed the poor, helped the sick, provided moral support for the depressed, donated to various charitable movement.
And if 1 is a Christian, one can't deny they have 'saved many souls' by getting people to follow Christ, which is the primary duty of any church or Christian, be it here or abroad.
Npbody is saying Kong hee and the members who did this, shouldn't be praised or get their rewards for it, especially in God's eyes. Nobody is saying all this must be forgotten.
All that is being said by a vast majority, is that some mistakes were made despite the good, and one shouldn't just excuse such conduct based on the good done. God is also justice, if not every thief, murderer, con man etc, all shouldn't face justice if at some point they did good things before, after or during their crimes.
And it is alleged that these mistakes made by Kong hee and/or his co-accused are criminal acts within the meaning of the Law, so it's ectremely proper that they must answer these allegations. If they are found innocent, good for them, but if they found guilty then they must be punished.
Even good people make mistakes or commit crimes.
The money raised and used doesn't belong to the church or Kong hee to do as they please. They have to follow the proper rules. Even if it has been returned that doesn't mean no crime has been committed. It will help to lower sentences for sure if no loss is reported, but doesn't mean no crime was done.
Like that all of us who handle money for our organisations can use it for any purpose we like and return it later, with no consequences. Or if we use the money not once for ourselves but for the company's good, then it's alright.
If it is an offence for someone in a private company to do this (use money without authorisation even for the company's benefit), then what more a church? A church's action must be whiter than white. It must be transparent, more so if it has charity status.
But explain this to CHC members, they all say persecuted, we are evil.
Are they so dumb and blind the truth? You think we after Kong hee's blood? We would demand the same justice if this happened in a mosque, another church, a temple or any organisation.
to them, it is alright if we demand the same justice if it happens in a temple, a mosque or another org... but if it happens to CHC, we are devils!
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It's defamatory. If she shouts it loud enough, Hanafi will come after her.