Christian scrutiny
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Let me make this clear, MOST of your christians who look down on other religons are MOSTLY PROTESTANTS(City harvest emblem), how do i know?They even criticize the CATHOHLIC religon right infront of my face when preaching..so please bother to find out and dont think there is only one catergory of christians, there are also Anglican, methodist etc etc
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Grrrrrrrrr....
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Originally posted by ditzy:Grrrrrrrrr....
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oooh. city harvesters are that bad??
hmmm... any other experiences?
just wanna hear some comments.. -
I totally agree.Originally posted by chronicles:Let me make this clear, MOST of your christians who look down on other religons are MOSTLY PROTESTANTS(City harvest emblem), how do i know?They even criticize the CATHOHLIC religon right infront of my face when preaching..so please bother to find out and dont think there is only one catergory of christians, there are also Anglican, methodist etc etc
I am a Catholic Christian and I resent what these 'Protestants' or 'harvesters' say about my faith; I deplore the lies and misrepresentations they spread about the Catholic faith; and above all I dislike the fact that they appropriate to themselves the label of 'Christian' whilst denying it to the Catholics.
For a 1000 years in Europe, Christianity was almost universally identified with Catholicism.
Ben -
sorry, i do respect Catholics, just that i cannot accept when people says that Catholics are Christians. there is a clear signifigant differenceOriginally posted by MrBach:I totally agree.
I am a Catholic Christian and I resent what these 'Protestants' or 'harvesters' say about my faith; I deplore the lies and misrepresentations they spread about the Catholic faith; and above all I dislike the fact that they appropriate to themselves the label of 'Christian' whilst denying it to the Catholics.
For a 1000 years in Europe, Christianity was almost universally identified with Catholicism.
Ben -
Catholics are Christians and it is insulting and a pathetic show of ignorance to say otherwise.Originally posted by snk86:sorry, i do respect Catholics, just that i cannot accept when people says that Catholics are Christians. there is a clear signifigant difference
Augustine Aquinas Scotus Bonaventure - some of the greatest Christian thinkers through the ages have been Catholics.
You probably don't even know that the Reformers would have condemned you as sexual perverts for advocating the use of artificial methods of birth-control. -
how ironic. divided within while carrying the same faith.
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errm, Put it this way, Christ did not mention anything other then believing in him and him alone to be saved, if i am not too sure, catholics have much much more "requirements" to be save. do correct me if i am wrong.Originally posted by MrBach:Catholics are Christians and it is insulting and a pathetic show of ignorance to say otherwise.
Augustine Aquinas Scotus Bonaventure - some of the greatest Christian thinkers through the ages have been Catholics.
You probably don't even know that the Reformers would have condemned you as sexual perverts for advocating the use of artificial methods of birth-control.
and please read up on Martin Luthur. -
You are so informed about Martin Luther that you even misspelled his name as 'Luthur'.Originally posted by snk86:errm, Put it this way, Christ did not mention anything other then believing in him and him alone to be saved, if i am not too sure, catholics have much much more "requirements" to be save. do correct me if i am wrong.
and please read up on Martin Luthur.
Don't lie that it was an accident as this is the second time I have seen you misspelling his name in that way.
The book of James explicitly states that faith by itself does not justify; for the demons too believe and yet are no less demons for that reason.
Believing (in the sense of intellectual acceptance of propositions) cannot save; if you teach this, then it would follow that a person can believe in Christ and refuse to repent and sin as much as it pleases him to sin.
It's no wonder people despise the version of Christianity you represent and why 'churches' like yours have never produced the kind of saints who have commanded universal respect.
To make my position clear, let me say this:
We cannot earn our way into Heaven by good works, and Catholicism has never taught this (contrary to what you may have heard).
But good works are the necessary result of a person's having been truly justified by Christ; for the justification of such a person that is wrought by his faith (and provided that teh faith in question does not amount to a mere acceptance of the truth of propositions) will be of such a nature that it will necessarily transform the character of this person, enabling him to advance in righteousness, and so 'to bring forth fruits taht are worthy of his calling'.
Ben -
glad to see this thread. lotsa ppl mixup christians. well there are diff types like catholic,protestant,methodist,anglican etc etc. the ones u see owaes makin a big hoo ha n act ang moh n yaya papaya are PROTESTANTS n in singapore mostly come from CHC . Owaes go knock on ppl door kpkb tell them politely dunno hw to listen 1 =)
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Did i say i say we believe in it intellectually and thats all?Originally posted by MrBach:You are so informed about Martin Luther that you even misspelled his name as 'Luthur'.
Don't lie that it was an accident as this is the second time I have seen you misspelling his name in that way.
The book of James explicitly states that faith by itself does not justify; for the demons too believe and yet are no less demons for that reason.
Believing (in the sense of intellectual acceptance of propositions) cannot save; if you teach this, then it would follow that a person can believe in Christ and refuse to repent and sin as much as it pleases him to sin.
It's no wonder people despise the version of Christianity you represent and why 'churches' like yours have never produced the kind of saints who have commanded universal respect.
To make my position clear, let me say this:
We cannot earn our way into Heaven by good works, and Catholicism has never taught this (contrary to what you may have heard).
But good works are the necessary result of a person's having been truly justified by Christ; for the justification of such a person that is wrought by his faith (and provided that teh faith in question does not amount to a mere acceptance of the truth of propositions) will be of such a nature that it will necessarily transform the character of this person, enabling him to advance in righteousness, and so 'to bring forth fruits taht are worthy of his calling'.
Ben
Did i mention we can just believe and sin all we want?
please do not make this kind of assumtions(spell). and that whats it with this need to saint someone? we all know we just have our Do our duty to God. not really need to matters on what respect or whatsoever you gain on earth.
and lastly, i have not been under formal english education for more then 2years. pardon me for my spelling error, but i am sure spelling one person's name wrong does not mean you don't know about that person. -
sigh...............goodness, CHC only have what? 20k believers. the number of protestant Christians in singapore is way more then that, and anyway, Methodist are protestant, baptist are protestants, anglican are protestants(in a way), Lutherians are protestants and prebyterians(goodness, serious spell error here) are protestants. please get your facts clear/Originally posted by cr8tive:glad to see this thread. lotsa ppl mixup christians. well there are diff types like catholic,protestant,methodist,anglican etc etc. the ones u see owaes makin a big hoo ha n act ang moh n yaya papaya are PROTESTANTS n in singapore mostly come from CHC . Owaes go knock on ppl door kpkb tell them politely dunno hw to listen 1 =) -
and please remember, my stand on CHC is they are a bunch of jackass.Originally posted by cr8tive:glad to see this thread. lotsa ppl mixup christians. well there are diff types like catholic,protestant,methodist,anglican etc etc. the ones u see owaes makin a big hoo ha n act ang moh n yaya papaya are PROTESTANTS n in singapore mostly come from CHC . Owaes go knock on ppl door kpkb tell them politely dunno hw to listen 1 =) -
I always got these knocks on the door from people who carry ard a holy bible and they acted like salesman going from door to door cajoling you into joining their fellowship. I always say no but they wont listen they just keep blah blah about god and jesus, and the thing is they juz kept coming back !!
OH FOR THE LOVE OF GOD , LEAVE THE OTHER RELIGION ALONE.
TO EACH HIS OWN , simple things lidat cannot understand? -
again you stereotype a whole group of people just because of some black sheep. you are indeed narrow minded and ignorant.Originally posted by chronicles:Let me make this clear, MOST of your christians who look down on other religons are MOSTLY PROTESTANTS(City harvest emblem), how do i know?They even criticize the CATHOHLIC religon right infront of my face when preaching..so please bother to find out and dont think there is only one catergory of christians, there are also Anglican, methodist etc etc -
1) Did i say i say we believe in it intellectually and thats all?
Response:
You didn't say this but you yet said that we (unlike you) didn't believe that faith in Christ was sufficient to save our souls; that we believed that there were other requirements which we needed to be meeting.
Since we believe that faith in Christ by itself does not save (in the sense of intellectually accepting propositions and as evidenced by the testimony of the Book of James to this effect) and since you were contrasting what you took to be true Christianity with our position on this score, I naturally assumed that it was your position that a person only needed to have faith in Christ in order for him to be able to be saved (and that this had meant his believing a certain set of truths about Christ).
2)Did i mention we can just believe and sin all we want?
Response:
Luther appeared to believe in this; at any rate, he once said 'sin boldly'.
In any case, if you don't believe that we 'can just believe and sin all we want', surely it would have to be your position that being saved (or being made regenerate or whatever else you may wish to call it) must be more than just a matter of faith in the sense of mere belief, and that it would have to include NOT 'sinning all you want'.
This being the case, why did you have the audacity to contrast our position with yours, for the purpose of suggesting that our position wasn't Christian?
3) 'please do not make this kind of assumtions(spell). and that whats it with this need to saint someone? we all know we just have our Do our duty to God. not really need to matters on what respect or whatsoever you gain on earth. '
Response:
Jesus Himself said to 'let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.'
I fully agree that what makes a person a saint isn't the favour that he has found with men; but I also deny that if a person is a saint then the good deeds which he does could fail to be made manifest to those who are in a position to observe them.
If we really did our duty to God, then it will not matter to us if we gained the respect of our fellowmen; but more often than not doing our duty to God entails helping the least of Christ's brethren in a world where there are so many opportunities to help those who are less fortunate than ourselves on so many levels; in a world like ours, our good deeds in this regard will generally therefore not fail to go unnoticed by most people.
That was my point - stop distorting it.
Finally, ask any informed Catholic whether he will not be offended by your statement that he is not a Christian and you will then be told by him how much he thinks of your lying claim that you respect Catholics.
You are deceived. -
don't try to force your doctrines on others..you're only inviting bashings.Originally posted by MrBach:1) Did i say i say we believe in it intellectually and thats all?
Response:
You didn't say this but you yet said that we (unlike you) didn't believe that faith in Christ was sufficient to save our souls; that we believed that there were other requirements which we needed to be meeting.
Since we believe that faith in Christ by itself does not save (in the sense of intellectually accepting propositions and as evidenced by the testimony of the Book of James to this effect) and since you were contrasting what you took to be true Christianity with our position on this score, I naturally assumed that it was your position that a person only needed to have faith in Christ in order for him to be able to be saved (and that this had meant his believing a certain set of truths about Christ).
2)Did i mention we can just believe and sin all we want?
Response:
Luther appeared to believe in this; at any rate, he once said 'sin boldly'.
In any case, if you don't believe that we 'can just believe and sin all we want', surely it would have to be your position that being saved (or being made regenerate or whatever else you may wish to call it) must be more than just a matter of faith in the sense of mere belief, and that it would have to include NOT 'sinning all you want'.
This being the case, why did you have the audacity to contrast our position with yours, for the purpose of suggesting that our position wasn't Christian?
3) 'please do not make this kind of assumtions(spell). and that whats it with this need to saint someone? we all know we just have our Do our duty to God. not really need to matters on what respect or whatsoever you gain on earth. '
Response:
Jesus Himself said to 'let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.'
I fully agree that what makes a person a saint isn't the favour that he has found with men; but I also deny that if a person is a saint then the good deeds which he does could fail to be made manifest to those who are in a position to observe them.
If we really did our duty to God, then it will not matter to us if we gained the respect of our fellowmen; but more often than not doing our duty to God entails helping the least of Christ's brethren in a world where there are so many opportunities to help those who are less fortunate than ourselves on so many levels; in a world like ours, our good deeds in this regard will generally therefore not fail to go unnoticed by most people.
That was my point - stop distorting it.
Finally, ask any informed Catholic whether he will not be offended by your statement that he is not a Christian and you will then be told by him how much he thinks of your lying claim that you respect Catholics.
You are deceived. -
wow! North Ireland, here in singapore!
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+1Originally posted by vito_corleone:don't try to force your doctrines on others..you're only inviting bashings. 
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Good point! Doing things for the sake of doing is as good as NOTHING.
Originally posted by MrBach:If we really did our duty to God, then it will not matter to us if we gained the respect of our fellowmen... -
I myself am a free-thinker i dun believe gods and stuff but i do pray and worship when i pass by a temple sometimes.
Underneath we are all the same, religions and belief sprung up because people just wanted to qiu an xin , to achieve peace for their mind. In the hideous, second guessing society nowadays people wanted to believe in the higher power, a higher being up in the skys watching us and helping us unconditionally.Having a religion is good, it gives people something to hope for and held on to, it keeps you intact.
But do not become obsessed wiith the higher power such that you become a fanatic , that would be very destructive, to put everything you have on something that just might doesn't exist.
God bless you
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"scrutiny": reminded me of a bible verse within the Beautitudes.
i wonder why is it that anger is often raised from what we see and what we hear, and seldom from what we have understood.
there are of course, Christian brothers and sisters who did themselves a disservice by wrong actions and words, but then, why would we want to cling on to the bad, while always shunning the good ? if we keep on harping on what others have done us wrong, then perhaps we would never move on to understand who has been right with us. -
Getting facts clear can make you name your fellow brethens in CHC as jackass?Originally posted by snk86:and please remember, my stand on CHC is they are a bunch of jackass.
You got your facts clear. However you didn't get your knowledge of God's commandment and scripture clear.
Unfortunately, you've become a Christian whom non believers will look down upon as well.
Cheers -
CHC got a bunch of "gifted" people
So their followers are not scared of anything