Gambling, like forex trading, never pays....
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Its becoz u go sgpools buy 4d and fark off to work while in casino you can sit there and rot.
buy 4d you wait for results, neva tio means neva tio, wait for next draw.
In casino its possible that you draw money until ur ATM kang kang hoping to tio in that single day.
Not to say that we cannot practice self restraint and gamble abit for entertainment. Its just that many gamble in casino until lao sai. -
This is just my observation.
Approximately more than 50% of your posts are in riddles (i.e. instead of answering our questions, you give us proverbs or riddles or calling us stupid or calling us superficial or stating that our statement is superficial), how can you be an author when you always speak in riddles, always give nebulous, vague, dubious, obscure, unclear, blurry statement? do you use all those vague statement in your book? like theThat is what many people think... and I am not surprised that you think similarly...
or are you trying to write an english literature essay targetting only those who bother to read between the line to slowly comprehend the unfathomable.
The reality is different...
It is like, looking at the sky, you will see with your own eyes that the sun moving from the east to the west... every morning you will see the sun moving from the east to the west...
don't be like an unschooled kid, and think that the sun moves from the east to the west.... it is the earth that is rotating and not the sun moving from the east to the west, that you see the sun moving from the east to the west...
Similarly, you see the charts, you study the news, you do your analysis and you conclude that you can make money from forex trading... the reality is different... the reality is that you will end up losing all you money if you do not stop after losing a big amount of your money.
Do you even consider how many of those who gamble do not really understand English (especially old people who like to buy 4D). With your attitude and lampooning, trenchant, mordant, invective, and worse insulting remark, you won't progress as a writer.
When you hold a press conference and there is one person asking you why your view on gambling and forex are so polarized and you reply like what you did in this forum (giving a riddle, going around the statement and finally end it up with a sarcastic remark saying that "you are too dumb to understand and i don't want to waste my time answering superficial question". -
While the ability to play more often in the casino does increase risk of ruin, mathematically, it's much better to play in the casino than buying 4D.Originally posted by kramnave:Its becoz u go sgpools buy 4d and fark off to work while in casino you can sit there and rot.
buy 4d you wait for results, neva tio means neva tio, wait for next draw.
In casino its possible that you draw money until ur ATM kang kang hoping to tio in that single day.
Not to say that we cannot practice self restraint and gamble abit for entertainment. Its just that many gamble in casino until lao sai.
This doesn't mean that playing all day in a casino is a good thing. I'm just saying that buying 4D is bad beyond compare.
Talking about gambling addiction is out of context of this discussion. As the topic title suggests, this thread is a discussion of the similarities of gambling and forex trading. When you compare "investment" against "investment", you'll constantly find yourself hitting the logical wall that forex is nothing like gambling in a casino.
Much like gambling in a casino is nothing like playing 4D. In fact, the marginal difference between the odds of making money in forex and in a casino is pretty negligible when you really sit down and think of your 4D investments.
I just have two points to make when i mentioned 4D
1) If you're concerned about people making wrong gambling choices, 4D would be the most obvious choice. Why is andrew ignoring it?
2) 4D's ridiculously low odds are a great example of what a true gamble is. Where skill has 0 effect on outcome, the given odds are the true odds. When you take market investments(which have much smaller odds, and where skill is a huge factor) and compare them with gambling, you insult not only the reader's intelligence, but your own as well. -
Grossly stupid statement that only takes into account "odds" when I told you a long long time ago that "odds" are not everything that you have to consider all the relavant issues and you do not know enough of the rest of the story to comment here....Originally posted by deathbait:While the ability to play more often in the casino does increase risk of ruin, mathematically, it's much better to play in the casino than buying 4D.
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occasionally you write sense...Originally posted by kramnave:Its becoz u go sgpools buy 4d and fark off to work while in casino you can sit there and rot.
buy 4d you wait for results, neva tio means neva tio, wait for next draw.
In casino its possible that you draw money until ur ATM kang kang hoping to tio in that single day.
Not to say that we cannot practice self restraint and gamble abit for entertainment. Its just that many gamble in casino until lao sai.
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No one is interested in your observations... you are just an anonymous nick... like. I said, I produce evidence... where is your evidence?Originally posted by ultranova3:This is just my observation. -
odds ARE everything when you are deciding whether to invest time or money. Do you even know what odds are?Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:Grossly stupid statement that only takes into account "odds" when I told you a long long time ago that "odds" are not everything that you have to consider all the relavant issues and you do not know enough of the rest of the story to comment here....
i notice you didn't answer any of my questions.....again. -
more accurately, YOU are not interested in his observations, or any observations that undermine your platform.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:No one is interested in your observations... you are just an anonymous nick... like. I said, I produce evidence... where is your evidence?
Pretty sure there are some ppl who have been following your fall from grace that have taken much away from that observation of his. -
you don't know what odds are?Originally posted by deathbait:odds ARE everything when you are deciding whether to invest time or money. Do you even know what odds are?
i notice you didn't answer any of my questions.....again. errrr.....
... why do I need to remind you simple things again and again?
... pst.... Google is your friend...
???!!!!!?????!!!!!Originally posted by deathbait:odds ARE everything... 
Gross stupidity.... -
so to sum up your last postOriginally posted by AndrewPKYap:???!!!!!?????!!!!!
Gross stupidity....
1) quoted without reading
2) answered question with the exact same question
3) repeated use of insult that has started to sound dry -
let's not forget the massive emoticon flood of frustration
and absence of answers to questions piling up.
really, i left the strategy of answering direct questions with references to questioner's intelligence and casting blind insults behind me years ago when i left primary school.
You on the other hand seem to flaunt that you never have. -
*sigh* even people that do not know anything about gambling, with some common sense, with basic thinking abilities... would agree that
... is a grossly stupid statement to make....Originally posted by deathbait:odds ARE everything... -
ermOriginally posted by AndrewPKYap:*sigh* even people that do not know anything about gambling, with some common sense, with basic thinking abilities... would agree that
... is a grossly stupid statement to make....
odds are the probability of a certain event occuring.
It is the most essential part of the calculation of expected returns, which in turn is the one major variable that should influence your decisions in trades.
Seriously, do you even know what odds are and how they pertain to the profitability of any transaction?
we calculate rough odds everytime we make a decision.
eg, is it worth my time to watch this tv program? What are my expected returns? Does it justify my opportunity cost?
I have a suspicion you've been gambling at sgpools so much you now think odds are only referential to payout schemes.
What was your favourite insult again?
gross stupidity?
You seem to ooze of it from every pore now. How bout reading up a little on the topic before deciding to preach it? And for once, please reply with a detailed argument, and not in the following format:
1) quote deathbait
2) misdirect quote out of context
3) massive flood of emoticons
4) laugh
5) make funny(not so funny now) insults
6) laugh again
7) end the post without really saying anything -
Unfortunately odds are not everything outside 4d.Originally posted by deathbait:While the ability to play more often in the casino does increase risk of ruin, mathematically, it's much better to play in the casino than buying 4D.
This doesn't mean that playing all day in a casino is a good thing. I'm just saying that buying 4D is bad beyond compare.
Talking about gambling addiction is out of context of this discussion. As the topic title suggests, this thread is a discussion of the similarities of gambling and forex trading. When you compare "investment" against "investment", you'll constantly find yourself hitting the logical wall that forex is nothing like gambling in a casino.
Much like gambling in a casino is nothing like playing 4D. In fact, the marginal difference between the odds of making money in forex and in a casino is pretty negligible when you really sit down and think of your 4D investments.
I just have two points to make when i mentioned 4D
1) If you're concerned about people making wrong gambling choices, 4D would be the most obvious choice. Why is andrew ignoring it?
2) 4D's ridiculously low odds are a great example of what a true gamble is. Where skill has 0 effect on outcome, the given odds are the true odds. When you take market investments(which have much smaller odds, and where skill is a huge factor) and compare them with gambling, you insult not only the reader's intelligence, but your own as well.
Psychology is... -
the point is that odds should be everything.Originally posted by kramnave:Unfortunately odds are not everything outside 4d.
Psychology is...
if you're not playing according to the odds, you tend to lose value.
That's why andrew is barking up the wrong tree. If you're influenced by your emotions when making a transaction, you're not getting maximum value out of your investment.
Your odds of success is thus the one all overriding important factor in any decision. If you even have to point out emotional input, you're already not doing optimum trading.
Odds IS everything.
If you aren't treating it as the main focus of your decision making, you're not making the right choices. Andrew will have you believe that trading in the markets is pure gambling. It's simply not true. Even if you lose money in the markets on a specific trade, you are in reality gaining value, as long as your expected returns surpass the odds you are given.
Refer to my coin flip game. If Andrew plays with me and loses 10 consecutive times, he's down by a million dollars. According to him, he should have quit long ago. But mathematically, it is correct for him to continue playing IF HE HAS SUFFICIENT MONEY TO LAST TO THE LONG RUN.
If Andrew started off with a capital of 200 billion, he will play the game with me as long as i continue to provide slightly favorable returns against his even odds. If he lets emotions get the better of him and decide to switch places because being the "player" is "unlucky", he loses value, even if the "banker" continues to win money.
End of the day, odds give you your value in investment. As long as your value is a positive one, you expect to make money in the long run. If your expected value in transactions is negative, you expect to lose in the long run, no matter how hot your current streak is. That is the cold truth behind trading.
Andrew has seized on the common phenomena of traders going broke from a string of investments gone bad. He doesn't touch on whether the trade has a positive value, just that the trades go bad. He doesn't tell you WHY the traders go broke.
The traders go broke on the forex because they have an insufficient bankroll, not because the forex is like wild gambling. They may even have made excellent decisions to maximise expected value, but gambler's ruin set in early.
Andrew wants to cast a net of fear here, because his book thrives on the fear of going broke on strings of bets. Don't let him mislead you. So far he has touched on none of the real reasons why people go broke on the forex. That is because it is to his advantage to keep people in blind fear.
I leave you with parting advice on life.
Never regret decisions that turn against you if it was the best one. If you go broke trading the proper way, you have done your best. No one could do it better. Sometimes, you can do everything wrong and still make a profit. Other times, doing everything right simply means minimizing losses. As long as you are certain your overall expected value is positive, it's never wrong to play the game. -
I'm not disagreeing with you and neither am i subscribing to Andrew's fear factor. I have stated earlier that i think it's possible to for forex trading to pay, however the odds are highly stacked. The biggest problem is one of psychology. People tend to draw pictures in their minds. That is the first thing to overcome and empirical evidence has it that people are bad at money management...most will somehow lose money.Originally posted by deathbait:the point is that odds should be everything.
if you're not playing according to the odds, you tend to lose value.
That's why andrew is barking up the wrong tree. If you're influenced by your emotions when making a transaction, you're not getting maximum value out of your investment.
Your odds of success is thus the one all overriding important factor in any decision. If you even have to point out emotional input, you're already not doing optimum trading.
Odds IS everything.
If you aren't treating it as the main focus of your decision making, you're not making the right choices. Andrew will have you believe that trading in the markets is pure gambling. It's simply not true. Even if you lose money in the markets on a specific trade, you are in reality gaining value, as long as your expected returns surpass the odds you are given.
Refer to my coin flip game. If Andrew plays with me and loses 10 consecutive times, he's down by a million dollars. According to him, he should have quit long ago. But mathematically, it is correct for him to continue playing IF HE HAS SUFFICIENT MONEY TO LAST TO THE LONG RUN.
If Andrew started off with a capital of 200 billion, he will play the game with me as long as i continue to provide slightly favorable returns against his even odds. If he lets emotions get the better of him and decide to switch places because being the "player" is "unlucky", he loses value, even if the "banker" continues to win money.
End of the day, odds give you your value in investment. As long as your value is a positive one, you expect to make money in the long run. If your expected value in transactions is negative, you expect to lose in the long run, no matter how hot your current streak is. That is the cold truth behind trading.
Andrew has seized on the common phenomena of traders going broke from a string of investments gone bad. He doesn't touch on whether the trade has a positive value, just that the trades go bad. He doesn't tell you WHY the traders go broke.
The traders go broke on the forex because they have an insufficient bankroll, not because the forex is like wild gambling. They may even have made excellent decisions to maximise expected value, but gambler's ruin set in early.
Andrew wants to cast a net of fear here, because his book thrives on the fear of going broke on strings of bets. Don't let him mislead you. So far he has touched on none of the real reasons why people go broke on the forex. That is because it is to his advantage to keep people in blind fear.
I leave you with parting advice on life.
Never regret decisions that turn against you if it was the best one. If you go broke trading the proper way, you have done your best. No one could do it better. Sometimes, you can do everything wrong and still make a profit. Other times, doing everything right simply means minimizing losses. As long as you are certain your overall expected value is positive, it's never wrong to play the game. -
actually, forex commisions are extracted via a spread.
While this spread varies, the commission taken from you for every trade is not exactly astronomical to overcome if you indeed have the skills to trade in the forex.
And yes, it's easy to lie to ourselves that the road ahead will indeed be smoother. But as long as you understand exactly why you're in the trade, you should be less likely to succumb to impulse trades.
Which is why i'm repeating it so often(and am extremely incredulous that andrew thinks this is rubbish). Play the odds. They are the most important thing to consider when you trade. Math does not lie. If your move is always mathematically correct, emotions will never take over. -
I am talking about winning and losing... whether you win or lose, that is the whole point of gambling, isn't it? To win money?Originally posted by deathbait:erm
odds are the probability of a certain event occuring.
When make a stupid statement like
You are saying that odds ARE everything that decides whether you win or lose...Originally posted by deathbait:odds ARE everything...
From the way you wrote, I could tell where you are coming from and in my first reply to you,
You see you did not even make your grossly stupid statement yet thatOriginally posted by AndrewPKYap: 19 November 2007 · 06:10 AMI didn't answer you previously because they are grossly stupid "questions".
Let me tell you why they are stupid:
You think that "odds" is everything in gambling.
You do not understand the difference between gambling at the casino, forex trading, and mahjong.
How did I know back then that and predicted that you think that at 19 November 2007 · 06:10 AMOriginally posted by deathbait: 20 November 2007 · 08:29 AModds ARE everything...
when you made the statement at : 20 November 2007 · 08:29 AM?
That is because, as I told you before... whatever it is that you are thinking, I have considered and what I have considered, you do not even know you must consider... and yet you keep on making stupid statements after stupid statements without knowing it.... -
I am now seriously doubt that you are the real author of the book.
Which author go around insulting people in forum? Your book is supposed to educate us, not to make us inferior and believe that everything you write is true. You book should offer a different point of view and not force us to accept your point of view.
If your insults in this forum circulate to public, I wonder what will happen to the sales of your bookI have seen first-hand the harm casino gambling does. Having reviewed medical research, I am totally against Casino gambling. I am however pro-freedom. The state however should not sponsor casino gambling. The state in fact should discourage casino gambling and educate it's citizens on the harm of gambling at the casino. I believe that there is a clear and present danger for many people when it comes to casino gambling. There is a need to educate as many people as possible on the dangers of the casino in a clear, complete, effective and simple manner. If they are unable to stop themselves from going to the casino, at the very least they must be taught and they must learn the survival skills. My mission in life and this book is to educate people on Casino gambling and Stock Market Speculation.
This excerpt is taken from the background information that you wrote about your book.
1. You clearly mention that your objective is to educate us, but why do you go to another level and insult us. Is it ethical for a teacher to scold his student stupid. If I already know everything, why should I even bother to ask the question. Since i don't know, that is the reason I ask.
2. If you want to educate as many people as possible about the danger of gambling and speculating, why don't you educate your government? They spend money hiring hedge fund managers and financial analysts just to speculate? Why don't you educate those Hedge fund managers and tell them that speculating is very bad? You clearly know that they draw an at least 4 digits salary per month just to speculate.
3. You clearly state that you want to educate us in a clear and simple manner. But what I see here is that you are presenting rude, insulting and vague statement. Where is the clarity? Where is the simplicity?
4. You clearly wrote that we have to learn survival skills should we persist to go into casino or gambling. In this case you are offering solution to the problem and try to minimize the impact on our lives. But what are you writing here? Propaganda and extremely polarized statement..
I can't find your book in Kinokuniya anyway? -
I don't deny that at times I "insult" people in the forums... because frankly, they deserve it. After all that insult they still don't get it and continue to make offensive statements like they know what they are talking about when they clearly do not.Originally posted by ultranova3:I am now seriously doubt that you are the real author of the book.
Which author go around insulting people in forum?
If they express their opinion without being offensive, why should I go around insulting people?
Like this exchange here... he just express his opinion without resorting to telling me how wrong I am or how right he is... and my reply to him was:
"There is, but, what you call money management... to ensure that you "drop inside the hole and you will never come out again" but not buried six feet underground...Originally posted by Mitell: 19 November 2007 · 08:46 AM
His reply to me?
Just normal sharing of opinions... he doesn't try to be smart and try to point out to me how wrong I am... he reminded me that there is "emotional management as well..."Originally posted by Mitell:lol add in emotional management also
If people tell me I am wrong with good basis, of course I will accept it... but not if they tell me I am wrong without basis and worse of all, because they are stupid, ignorant and trying to be smart... certainly they deserve to be insulted and hopefully the insult is "educational"... -
or like this guy here... did I insult him?... why not?Originally posted by noahnoah:I not sure
my friend who play with those unit trust told me risk level not so high
of course returns also not so much one
true or not i not sure also
...because people can be "not sure"... ...that is intelligence, to recognize it when you are not sure... leading to
...a normal exchange of opinions...
... did he try to tell me how wrong I am, inviting me to insult him for trying to tell me I am wrong when in reality he is not sure?
obviously he is not so stupid to do that... and we can have an exchange of opinions... -
your logic is mind boggling
you say : you think odds are everything. it's not
i reply : but odds ARE everything
you then say : see, i predicted you'll say odds are everything
wow!
you have such deep insight into my soul.
but of course, you have yet to address any of the things i've pointed out. You've degenerated into the guy who picks his petty battles. And they aren't even real battles, just ones you conjure up to sidestep the relevant topics.
so far, you have proven:
1) you know nothing about casinos
2) you know nothing about what makes a good investment
i'm going to go on a limb here and say that barring further evidence to the contrary, you are ridiculously underqualified to talk about either topic.
You are, of course welcome to share some of that proclaimed vast knowledge here. I've invited you to do so many times. You can start with my basic yes/no questions and move into more complicated territory from there. Perhaps prove me wrong?
But then, you just love to keep things abstract don't you. Let's stay away from the details. Details hurt your arguments, because you pull them from the aether. You prefer to stick your rhetorics, and fire out hyperboles. And when you feel cornered, you start with the insults to shift attention away from yourself.
3 pages later, i'm still wondering why it's so hard for you to answer the few yes/no questions i posted. If you truly wanted to prove you were competent, answering them would have taken considerably less time than the 3 pages of nonsense you've written.
So here's a reminder. The questions are still there. Answer them when you feel like it, then we can have an actual educated discussion. -
so you are nice to ppl who don't disagree with what you say.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:or like this guy here... did I insult him?... why not?
...because people can be "not sure"... ...that is intelligence, to recognize it when you are not sure... leading to
...a normal exchange of opinions...
... did he try to tell me how wrong I am, inviting me to insult him for trying to tell me I am wrong when in reality he is not sure?
obviously he is not so stupid to do that... and we can have an exchange of opinions...
Shocker.
And how exactly does that help in your defence against the claim that you do not answer questions that challenge your viewpoint again? How is this even remotely relevant to the accusation that you throw insults at people who challenge you?
basically, your defence is as such:
accuser : you insult people who do not share your views.
you : here's the proof that you're wrong! see this guy who doesn't think i'm wrong? I never insulted him!
accuser : .......huh?
Like i said, practically every post of yours utilises circular logic. Kinda reminds me of insurance agents. -
If you did not have the delusion that odds ARE everything, would you have said it? Did you say it before or after I predicted that you have that delusion?Originally posted by deathbait:your logic is mind boggling
you say : you think odds are everything. it's not
i reply : but odds ARE everything
you then say : see, i predicted you'll say odds are everything
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delusion?
once more, i urge you to understand what odds are.
If you tell me you have been trading all these years without the benefit of knowledge of what odds are, you are indeed in serious threat of getting sued for fraudulent practice.
assuming of course, that you REALLY were a commodities trader