Originally posted by ^Acid^ aka s|aO^eH~:
hmmm interesting...I do not know much abt viets... so there's a large community of teochew among the viet?
Vietnam and Cambodia....actually i find most of them that still speak Teochew are those able to migrate to the US.....ha ha ha.
Like i says the only way to allow language to flourish is to have options and Choices. Social engineering basically kills it.
Originally posted by Arapahoe:
Vietnam and Cambodia....actually i find most of them that still speak Teochew are those able to migrate to the US.....ha ha ha.Like i says the only way to allow language to flourish is to have options and Choices. Social engineering basically kills it.
yes, large communities of Teochew in Vietnam, Cambodia, and Thailand which has the most number of them and also well assimilated already too
i once spoke Teochew to a Thai who has partial Chinese blood before, in Singapore, and his Teochew is very broken
I just went to Vietnam.
The tour guide told us most of the Vietnamese Chinese are Cantonese rather than Teochew, as those who fled into Vietnam during bad times in China were mainly from the Guangxi and Guandong provinces.
True also.
Many Chinese Immigrants consist of Cantonese subgroup also, but many Teochew were identified as "Cantonese" because
1) Teochew is also a part of Guangdong province
2) Teochew used Cantonese as the lingua franca with other Chinese subgroups
Maybe majority who fled to Vietnam were Cantonese.
In Thailand, no doubt Teochew.
In Singapore, no doubt Hokkien.
In Malaysia, no doubt Cantonese.
In Hong Kong, no doubt Cantonese.
In Taiwan, no doubt Hokkien.
dialects possess rich metaphors which could be introduced into the major lingua.....in fact the reason why the english language or another other official languages were so rich has its etymological roots from dialects or folks' lingua....
What you mention about Vietnam, Thailand, Singapore, Hong Kong, and Taiwan are correct and widely accepted
But surprisingly, Malaysia no. 1 dialect group is Hokkien
The prevalence of Cantonese in Malaysia is due to the concentration of Cantonese in the country's capital Kuala Lumpur and the states surrounding it
Originally posted by BanguIzai:What you mention about Vietnam, Thailand, Singapore, Hong Kong, and Taiwan are correct and widely accepted
But surprisingly, Malaysia no. 1 dialect group is Hokkien
The prevalence of Cantonese in Malaysia is due to the concentration of Cantonese in the country's capital Kuala Lumpur and the states surrounding it
Cantonese is widely spoken in Perak and Kuala Lumpur by both Cantonese and Hakka.
Originally posted by Clivebenss:Cantonese is widely spoken in Perak and Kuala Lumpur by both Cantonese and Hakka.
why is Cantonese spoken by Hakka you know?
I would say majority of Msia are mostly of hokkien descent but the most widely spoken dialect is cantonese. I think also due in no small part to the rise of HK since the 70s.. Their movies and drama serials have had a great impact on the nation. Even the malays and indians know who Andy Lau is.
Originally posted by Rock^Star:I would say majority of Msia are mostly of hokkien descent but the most widely spoken dialect is cantonese. I think also due in no small part to the rise of HK since the 70s.. Their movies and drama serials have had a great impact on the nation. Even the malays and indians know who Andy Lau is.
well, their media plays a part... Most of the chinese drama and ads are in cantonese... They dun sub it into chinese or hokkien...
Originally posted by BanguIzai:What you mention about Vietnam, Thailand, Singapore, Hong Kong, and Taiwan are correct and widely accepted
But surprisingly, Malaysia no. 1 dialect group is Hokkien
The prevalence of Cantonese in Malaysia is due to the concentration of Cantonese in the country's capital Kuala Lumpur and the states surrounding it
The pioneering were the Hockkien....
it is not surprising if you look at the 20s and 30s the early traders came to SEA and settle down with trades to make a living subsequently the same villages uses married as network to establish connection into SEA so they match make their daugther or sons to SEA......
when i was growing up i ever saw a black and white Hong Kong TV program in Teochew that was a classic.....
it was a mixed of english teochew....that is hard to understand and laugh till you drop.
Google Kuala Lumpur in wiki and one might find interesting facts. It was started by a hokkien guy, became a tin mining town. Brought a lot of wealth and businesses and there u have a big metropolitan city today.
The Chinese built Malaysia. Even Genting was built by a Chinese chap.
Language comes and go especially when folks move out from their terroritory.....with globalization and mobilities of people. Mixed married, cross cultures, and so our language will evolved. Younger generation will carried a different physche altogether than the Parent generations. They will decide what their interest.
thru out history ....Language will be assulted thru nationalism, social engineering or cultured coheresion, colonialism. Singapore is an example of all four.
Conquistador basically grouped the entired latin America into a single language. The rest is speaking portugal. while all the tribes language is for self identication only when they met in BIG City or foreign land.
Originally posted by Arapahoe:Language comes and go especially when folks move out from their terroritory.....with globalization and mobilities of people. Mixed married, cross cultures, and so our language will evolved. Younger generation will carried a different physche altogether than the Parent generations. They will decide what their interest.
thru out history ....Language will be assulted thru nationalism, social engineering or cultured coheresion, colonialism. Singapore is an example of all four.
Conquistador basically grouped the entired latin America into a single language. The rest is speaking portugal. while all the tribes language is for self identication only when they met in BIG City or foreign land.
are you a singaporean? or should i ask if you are a chinese?
i noticed you keep using foreigners as examples.
what the non-chinese do or dont do has nothing to do with us.
Originally posted by dragg:are you a singaporean? or should i ask if you are a chinese?
i noticed you keep using foreigners as examples.
what the non-chinese do or dont do has nothing to do with us.
Scientifically our genetics make up are the same that traced a few from Africa. We are called
by race of Chinese, European, Japanese it is just Names. Beneath the skin of our colors we are all the same. So it is scientifically wrong to say we are different. So there are no “us” vs “they”
Socially it is divisive as it created isolation and misunderstanding between people. As much as human have created languages and cultures but they do not dictate identity but rather identity is dictate by how we treat another fellow human beings.
Spiritually it contradict to the teaching of totality of acceptance when you surrender yourself to
divinity. It become subjective to accepting another human being differently.
To classified “us” vs. “they” between human beings. Scientifically it is Wrong, Socially Divisive and Spiritually contradict.
Just because we lived in an island it does not mean that our mind have to be in a cocoon.
An old articles......
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Chinese or Indian? What about Chinese-Indian? |
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SO IS the child of an Indian father and Chinese mother more Indian or more Chinese? Or a mix of both? Some parents feel that they should not have to decide on this at the child's birth and offer this solution: hyphenated identities. Mrs Maureen Pestana, 48, a Chinese married to a Eurasian, said: "In the case of my son, he's not a first-generation Eurasian, he's the son of a Eurasian and a Chinese. So on his IC, he should be a Eurasian- Chinese." Assistant Professor Hoon Chang Yau, Social Sciences at Singapore Management University, agrees that more could be done to improve the racial classification system. "If parents can only choose within a single-race category...then it does not give a clearer identity to children of mixed-ethnicity." A hyphenated identity, such as Indian-Chinese, would reflect the identity of a mixed-ethnicity child better. This is the case in the United States, which has hyphenated categories, like Asian-American or African-American. Although not perfect, it is less limiting than a single- race category, Prof Hoon argues. The option of putting both races down would make more sense for both her sons, she said. Some people cite countries which have dropped the race category on official forms as it can prove divisive. Another argument: globalisation and interracial- marriages will result in multiple ethnic identities for future generations, rendering race less relevant. Mrs Sarah Sum-Campbell notes that in some parts of Europe, asking a person about his race is taboo because of events such as the Holocaust during World War II, which saw the extermination of six million Jews. Likewise, it is a sensitive topic in the United Kingdom, she said. "There is no second language learning or meeting of welfare needs according to race in the UK. If the government insisted on including race in identification papers in the UK, there could be uproar - over the fear of discrimination." But sociologist Tan Ern Ser says that in some instances, race can serve as an important input for the purpose of policy formulation. "Doing away with race may be politically correct, but it does not necessarily eradicate race-related problems," he said. "I am not suggesting that we emphasise race, but we must recognise its existence and work towards integration and strengthening national identity." |
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:An old articles......
Chinese or Indian? What about Chinese-Indian?
Thu, Jan 07, 2010
The Straits Times
Top of Form
Bottom of Form
SO IS the child of an Indian father and Chinese mother more Indian or more Chinese? Or a mix of both?
Some parents feel that they should not have to decide on this at the child's birth and offer this solution: hyphenated identities.
Mrs Maureen Pestana, 48, a Chinese married to a Eurasian, said: "In the case of my son, he's not a first-generation Eurasian, he's the son of a Eurasian and a Chinese. So on his IC, he should be a Eurasian- Chinese."
Assistant Professor Hoon Chang Yau, Social Sciences at Singapore Management University, agrees that more could be done to improve the racial classification system.
"If parents can only choose within a single-race category...then it does not give a clearer identity to children of mixed-ethnicity."
A hyphenated identity, such as Indian-Chinese, would reflect the identity of a mixed-ethnicity child better. This is the case in the United States, which has hyphenated categories, like Asian-American or African-American.
Although not perfect, it is less limiting than a single- race category, Prof Hoon argues.
The option of putting both races down would make more sense for both her sons, she said.
Some people cite countries which have dropped the race category on official forms as it can prove divisive.
Another argument: globalisation and interracial- marriages will result in multiple ethnic identities for future generations, rendering race less relevant.
Mrs Sarah Sum-Campbell notes that in some parts of Europe, asking a person about his race is taboo because of events such as the Holocaust during World War II, which saw the extermination of six million Jews.
Likewise, it is a sensitive topic in the United Kingdom, she said.
"There is no second language learning or meeting of welfare needs according to race in the UK. If the government insisted on including race in identification papers in the UK, there could be uproar - over the fear of discrimination."
But sociologist Tan Ern Ser says that in some instances, race can serve as an important input for the purpose of policy formulation.
"Doing away with race may be politically correct, but it does not necessarily eradicate race-related problems," he said.
"I am not suggesting that we emphasise race, but we must recognise its existence and work towards integration and strengthening national identity."
thank you for being so truthful.
Originally posted by dragg:thank you for being so truthful.
nobody is denying race and language but truthfully it is not about race for language.
At end of the day it is the individual choice and available options to choose....rather than speak because you are a particular "Race"
Not in the days of mixed cultural.
Originally posted by Arapahoe:
nobody is denying race and language but truthfully it is not about race for language.At end of the day it is the individual choice and available options to choose....rather than speak because you are a particular "Race"
Not in the days of mixed cultural.
obviously you dont get my point and will never do, for whatever reason.
let's agree to disagree and end the discussion here.
Originally posted by dragg:obviously you dont get my point and will never do, for whatever reason.
let's agree to disagree and end the discussion here.
and obviously you can;t see beyond your skin.
Originally posted by Arapahoe:and obviously you can;t see beyond your skin.
thank you for the compliment.
my answer is:
dialects are important. dialect is just another language in a different name.
we should not always look into a usefulness of a language in terms of $$ sense
But how can dialect be preserved and passed on to the next generation?
I think that cannot be done in a practical way.
Because there is too much traffic, confluence, and intermingling already.
Even the Mandarin language is not passed on well.