Buddhist thoughts on christian bible
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
no question on that. r u an ex christian?
Been to the church.( victory family centre )
Pastor hardpressed all followers to donate money.
No money = scolded by pastor.
Pissed off followers either church hopped or leave religion.
i am just sick of being hardpressed for money.
i feel that i am being squeezed for money
no spiritual guidance- just a cash cow for the church
pastor informed followers no need to give money to parents
give money to church instead because parents are used by god to take care of us
so we can abandon parents- what kind of bullshit is that???????????????????
i am so sick of the church and the way they have perverted the truth.
the church is sick- brainwashing young children to accept christianity and to hate all other religion.
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Originally posted by Cck689461:
Been to the church.( victory family centre )
Pastor hardpressed all followers to donate money.
No money = scolded by pastor.
Pissed off followers either church hopped or leave religion.
i am just sick of being hardpressed for money.
i feel that i am being squeezed for money
no spiritual guidance- just a cash cow for the church
pastor informed followers no need to give money to parents
give money to church instead because parents are used by god to take care of us
so we can abandon parents- what kind of bullshit is that???????????????????
i am so sick of the church and the way they have perverted the truth.
the church is sick- brainwashing young children to accept christianity and to hate all other religion.
oh man, this is really way too much. I am amazed still got devotees who still go and donate money to the church? you are right to say to hell to the pastor. what kind of a pastor is he anyway? money faced pastor? anyway why does he need alot of money for? for his own use or for the church activities?
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
More good quotes by Ken:
I began my previous Beliefnet column with the line, "Throughout history, religion has been the single greatest source of human-caused wars, suffering, and misery. In the name of God, more suffering has been inflicted than by any other manmade cause." I was, of course, using the word "religion" in its sociological meaning, as any belief invested with "ultimate concern," in which case not only Islam, Christianity, and Shintoism are religions, but Marxism, Nazism, and Eco-terrorism are all versions of religions or religiously held beliefs. Seen as such, the opening sentence is obviously true.
..........
If humanity is ever to cease its swarming hostilities and be united in one family, without squashing the significant and important differences among us, then something like an integral approach seems the only way.
Religion is the little cloud from which no rain pours...Ignorance is the source of all suffering, its conditions and manifests, as it is the architect of many houses built prolifically in the minds of want and hearts of desire. Ignorance is the thief of innocence and benefactor of shame. Ignorance is the instigator of greed and deliverer of pain. Ignorance is the master of ego that corrupts faith and blemishes conviction. Ignorance is the whisper of suspicion, the composer of dissension, the cultivator of jealousy, and the harvester of despair. Ignorance is the mother of fear who births the river of hate, which flows into the ocean of all sufferings. Blinded be the path of whoever follows…
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Originally posted by Cck689461:
Been to the church.( victory family centre )
Pastor hardpressed all followers to donate money.
No money = scolded by pastor.
Pissed off followers either church hopped or leave religion.
i am just sick of being hardpressed for money.
i feel that i am being squeezed for money
no spiritual guidance- just a cash cow for the church
pastor informed followers no need to give money to parents
give money to church instead because parents are used by god to take care of us
so we can abandon parents- what kind of bullshit is that???????????????????
i am so sick of the church and the way they have perverted the truth.
the church is sick- brainwashing young children to accept christianity and to hate all other religion.
You have already left the church, hopefully, in time, leave your unhappiness and anger behind. Also, you have some strong accusations, make sure you can back it up!
Also this is the doing of one church, not indicative of all churches and denominations!
There many churches serve a few generations!
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Originally posted by SBS n SMRT:
let me explain, God always want to give people a chance to repent, he want to use plaques to move Pharaoh heart. God can just call out, but if he does that pharoah will be totally vanished, no matter what god does, he will at first give you a chance to repent, not repent, den you prepared to face the consequences
A person set a trap and hope someone will step into it. When one does, that trap-setter appears and "HELP" the one being trapped. In the end, the trapped person has to THANK the trap-setter for saving him. OMG.
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Originally posted by geis:
this is exactly one of the points some of us are making.
it may sound idealistic but sharing some questions and ideas through some of these debates may be helpful for some fellow practitioners? perhaps some challenging pointers posed by fellow Buddhists might trigger us to change our usual perspectives?
Efforts encouraging others along their own inimitable spiritual path may serve to deepen personal faith(s), qualifying and quantifying, garnering and discarding their own discoveries, in their own way, in their own time. All such affinities along all such spiritual paths should be undertaken freely, absent deliberate repudiation. They should be studied and practiced with all seriousness and fervor, like someone digging a well that perseveres until they actually find water. While keeping a tolerant, open and compassionate mind, it is important that people dedicate themselves to the path they have chosen, as it would be pointless for someone to half-finish a dozen wells without ever reaching the water they are looking for.
Spiritual practice is based on experiential exploration and discovery that has to be pushed just as far into the inner world as science pushes its explorations into the outer world. That experience is always fresh, and it is ceaselessly renewed. It also brings along with it no shortage of obstacles and happenings of all sorts. It is not at all a matter of using ready-made formulae but of experiencing the teachings in the present moment, knowing how to use life’s good and bad circumstances, dealing with all the thoughts of all kinds that arise in the mind, and understanding for oneself the chain reactions they cause and how to set oneself free from the process. True spiritual discovery is to know how to use every instant in life for the goal one’s set oneself.
For relationships with others not to be mainly motivated by selfishness, which only creates friction and disagreement, each person has to give meaning to their life and attain a degree of inner development. Every instant of the process of spiritual transformation has to be accompanied by the idea that the qualities one’s trying to develop will help meet others’ needs better.
Perhaps it is along this way that we may present the wisdoms of personal successes and failures absent favor. Perhaps it is along this way that we may offer such experiences to others, not as Buddhists or Christians or Muslims, but as one human being to another. Perhaps it is along this way where we may find that we are one yet not the same, for within the limitless possibilities of perception countless living things have as many different worlds in which they exist. Perhaps it is along this way, where it may be best not to look upon oneself as the wise or good or as the purveyor of truth, but rather to always seek to understand wisdom, goodness and truth so that one may learn to recognize and honor them everywhere, within everyone and everything.
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Originally posted by Cck689461:
Been to the church.( victory family centre )
Pastor hardpressed all followers to donate money.
No money = scolded by pastor.
Pissed off followers either church hopped or leave religion.
i am just sick of being hardpressed for money.
i feel that i am being squeezed for money
no spiritual guidance- just a cash cow for the church
pastor informed followers no need to give money to parents
give money to church instead because parents are used by god to take care of us
so we can abandon parents- what kind of bullshit is that???????????????????
i am so sick of the church and the way they have perverted the truth.
the church is sick- brainwashing young children to accept christianity and to hate all other religion.
What your pastor said was not something new. Luckily, you are sensible to have your own judgement but there are many who don't and believe what is being told.
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Originally posted by AtlasWept:
Efforts encouraging others along their own inimitable spiritual path may serve to deepen personal faith(s), qualifying and quantifying, garnering and discarding their own discoveries, in their own way, in their own time. All such affinities along all such spiritual paths should be undertaken freely, absent deliberate repudiation. They should be studied and practiced with all seriousness and fervor, like someone digging a well that perseveres until they actually find water. While keeping a tolerant, open and compassionate mind, it is important that people dedicate themselves to the path they have chosen, as it would be pointless for someone to half-finish a dozen wells without ever reaching the water they are looking for.
Spiritual practice is based on experiential exploration and discovery that has to be pushed just as far into the inner world as science pushes its explorations into the outer world. That experience is always fresh, and it is ceaselessly renewed. It also brings along with it no shortage of obstacles and happenings of all sorts. It is not at all a matter of using ready-made formulae but of experiencing the teachings in the present moment, knowing how to use life’s good and bad circumstances, dealing with all the thoughts of all kinds that arise in the mind, and understanding for oneself the chain reactions they cause and how to set oneself free from the process. True spiritual discovery is to know how to use every instant in life for the goal one’s set oneself.
For relationships with others not to be mainly motivated by selfishness, which only creates friction and disagreement, each person has to give meaning to their life and attain a degree of inner development. Every instant of the process of spiritual transformation has to be accompanied by the idea that the qualities one’s trying to develop will help meet others’ needs better.
Perhaps it is along this way that we may present the wisdoms of personal successes and failures absent favor. Perhaps it is along this way that we may offer such experiences to others, not as Buddhists or Christians or Muslims, but as one human being to another. Perhaps it is along this way where we may find that we are one yet not the same, for within the limitless possibilities of perception countless living things have as many different worlds in which they exist. Perhaps it is along this way, where it may be best not to look upon oneself as the wise or good or as the purveyor of truth, but rather to always seek to understand wisdom, goodness and truth so that one may learn to recognize and honor them everywhere, within everyone and everything.
yes, thank you for this guidance :)
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Originally posted by AtlasWept:
Religion is the little cloud from which no rain pours...
Ignorance is the source of all suffering, its conditions and manifests, as it is the architect of many houses built prolifically in the minds of want and hearts of desire. Ignorance is the thief of innocence and benefactor of shame. Ignorance is the instigator of greed and deliverer of pain. Ignorance is the master of ego that corrupts faith and blemishes conviction. Ignorance is the whisper of suspicion, the composer of dissension, the cultivator of jealousy, and the harvester of despair. Ignorance is the mother of fear who births the river of hate, which flows into the ocean of all sufferings. Blinded be the path of whoever follows…
religion = faith = belief system. Problems resulting from religions and belief systems are not limited to only god-based faiths. :)
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
oh man, this is really way too much. I am amazed still got devotees who still go and donate money to the church? you are right to say to hell to the pastor. what kind of a pastor is he anyway? money faced pastor? anyway why does he need alot of money for? for his own use or for the church activities?
my friend, you have too much anger in you, resulting in your views being too biased against another religion and fellow human beings who are innocent and kind in nature. Open your heart, grow forgiveness in your heart, forget the past, and go your own path which you feel is best for you that will improve your life, and you'll be a much happier and fulfilled person.If just one tree is rotten and infested with parasites, do we burn down the whole forest? :)
PS.: I'm not a Christian, so I'm not defending anyone or faith.
Cheers! :)
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
That's just your own opinion.
Sorry, that's the worldview. -
Since when did one person's opinion become the worldview ? Really ?
Do u represent humanity as a whole ?
I dont remember signing over my rights to you ? Unless the opinions of the religious faith doesnt count ?
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Originally posted by Rainbow Jigsaw:
religion = faith = belief system. Problems resulting from religions and belief systems are not limited to only god-based faiths. :)
Yes, it the diversity of all belief that is truly wondrous. The exclusion of agnostic and atheistic beliefs is simply a reflection of a careless omission on my part.
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Originally posted by Weychin:
You have already left the church, hopefully, in time, leave your unhappiness and anger behind. Also, you have some strong accusations, make sure you can back it up!
Also this is the doing of one church, not indicative of all churches and denominations!
There many churches serve a few generations!
i assured you that i can back up what i have said.this is because what i has said is the truth
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Sorry for posting, just to clarify stuffs -
Been to the church.( victory family centre )
We as real Christians, will never hardpress people to donate, As god had stressed, offerings should be done out of willingness .. no use forcing
Pastor hardpressed all followers to donate money.
No money = scolded by pastor.
I am really sad about your case. The pastor isn't doing the right thing, more likely he squandered the money for himself, that why he wanna pple to pay $$$$ so much (disclaimer: I don't go to the church, so i dun know much, this are my assumptions only)
Pissed off followers either church hopped or leave religion.
Change church is good in this case, leave religion maybe they are not Christians in the first place !
i am just sick of being hardpressed for money.
i feel that i am being squeezed for money
no spiritual guidance- just a cash cow for the church
Yes, i admit
pastor informed followers no need to give money to parents
False teaching, heresies: Thou shall honor thy father and mother, says the ten commandments
give money to church instead because parents are used by god to take care of us
so we can abandon parents- what kind of bullshit is that???????????????????
Certainly heresies
i am so sick of the church and the way they have perverted the truth.
Just victory family center only - please
the church is sick- brainwashing young children to accept christianity and to hate all other religion.
We should anyway, bible mentioned many times, that the only truth victory preached in your entire rant
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Originally posted by Cck689461:
Been to the church.( victory family centre )
Pastor hardpressed all followers to donate money.
No money = scolded by pastor.
Pissed off followers either church hopped or leave religion.
i am just sick of being hardpressed for money.
i feel that i am being squeezed for money
no spiritual guidance- just a cash cow for the church
pastor informed followers no need to give money to parents
give money to church instead because parents are used by god to take care of us
so we can abandon parents- what kind of bullshit is that???????????????????
i am so sick of the church and the way they have perverted the truth.
the church is sick- brainwashing young children to accept christianity and to hate all other religion.
You just somehow reminded me of this video
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Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:
Sorry, that's the worldview.Nah, that's just the view of *less than* 12% of the world population (note: 'no religion' includes not only atheist but also agnostics).
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Originally posted by AtlasWept:
Efforts encouraging others along their own inimitable spiritual path may serve to deepen personal faith(s), qualifying and quantifying, garnering and discarding their own discoveries, in their own way, in their own time. All such affinities along all such spiritual paths should be undertaken freely, absent deliberate repudiation. They should be studied and practiced with all seriousness and fervor, like someone digging a well that perseveres until they actually find water. While keeping a tolerant, open and compassionate mind, it is important that people dedicate themselves to the path they have chosen, as it would be pointless for someone to half-finish a dozen wells without ever reaching the water they are looking for.
Spiritual practice is based on experiential exploration and discovery that has to be pushed just as far into the inner world as science pushes its explorations into the outer world. That experience is always fresh, and it is ceaselessly renewed. It also brings along with it no shortage of obstacles and happenings of all sorts. It is not at all a matter of using ready-made formulae but of experiencing the teachings in the present moment, knowing how to use life’s good and bad circumstances, dealing with all the thoughts of all kinds that arise in the mind, and understanding for oneself the chain reactions they cause and how to set oneself free from the process. True spiritual discovery is to know how to use every instant in life for the goal one’s set oneself.
For relationships with others not to be mainly motivated by selfishness, which only creates friction and disagreement, each person has to give meaning to their life and attain a degree of inner development. Every instant of the process of spiritual transformation has to be accompanied by the idea that the qualities one’s trying to develop will help meet others’ needs better.
Perhaps it is along this way that we may present the wisdoms of personal successes and failures absent favor. Perhaps it is along this way that we may offer such experiences to others, not as Buddhists or Christians or Muslims, but as one human being to another. Perhaps it is along this way where we may find that we are one yet not the same, for within the limitless possibilities of perception countless living things have as many different worlds in which they exist. Perhaps it is along this way, where it may be best not to look upon oneself as the wise or good or as the purveyor of truth, but rather to always seek to understand wisdom, goodness and truth so that one may learn to recognize and honor them everywhere, within everyone and everything.
Great advice... thanks for sharing!
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I notice whenever there is a bashing on others.....there is no lack of Guru but one question remain how many Gurus in this forum can claim to practice true buddhist wisdom ?
For I see most response to satisfy ego.
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
I notice whenever there is a bashing on others.....there is no lack of Guru but one question remain how many Gurus in this forum can claim to practice true buddhist wisdom ?
For I see most response to satisfy ego.
In Buddhism, a real Guru will not claim that he is a Guru. If he does, he is definitely not a Guru. Only a Guru can recognise the Guru. -
Aiya, just scrap that book!
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Originally posted by Cck689461:
Hi Cck
I empathy with your experience. However, I think it will be good that you share the experience without naming the CHURCH. As this is not a church bashing forum
As an ex Christian, I also went through some the similar cicrumstances as you do. However, I do not blame the church rather I am thankful to them for leading me to Buddhist path. Beside I have better understanding about the bible, and the church practice .
We need to respect Jesus just like the way we respect Buddha. After all, isn't him a Bodhisattva.
Once Leonardo Boff, a theologist, ask Dalai Lama,"What is the best religion?"
Dalai reply was, " whatever that makes you more compassionate, sensible, detached, loving,humanitarian, responsible and ethical is the best religion for you."
Gassho
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
I notice whenever there is a bashing on others.....there is no lack of Guru but one question remain how many Gurus in this forum can claim to practice true buddhist wisdom ?
For I see most response to satisfy ego.
Actually there is a place to criticize churches or any religious place that are teaching something that ought to be examined.
For example, I am glad that spotlight has gone to Pastor Rony and the stuff he taught has been revealed to the public. Without it he would have continued with his old ways and giving misleading information about what Buddhism is about.
I think it should not be limited to Pastor Rony - as Cck689461 have already criticized a certain church based on his/her own experience to bring such issues to light.
I think this is a good step - it is a good use of the internet/information age, whatever taught should be revealed to public and open to scrutiny. In the same way that books in Amazon.com have a section to allow readers to post their reviews, comments, and ratings. I hope the same can be done to Spirituality and Religion so that people can read carefully and decide for themselves.
Not just Christians, but any religions, even Buddhist. If a Buddhist monastery taught something that is not agreeable, it should also be open to scrutiny. And if you find something good about that monastery/church/temple/etc, you can also post good reviews about it to inform others about their merits. Just like Amazon.com.
If a cult teaches people to commit suicide, or do evil things - that should also be open to scrutiny, and the authority should investigate into that matter (this is a more extreme example).
However I think it is best to post this in a Christian forum, or at least not in a Buddhist forum since it is not related to Buddhism. Like if this is a review of a Christian church based on your experience - it is more appropriate to post it in a Christian forum. If this is a review of a Buddhist monastery or dharma center, then no problem in posting it here since it is the right venue. We should not just shut off these people from speaking the truth. Provided that we are all speaking from experience.
It is important not to follow everything blindly - even if it is taught in your church, temple, or whatever - the Buddha clearly taught us to examine the teachings, and not just follow by authority.
Kalama Sutta
Do not believe in anything (simply)
because you have heard it.
Do not believe in traditions because they
have been handed down for many generations.
Do not believe in anything because it is
spoken and rumoured by many.
Do not believe in anything (simply) because
it is found written in your religious books.
Do not believe in anything merely on the authority
of your teachers and elders.
But after observation and analysis
when you find that anything agrees with reason
and is conductive to the good and benefit of one and all
then accept it and live up to it.Buddha
(Anguttara Nikaya Vol. 1, 188-193 P.T.S. Ed.) -
Originally posted by Dawnfirstlight:
In Buddhism, a real Guru will not claim that he is a Guru. If he does, he is definitely not a Guru. Only a Guru can recognise the Guru.I had used that as a figure of speech...since there are alot of "Ke" Kian" .....
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Now I got a full picture of why the christian community or bishop did not come out to condemn Rony Tan. it was in the bible that only god can judge, not you or anyone. they feel that whatever wrong he has done, god will deal with him when he die. that explains partly why the bishop kept quiet. The other is that they still held the beliefs that other faiths were false and satanic. I dun think Rony is truly repentent. he is sorry that his condemnation of the other faiths were blown out of proportion in the media and outcry in public, but he is not sorry for the views he still hold. This is just one facet of their beliefs system. Religious dogma are really dangerous.