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  • Moderator
    Rock^Star's Avatar
    11,142 posts since Jul '05
    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

       

      biggrin.png   八仙率 =  Frequency of the Eight Immortals

       

      Just joking  :-p

      It's something which is unique to msia and sgpore haha.

  • BanguIzai's Avatar
    7,327 posts since Mar '10
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      Interesting. Why didn't you further your studies in this field?

      Your thread has ignited my interest and i just sent them an email the day before yesterday already.

      You are the greatest one.  Now you know how powerful sometimes people can influence people on the net ler.

      Here's the reply from her:

       

      RE: Graduate Programme & Research Matters

      Friday, June 24, 2011 3:51 PM
      From:

      "Chua Mei Fen, Ann-Marie" <[email protected]>

       

       

       

       

      Hi XXXX

       

      Thank you for your interest.

       

      Admission – I’m assuming you’re keen in the Linguistics programme. You didn’t mention if you were keen on the Master of Arts or PhD. We have information on admission requirements on our website below that you may wish to check on first. Part time studies is available too.

       

      http://linguistics.hss.ntu.edu.sg/ProspectiveStudents/GraduateProgrammes/Pages/Home.aspx

       

      School fees, this depends on your situation eg. Singaporean or PR or foreigner, self paying or on scholarship etc.  Information can be obtained from this website.

       

      http://admissions.ntu.edu.sg/graduate/R-Programs/BeforeApplying-Research/Pages/Fees.aspx

       

      Hope this helps for now. Let me know if you have any further queries.

       

      Best wishes.

       

      Ann-Marie Chua

      Division of Linguistics and Multilingual Studies (HSS)

      DID: 6592 2599

       

       

      From:
      Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 1:40 AM
      To: Chua Mei Fen, Ann-Marie
      Subject: Graduate Programme & Research Matters

       

      Hi Miss Ann Marie

       

          Regarding the graduate programme and research matters,  may I know what qualifications must I have that I can enroll ?    How much is the school fees is like,  and is there a part time course to it ?

       

          Thank you,

      With Regards

      XXXX

       

      Edited by BanguIzai 26 Jun `11, 12:52AM
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      What other words found in bahasa? I can only think of taoge which is bean sprouts. And in Indonesia, their restaurants (need not be Chinese) will surely have the word "ca" on their menu; which means "fried" in hokkien.

       

      Example, you type:

      • encik,  you will brought to encék, copy and paste encék into Orth, and you will get something
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      It's something which is unique to msia and sgpore haha.

       

      You so serious ah.   Coz you didn't see my pun lar... biggrin.png

      We normally type as 巴仙 instead of 八仙  lar...  icon_redface.gif

  • Moderator
    Rock^Star's Avatar
    11,142 posts since Jul '05
    • Wah so serious ah lol. Go china and study la. I didn't know NTU offers such linguistic courses.

    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

       

      You so serious ah.   Coz you didn't see my pun lar... biggrin.png

      We normally type as 巴仙 instead of 八仙  lar...  icon_redface.gif

      Really? hahaha okok.

  • BanguIzai's Avatar
    7,327 posts since Mar '10
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      Wah so serious ah lol. Go china and study la. I didn't know NTU offers such linguistic courses.

      Unless you got lobang in China as you said lor,  teach English as well as study ma...

      I not so rich to go all the way there to study,  and furthermore I is not totally Chinese Linguistic person even though I have more knowledge in Chinese Linguistic,    NTU offers full Linguistics which is Linguistics of the languages of the whole world

    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      Really? hahaha okok.

      This term originated from Hong Kong so if it was transliterated from 八仙 there would be a redudant "-t" in "paat-sin" therefore the Hongkies transliterated using the characters 巴 paa which is from percent

    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      What other words found in bahasa? I can only think of taoge which is bean sprouts. And in Indonesia, their restaurants (need not be Chinese) will surely have the word "ca" on their menu; which means "fried" in hokkien.

      Can also find:

      • kicap, you will be brought to kecap, it is indicated as a doubtful entry,  which I disagree with,  because kecap is really Cantonese for 茄汁.  I believe it is doubtful as to state the origin as 漳州 ChiangChiu instead of Cantonese,  or maybe it is doubtful of the explanation given as 鮭汁 instead of 茄汁.
  • Moderator
    Rock^Star's Avatar
    11,142 posts since Jul '05
    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

      This term originated from Hong Kong so if it was transliterated from 八仙 there would be a redudant "-t" in "paat-sin" therefore the Hongkies transliterated using the characters 巴 paa which is from percent

      Yes....cannot be 八仙 la.....haha. Anyway, post it up regarding the updates of the course you're applying ya.

    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

      Can also find:

      • kicap, you will be brought to kecap, it is indicated as a doubtful entry,  which I disagree with,  because kecap is really Cantonese for 茄汁.  I believe it is doubtful as to state the origin as 漳州 ChiangChiu instead of Cantonese,  or maybe it is doubtful of the explanation given as 鮭汁 instead of 茄汁.

      That sounds logical. I believe samseng too. Which means hooligan in bahasa. It must originated from Cantonese.

  • BanguIzai's Avatar
    7,327 posts since Mar '10
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      Yes....cannot be 八仙 la.....haha. Anyway, post it up regarding the updates of the course you're applying ya.

      May not necessary apply la,  got to ask them nia first la.  Got relevant update then i update lor.

    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      That sounds logical. I believe samseng too. Which means hooligan in bahasa. It must originated from Cantonese.

      In Indonesia, you have seen a lot of "toko" this and that right ?

      Heh,  try typing toko and see what you get biggrin.png

    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      That sounds logical. I believe samseng too. Which means hooligan in bahasa. It must originated from Cantonese.

      Sorry to say, Samseng is already well-researched before,  and it is proved to have originated not from Cantonese but from Hokkien 三牲.

      Add:  Cantonese 牲 can only be pronounced as "saang"  and never as "seng",  whereas Hokkien 牲 is always pronounced as "seng"

       

      Add 2nd time:

      I found internet linkages that have some posts regarding the etymology of Sam-Seng from Hokkien.  For you to ponder:

      http://hi.baidu.com/%D6%ED%B0%CB%BD%E4%CC%E1%C7%D7/blog/item/42806cd065d87bd4572c841a.html

      Samseng(俗写三星,实为三牲):指流氓、恶棍、歹徒、无赖、私会党徒。    
              Samseng
      即闽南话的“三牲”(sāmsīng)。旧时祭祀或敬神用的供品,有大三牲、小三牲之分,大三牲指牛、羊、猪;小三牲指鸡、鸭、鱼。(《普通话闽南方言词典》页668)三牲是闽南人祭祀或敬神用的供品,通常摆在前面。         闽南语中的“三牲头” sāmsīngtáo、“做三牲”zuèsāmsīng则含贬义,比喻冲在前边带头干。(《普通话闽南方言词典》页135)。三牲本为摆在前端祭神的供品,后被用于形容歹徒带头干坏事。传到我国,则演变成指流氓、歹徒、无赖、私会党徒等。如“三牲囝”(歹徒)“三牲头”(歹徒领袖)。

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singlish_vocabulary#S

      Sam Seng Cantonese and Hokkien or Sam Seng Kia (三牲囝, saⁿ-seng-kiáⁿ) - gangster. From Chinese term 三牲 (Hokkien saⁿ-seng).

      (The wikipedia article is for you to ponder:  Why does it state the "origin" as Cantonese and Hokkien,  when the definition stated is from "Hokkien" explicitly and furthermore I have mentioned above the Cantonese pronunciation for "seng" doesn't match Cantonese pronunciation,  unless a Tung-kwan variant of the Cantonese pronunciation is taken into account,  but why a Tung-kwan variant "seng" is coupled with a Cantonese variant of "sam" is arguably impossible,  as the Tung-kwan variant should be pronounced "sang" for 三.    Whereas if the Hokkien root is postulated, then these problems would be eliminated. Furthermore, when large areas of Indonesia and Malaysia were first populated by the Chiangchiu Hokkiens and only later on by the Cantonese people, the odds against it being borrowed from a relative small sub-clan of the Tung-kwan variant is much greater than it being borrowed into Bahasa from Hokkien. There is no right or wrong answer at this point of time; but rather, we often take the possibility which is larger, into account, for explanation)

      Edited by BanguIzai 26 Jun `11, 2:43AM
  • Moderator
    Rock^Star's Avatar
    11,142 posts since Jul '05
    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

      In Indonesia, you have seen a lot of "toko" this and that right ?

      Heh,  try typing toko and see what you get biggrin.png

      Wah that's really cool haha. Didn't even realise it was hokkien. It means "store" or "warehouse". The extent to which the Chinese have dominated Indo business is deeply steeped in such subtle yet forgotten history. Well, in msia, it's kedai though. No one knows what's toko unless they've been to indonesia.

      Same thing for "swike"; pronounced as "swee keh" for frogs in Indo.

    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

      Sorry to say, Samseng is already well-researched before,  and it is proved to have originated not from Cantonese but from Hokkien 三牲.

      Add:  Cantonese 牲 can only be pronounced as "saang"  and never as "seng",  whereas Hokkien 牲 is always pronounced as "seng"

       

      Add 2nd time:

      I found internet linkages that have some posts regarding the etymology of Sam-Seng from Hokkien.  For you to ponder:

      http://hi.baidu.com/%D6%ED%B0%CB%BD%E4%CC%E1%C7%D7/blog/item/42806cd065d87bd4572c841a.html

      Samseng(俗写三星,实为三牲):指流氓、恶棍、歹徒、无赖、私会党徒。    
              Samseng
      即闽南话的“三牲”(sāmsīng)。旧时祭祀或敬神用的供品,有大三牲、小三牲之分,大三牲指牛、羊、猪;小三牲指鸡、鸭、鱼。(《普通话闽南方言词典》页668)三牲是闽南人祭祀或敬神用的供品,通常摆在前面。         闽南语中的“三牲头” sāmsīngtáo、“做三牲”zuèsāmsīng则含贬义,比喻冲在前边带头干。(《普通话闽南方言词典》页135)。三牲本为摆在前端祭神的供品,后被用于形容歹徒带头干坏事。传到我国,则演变成指流氓、歹徒、无赖、私会党徒等。如“三牲囝”(歹徒)“三牲头”(歹徒领袖)。

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singlish_vocabulary#S

      Sam Seng Cantonese and Hokkien or Sam Seng Kia (三牲囝, saⁿ-seng-kiáⁿ) - gangster. From Chinese term 三牲 (Hokkien saⁿ-seng).

      (The wikipedia article is for you to ponder:  Why does it state the "origin" as Cantonese and Hokkien,  when the definition stated is from "Hokkien" explicitly and furthermore I have mentioned above the Cantonese pronunciation for "seng" doesn't match Cantonese pronunciation,  unless a Tung-kwan variant of the Cantonese pronunciation is taken into account,  but why a Tung-kwan variant "seng" is coupled with a Cantonese variant of "sam" is arguably impossible,  as the Tung-kwan variant should be pronounced "sang" for 三.    Whereas if the Hokkien root is postulated, then these problems would be eliminated. Furthermore, when large areas of Indonesia and Malaysia were first populated by the Chiangchiu Hokkiens and only later on by the Cantonese people, the odds against it being borrowed from a relative small sub-clan of the Tung-kwan variant is much greater than it being borrowed into Bahasa from Hokkien. There is no right or wrong answer at this point of time; but rather, we often take the possibility which is larger, into account, for explanation)

      Wah I've never seen anyone analyse a language like that. You shd really pursue your passion, can "tan jiak".

  • BanguIzai's Avatar
    7,327 posts since Mar '10
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      Wah that's really cool haha. Didn't even realise it was hokkien. It means "store" or "warehouse". The extent to which the Chinese have dominated Indo business is deeply steeped in such subtle yet forgotten history. Well, in msia, it's kedai though. No one knows what's toko unless they've been to indonesia.

      Same thing for "swike"; pronounced as "swee keh" for frogs in Indo.

       

      Some comments made on "toko" and "kedai" between Clivebenss and me about around 1 year ago:

      http://www.sgforums.com/forums/2029/topics/355579?page=9#post_9834739

      The issue was about the loaning of toko from Hokkien into --> Bahasa (Indonesia),  as well as the back-loaning of kedai from Bahasa (Malaysia) into --> Hokkien.  In my Hokkien repertoire,  kedai is not used,  instead kedai appears in my Teochew repertoire.

      For your reading pleasure angel.png

       ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      You do know that kedai is borrowed from Tamil ?

      Hehe, you can go and verify.

      So, that means, in Malaysia, the Tamils dominated the M'sia business ?

       ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      For swike,  type swiké into the Orth box.

      >>

      swiké

       1(dish made from) edible frog

      Chiangchiu 水雞 súi† ke† Douglas1899:463b   Douglas1899:200b 

      Edited by BanguIzai 26 Jun `11, 3:27PM
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      Wah I've never seen anyone analyse a language like that. You shd really pursue your passion, can "tan jiak".

      Cannot lah !   That is oni 雕蟲小技 and many people will know more than me one leh !   And furthermore that is my usual style in analysing lar !   If you have seen my old posts, you will know lar,  nothing unusual,   example:

        http://www.sgforums.com/forums/2029/topics/355579?page=8#post_9300123

           (issue on the etymology of  "buttocks" in Hokkien)

      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Regarding samseng,  copy and paste samséng into Orth,

      >>

      Searching native orthography for "samséng"
      2 items found


      samséng

       1  triple offerings (of meat); to visit the dead

      Amoy 三牲 sam† seng† Douglas1899:408b   Douglas1899:416a

        


      samséng

       1  rascal, ruffian, gangster

      VARIATION: samsing

      Amoy 三牲 sam† seng† Douglas1899:416a   Barclay1923:193b

       

      Edited by BanguIzai 26 Jun `11, 3:31PM
  • Moderator
    Rock^Star's Avatar
    11,142 posts since Jul '05
    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

       

      Some comments made on "toko" and "kedai" between Clivebenss and me about around 1 year ago:

      http://www.sgforums.com/forums/2029/topics/355579?page=9#post_9834739

      The issue was about the loaning of toko from Hokkien into --> Bahasa (Indonesia),  as well as the back-loaning of kedai from Bahasa (Malaysia) into --> Hokkien.  In my Hokkien repertoire,  kedai is not used,  instead kedai appears in my Teochew repertoire.

      For your reading pleasure angel.png

       ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      You do know that kedai is borrowed from Tamil ?

      Hehe, you can go and verify.

      So, that means, in Malaysia, the Tamils dominated the M'sia business ?

       ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      For swike,  type swiké into the Orth box.

      >>

      swiké

       1(dish made from) edible frog

      Chiangchiu 水雞 súi† ke† Douglas1899:463b   Douglas1899:200b 

      I don't know about kedai coming from the tamils lol but if have you been to indo yet? You just go to any shop and chances are the Chinese boss is in the background at a table while the workers at the shop front. I'm not surprised why the locals have decided to adopt certain words and ways of the Hokkien people.

  • Clivebenss's Avatar
    19,831 posts since Feb '10
    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

       

      Some comments made on "toko" and "kedai" between Clivebenss and me about around 1 year ago:

      http://www.sgforums.com/forums/2029/topics/355579?page=9#post_9834739

      The issue was about the loaning of toko from Hokkien into --> Bahasa (Indonesia),  as well as the back-loaning of kedai from Bahasa (Malaysia) into --> Hokkien.  In my Hokkien repertoire,  kedai is not used,  instead kedai appears in my Teochew repertoire.

      For your reading pleasure angel.png

       ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      You do know that kedai is borrowed from Tamil ?

      Hehe, you can go and verify.

      So, that means, in Malaysia, the Tamils dominated the M'sia business ?

       ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      For swike,  type swiké into the Orth box.

      >>

      swiké

       1(dish made from) edible frog

      Chiangchiu 水雞 súi† ke† Douglas1899:463b   Douglas1899:200b 

      hokkien a post expired liao.

      wanna start another?

      icon_lol.gif

  • BanguIzai's Avatar
    7,327 posts since Mar '10
    •  

      Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      I don't know about kedai coming from the tamils lol but if have you been to indo yet? You just go to any shop and chances are the Chinese boss is in the background at a table while the workers at the shop front. I'm not surprised why the locals have decided to adopt certain words and ways of the Hokkien people.

      ya, been to indon and it's sumatra oni & me not observant to see got chinese boss at the background leh.  i agree with you dat becoz of business due to chinese that why certain words came to be adopted into indon.  especially hokkien words forming the bulk of the majority due to it's sheer number in size, according to statistics  cf. 1930, Percentage by dialect group of Chinese in the Netherland Indies, pg 77:  Hokkien 46.7%, Hakka 16.9%, Cantonese 11.4%, Teochew 7.4%, etc.,   showing the Hokkien people in Indonesia (in 1930) even outnumber that of Hokkien people in Singapore by ratio already (in 1957,  which is 27 years later), cf. 1957, Dialect groups as percentage of all Chinese in Singapore, pg 83: Hokkien 40.6%, Teochew 22.5%, Cantonese 18.9%, etc.  In terms of absolute numbers, cf. 1930, The Chinese in Netherlands Indies, by region and dialect group, total Hokkien - 554,981 peoples (1930),   compared to, cf. 1957, Dialect groups as percentage of all Chinese in Singapore, total Hokkien - 442,707 peoples  (1957 - 27 years later),  if you can help me to calulate the natural (b)irth-(d)eath linear growth of the Indonesian Hokkien population since 1930 to 1957 excluding immigration inflow, a big difference margin can be shown.

      Other than that, the mainstay of loanwords in the Indonesia vocab are from Hokkien is due to simply that they are the 1st biggest wave of immigrants, cf pg 40, Observations on the population data:

      The census data reveal that the majority of the Chinese in Java were Hokkiens, and that the Hokkiens were among the earliest Chinese settlers. "The Chinese who first came to the Netherlands Indies in large numbers were Hok Kiens" (Volkstelling1930:159). Both their number and their early arrival must have been conducive to exerting influence on Malay.

      Back to archaeology icon_razz.gif, (cf. pg 41) tombstone inscriptions are a dependable source of data on the early Chinese settlers in South East Asia. The 4 earliest Chinese tombstones in South East Asia known, as recorded by Professor Wolfgang Franke, appear to be as follows:

       

      • Probably the earliest one is found in Brunei, and dated 1264 A.D.; this shows an unmistakable connection with Tsoanchiu, in Hokkien Province.
      • The next earliest, dated 1592 A.D., is also outside our immediate area, being found in Patani, in southern Thailand. The inscription shows that it commemorates a woman, and although her precise place of origin is not ascertainable, Professor Franke informs me that almost certainly she was a Hokkien woman.
      • The third oldest is found in Melaka, and dates from 1622 I know of no specific evidence that it commerates a Hokkien; but that is a reasonable assumption, as later tombstones in the same place do commemorate Hokkiens.
      • Evidently the fourth oldest tombstone is that of So Bing Kong, erected in Batavia in 1644. It is known that So Bing Kong, head of the Chinese, was Hokkien.
          Sticking with West Java, we have a passing reference in Van Leur's well-known book (Indonesian Trade and Society, 1955:378) to Chinese from Changchow who were traders in Banten, West Java, ca 1615 A.D., that is even before the Dutch had established themselves in the neighbouring Batavia.
          Evidence of subsequent Hokkien presence in Banten has been revealed by the investigations of Dr. Claudine Salmon and Dr. Denys Lombard on Chinese tombstones. The inscriptions of seven early tombstones from Banten, dated between 1693 and 1721, all show places of origin in Chiangchew. Later tombstone inscriptions in Banten, dated from 1754 to 1853, also offer evidence for a conspicuous Chiangchew presence at least till 1823. Dr. Claudine Salmon, discussing Chinese tombstones in Banten dating from ca 1800, writes that "toutes les inscriptions appartiennent a des hommes originaires de la prefecture de Zhangzhou dans le sud du Fujian, d'ou venaient a l'epoque la plupart des Chinois de Java." This suggests a dominant Chiangchew presence there from the late seventeenth up to the early nineteenth centuries. There is evidence therefore to sustain a view that the earliest Chinese migrants were not simple Hokkiens, but were specifically Chiangchews (Hokkiens).

       

    • Originally posted by Clivebenss:

      hokkien a post expired liao.

      wanna start another?

      icon_lol.gif

      huh i dun need,  you want, you start one, i will follow suit.

      else,  we help Rock^Star to build up his forum by doing so here oso can

  • Moderator
    Rock^Star's Avatar
    11,142 posts since Jul '05
    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

       

      ya, been to indon and it's sumatra oni & me not observant to see got chinese boss at the background leh.  i agree with you dat becoz of business due to chinese that why certain words came to be adopted into indon.  especially hokkien words forming the bulk of the majority due to it's sheer number in size, according to statistics  cf. 1930, Percentage by dialect group of Chinese in the Netherland Indies, pg 77:  Hokkien 46.7%, Hakka 16.9%, Cantonese 11.4%, Teochew 7.4%, etc.,   showing the Hokkien people in Indonesia (in 1930) even outnumber that of Hokkien people in Singapore by ratio already (in 1957,  which is 27 years later), cf. 1957, Dialect groups as percentage of all Chinese in Singapore, pg 83: Hokkien 40.6%, Teochew 22.5%, Cantonese 18.9%, etc.  In terms of absolute numbers, cf. 1930, The Chinese in Netherlands Indies, by region and dialect group, total Hokkien - 554,981 peoples (1930),   compared to, cf. 1957, Dialect groups as percentage of all Chinese in Singapore, total Hokkien - 442,707 peoples  (1957 - 27 years later),  if you can help me to calulate the natural (b)irth-(d)eath linear growth of the Indonesian Hokkien population since 1930 to 1957 excluding immigration inflow, a big difference margin can be shown.

      Other than that, the mainstay of loanwords in the Indonesia vocab are from Hokkien is due to simply that they are the 1st biggest wave of immigrants, cf pg 40, Observations on the population data:

      Back to archaeology icon_razz.gif, (cf. pg 41) tombstone inscriptions are a dependable source of data on the early Chinese settlers in South East Asia. The 4 earliest Chinese tombstones in South East Asia known, as recorded by Professor Wolfgang Franke, appear to be as follows:

       

      • Probably the earliest one is found in Brunei, and dated 1264 A.D.; this shows an unmistakable connection with Tsoanchiu, in Hokkien Province.
      • The next earliest, dated 1592 A.D., is also outside our immediate area, being found in Patani, in southern Thailand. The inscription shows that it commemorates a woman, and although her precise place of origin is not ascertainable, Professor Franke informs me that almost certainly she was a Hokkien woman.
      • The third oldest is found in Melaka, and dates from 1622 I know of no specific evidence that it commerates a Hokkien; but that is a reasonable assumption, as later tombstones in the same place do commemorate Hokkiens.
      • Evidently the fourth oldest tombstone is that of So Bing Kong, erected in Batavia in 1644. It is known that So Bing Kong, head of the Chinese, was Hokkien.

       

      Haha you very academic leh...all the figures and years. A dissertation should be a pc of cake to you. By the way, any idea about the hinghwa dialect? It's like hokkien but not so hokkien.

      And as for those tombstones that you've mentioned, that reminds me of an email I've received from a Malaysian friend years back. It's about having found a chinese tomb in northern malaysia, kelantan in the 15th century. So there was some dispute about Islam having come to the country first. (That's another issue lol) And there was some theory about Hang Tuah and Hang Jebat, those warrior brothers actually being chinese muslims....kind of like a slap on Malaysia's face because they have always been a source of pride for the bumuputeras.

      Been to melaka before? Then you must have heard or seen the Hang Li Poh well, the princess sent by the Ming emperor in a diplomatic marriage to the local sultan.

    • Originally posted by BanguIzai:

      huh i dun need,  you want, you start one, i will follow suit.

      else,  we help Rock^Star to build up his forum by doing so here oso can

      That would be nice :) Hope this can help all chinese language enthusiasts (Dialects of china included) since they are so highly linked together.

  • BanguIzai's Avatar
    7,327 posts since Mar '10
    • Originally posted by Rock^Star:

      Haha you very academic leh...all the figures and years. A dissertation should be a pc of cake to you. By the way, any idea about the hinghwa dialect? It's like hokkien but not so hokkien.

      And as for those tombstones that you've mentioned, that reminds me of an email I've received from a Malaysian friend years back. It's about having found a chinese tomb in northern malaysia, kelantan in the 15th century. So there was some dispute about Islam having come to the country first. (That's another issue lol) And there was some theory about Hang Tuah and Hang Jebat, those warrior brothers actually being chinese muslims....kind of like a slap on Malaysia's face because they have always been a source of pride for the bumuputeras.

      Been to melaka before? Then you must have heard or seen the Hang Li Poh well, the princess sent by the Ming emperor in a diplomatic marriage to the local sultan.

      Good reading milestones for me!   Thanks to the pointers in paragraph 2 and 3 (on Hang Tuah / Hang Jebat issue   and  the Hang Li Poh issue)  which I had ZERO INTEREST of, from now I will go and read up and find out some things on them.  Been to Melaka too,  I usually not interested in culture, archaeology and anthropology unless they come secondary to the issue of the linguistic issue itself.

      That's why a lot of things on culture ones, usually I don't know, and therefore I seldom talk about them too, as you can see from my posts, I usually keep to linguistic topics,  with anthropological, archaeological and cultural evidences coming in secondarily (as and when) only.

      About Hinghwa dialect ah,  wat aspects of linguistics you want me to zoom in into?   If not, at the moment,  you can read a short post on Singapore Hinghwa as an introduction first:

      http://www.sgforums.com/forums/3545/topics/425775?page=3#post_10203745

      Perhaps, you would like start off from here by elaborating on your statement "It's like hokkien but not so hokkien." first ?  tongue.png

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