D-day 23rd may pedra branca
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So we now know that under the international law that if one is bold and assertive enough to make a claim even for some historically remote ownership not exercised for a hundred years a country with some historical past ownership of some far-off islet will still be able to make a claim against de facto sovereign rights of another. All a country needs to do is to make a claim for two or three islands far off its shore by relying on some past historically deemed ownership not even signed or certified by any international agencies and the international court of justice in order to be perceived as just or fair, will most likely end up relying on such assertive claim of past historical records simply give a compromise judgment down the middle and award the assertive claimant for historical reason some compromise. In domestic laws there is no such thing. A land once occupied or possessed even by adverse possession by someone else other than the titled or rightful historical owner might be deemed as owned by the party in actual possession not based on historical reason or documents dated back to the beginning of time. If Malaysia had not made claims for two or three islets but only Pedra Blanca it might not have won the middle rock which by virtue of proximity or possession should have been finally owned or deemed to be owned by Singapore. DPM still said he was happy with the decision.
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this topic shld be renamed:
Pedra Branca to SG, rocks to Malaysia.
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for mighty singapore, whats important is not north or south of the island but east and west, along the straits of singapore into south china sea! to me, we still stand claims to the 3rd rock which will be disputable between sgp and the indons.
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Originally posted by ChiBet:
The island is important cos Sinagpore is planning to build ERP there but they will call it ESP
then all ships sailing through there need to have cashcard and IU
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Haha, maybe the Orang Lauts should make some land claims of their own, I mean since history holds precedence.
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Originally posted by idwar:
Idwar is here.....
So Singapore got the PB island. Malaysia got Middle Rocks which are less than 1km to the south ( 0.6 nautical miles). This means Singapore waters extend 0.3 nm southwards only, to the half way mark to Middle Rocks. Norrthwards Singapore gets 3 nm. as Johore is about 7 km away
It also means Malaysian ships can cut into PB waters to get to Middle Rocks...right of free passage.....without having to ask for permission.
See map.....Sinagpore gets half of middle Channel. Malaysia gets whole of South Channel.....unless Singapore kpkb and starts her nonsense with South Ledge
Right of free passage to where?
Isn't middle rock more of a navigation hazard than anything?
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Originally posted by CX: Right of free passage to where?
Isn't middle rock more of a navigation hazard than anything?
As usual idwar the malaysian clown (a fact he tries to conceal but is well known by everyone here) is talking out of his arse. Since the ICJ was not asked to determine the delineation of the territorial waters, I would take everything he posts as a load of crap until the joint technical committee (which idwar feels is less qualified then his esteemed self) decides on the maritime boundary. And if it is unfavorable to Singapore we can go back to court, stonewall or simply continue what we've been doing for the past 28 years, since the RMN isn't really in a position to contest that with us.
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Originally posted by ChiBet:
The island is important cos Sinagpore is planning to build ERP there but they will call it ESP
then all ships sailing through there need to have cashcard and IU
cheebye la u
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ICJ's preference not to make any decision to Southern Ledge - preferring to let interested parties to conclude the demarkation of territorial waters beneath it - will result in Indonesia also joining as rival claimant to this piece of low-tide outcrop.
As Prof Simon Tay had said on CNA, there is no winner and no loser in the outcome of this ICJ proceedings.
Singapore and Malaysia had managed to resolve clearly their respective positions, and this will be the basis for clearer directions in the administration of the approaches to the sea lanes and territorial waters near and around Pedra Branca.
It will be interesting to read the views of the four dissenting judges, when they are finally posted on the ICJ Website : http://www.icj-cij.org/docket/files/130/14492.pdf
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Win liao si bo ?
So Singapore can start digging oil from the surrounding lor ?
I suspect got oil underneath .
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i heard from a Army friend , once we control the area , we control the air space as well .
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Oil possible , natural gas also possible that area got .... PB is the only place we might have some natural resources .
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Originally posted by Poolman:
Oil possible , natural gas also possible that area got .... PB is the only place we might have some natural resources .
Malaysians and Indonesians also interested if there got natural resources. Might as well co-operate with them to do the digging.... (save the trouble of a diplomatic crisis)
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Actually, you'ed realize that the Middle Rocks is very very close to Pedra Branca. Even if there is oil there, which I doubt so, the resources will be highly debated and we will now have a fresh round of dialogue. Seriously, what I don't get is why the ICJ split the islands and gave 1 to each. Ought to be a winner takes all policy.
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"Hopefully, Singapore will not be arrogant over the latest decision on Pulau Batu Puteh"
That arsewipe. I am sorely tempted to rub his nose in it just to spite him.
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What matters is that the republic of singapore's ships hvae the right to be there and excercise our republic's rights now.
This is the most important.
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Originally posted by Fatum:
basically, they are saying that here's a piece for you, and here's one for you .... now both of you can fight on over this remaining one .....
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Someone should sail down to the middle rocks and legde and hack down the rocks to the sea.
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Originally posted by FirePig:
Someone should sail down to the middle rocks and legde and hack down the rocks to the sea.
No need.Wait for global warming can already.
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the malaysians have now filed a claim for south ledge ....
I see another legal battle brewing ....
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Originally posted by Fatum:
the malaysians have now filed a claim for south ledge ....
I see another legal battle brewing ....
Looking at the map..... South Ledge seems to be quite near to Indonesia..... do anyone here think there would be a 3rd party....
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Originally posted by hloc:
Looking at the map..... South Ledge seems to be quite near to Indonesia..... do anyone here think there would be a 3rd party....
not unless there's oil ....
but the judgement's pretty silly really ... we own the piece of real estate nearer to malaysia, while they own another piece of real estate further SOUTH ....
and now the malaysians are up to their usual tricks again ....
shall we just blow south ledge out of the water ? .....
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Prior to the events that led to the First Dessert Storm, Saddam Hussein had accused Kuwait of stealing Iraqi oil by drilling at an angle from Kuwaiti territory into Iraq.
At best, if there is oil in the seas around PB, Singapore can offer - to Malaysia and Indonesia - our expertise in building an on-site FSPO. to back-up the exploration efforts, as was done for Vietnam.
At worst, Singapore can modify the existing communications tower into a drilling unit to access the oil.
At the end of it all, whatever the outcome, can Singaporeans dare to hope that the benefits will result in a lower cost of living in Singapore ?
Or will the profits be used for the wild trips made by GIC and Temasek Inc ?
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can anyone tell me the implication of the last sentence in press release
23/05/2008
MFA Press Statement: International Court of Justice awards sovereignty of Pedra Branca to Singapore, 23 May 2008http://www.mfa.gov.sg/
''...As indicated in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs Press Statement dated 15 September 1980, Singapore has a territorial sea limit that extends up to a maximum of 12 nautical miles and an Exclusive Economic Zone. This is consistent with the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea of 10 December 1982, which Singapore is a State Party to.
The precise coordinates of Singapore's territorial sea and Exclusive Economic Zone will be announced at an appropriate time. Should the limits of its territorial sea or Exclusive Economic Zone overlap with claims of neighbouring countries, Singapore will negotiate with those countries with a view to arriving at agreed delimitations in accordance with international law. Singapore reserves its position on international agreements it is not a party to."
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Jane's Fighting Ships said SG has not declared the limit of
Exclusive Economic Zone.
So ,pl share more here.