Originally posted by DeerHunter:And you are beginning to sound like a sore loser, press 'delete'
you hope.
Originally posted by DeerHunter:While it is nothing new, one must also consider the broader view, based on facts. it's an est 2.4% ( or upper end 4-5%) that left Singapore, WE MUST NOT FORGET ABOUT OUR est 97.6% that remains, and it is these people whom are more critical in need to be administered and provided with social spending based on what we have and what we grow to have.
MM Lee is quite concerned about the brain drain. When u mentioned about people trying to escape full time NS, there are methods to dodge esp nowdays can
downgrade to PES C or E.
Originally posted by redDUST:you hope.
Nope. I dont hope. or have any hope on you. Dont think too highly of yourself that i would care about you. You are just another ungrateful deadweight living in our society that i have to pay GST to support.
Originally posted by DeerHunter:Nope. I dont hope. or have any hope on you. Dont think too highly of yourself that i would care about you. You are just another ungrateful deadweight living in our society that i have to pay GST to support.
whoops, see now who's losing it now?
time for a new nick?
Originally posted by will4:
MM Lee is quite concerned about the brain drain. When u mentioned about people trying to escape full time NS, there are methods to dodge esp nowdays candowngrade to PES C or E.
That's true. But then it would be up to SAF to work out solutions, or if you have any that could help, i am sure they would be appreciative.
Any country and society would be concerned with brain drain, not just ours. But at the end of the day, we have to be practical and be more concerned about the big percentage that stay, and give them the best administration one can, and work on solutions that will give the next 1000 leavers better economic reasons to stay, afterall, most of them are chinese, and be honest, no $ no talk. Either we try to make them more civic concious - think more about society than money, or encourage more high value foreign investments that pays better.
Originally posted by redDUST:whoops, see now who's losing it now?
time for a new nick?
You must be lonely that you want and desire me to play with you. Tell you what, leave your number here. I am sure some guys would love to play with you. And leave us adults to discussion. I can understand your lack of intelligence is daunting when adults talk serious matters.
Originally posted by DeerHunter:
But at the end of the day, we have to be practical and be more concerned about the big percentage that stay, and give them the best administration one can, and work on solutions that will give the next 1000 leavers better economic reasons to stay, afterall, most of them are chinese, and be honest, no $ no talk. Either we try to make them more civic concious - think more about society than money, or encourage more high value foreign investments that pays better.
right out of the PAP textbook.
next time, be more original...and walk the talk.
Originally posted by DeerHunter:
You must be lonely that you want and desire me to play with you. Tell you what, leave your number here. I am sure some guys would love to play with you. And leave us adults to discussion. I can understand your lack of intelligence is daunting when adults talk serious matters.
(again) full of yourself.
i am sorry, your time ran out!
Originally posted by redDUST:right out of the PAP textbook.
next time, be more original...and walk the talk.
lol! jealousy knows no end. Hey kiddo, there are people who have more intelligence than you have. I am only just one, there are many more others. So you better dont be too disappointed with your lack.
Originally posted by eagle:Seems like many Singaporeans rather migrate overseas and be not treated as equals than staying in Singapore...
hmmm
I also read some of the local advised their PR fren not to take up local citizenship.
Originally posted by huzane89:
sgdiehard,
it actually does matter. The reason is simple. Singapore is the singapore today because of our ancestors that worked this land. Those who came to singapore from other countries after singapore have become developed just come here for an easy ride. Borned, breed and decended from long generations of singaporeans do deserve better rights because what our ancestors contributed to the land. Its our birth right.
If you are not born in singapore, but a singapore citizen. Please remember, your ancestors didnt work in this land to make it as it is today. So just live with it. No need to try and convince others that you are of our ranks.
Birth right? what right as a Singaporean do you think you have inherited from your father, or your ancestor? Your ancestor could demonstrate against the colonial government and go on strike but now you can't even hold a peaceful demonstration.
The constitution of Singapore give special rights to Malay Singaporean, born in Singapore, Johore or anywhere. Chinese, Indian, Eurasian...Singaporean, by birth or nationalization, are all equal in every right. I don't have to convince anybody that I have the right of Singaporean. What better right do you think you have?
While I respect all who have stayed in this land, it must be clear that Singapore began its development only after its independent from Malaysia. If the LKY's party, including Goh Keng Swee, Toh C C, Rajaratnam....did not lead Singapore out of Malaysia, Singapore would not be what it is today. Don't blow too much about what your ancestors do for this land before then, they were probably just working for their colonial master.
What really is important for Singaporean today is what they intend to do for the land, especially those who don't like the present government or system. If you are among those who would migrate, let it is clear that you are not of my ranks.
Originally posted by redDUST:gotta say the bar is getting lower....
now, any manuel, qong qian and prakash can be a PR and citiizen with minimal fuss.
Now practically anybody who can find a job in Singapore can become PR.
Last time we serve NS before we became citizen. Now they can be citizens and their next generation serve NS.
Think government is desperate in increasing the population.
Originally posted by sgdiehard:Now practically anybody who can find a job in Singapore can become PR.
Last time we serve NS before we became citizen. Now they can be citizens and their next generation serve NS.
Think government is desperate in increasing the population.
yes, i have seen it with my own eyes; frens and colleagues who became PR overnight. unfortunately, noneof whom i have spoken to have the intention to stay on. they will contribute productively during their stay here but they are pretty sure they will return home. these are the white collar workers holding executive positions.
so, it is up to one how they want to read this. one could argue that when they are here, they are a productive unit to the well-being of singapore, but they will eventually leave and be `replaced' by another FT. whether singapore's social integration, patriotism to the country and other aspects that defines nation building matures and remain intact remains to be seen.
Originally posted by redDUST:yes, i have seen it with my own eyes; frens and colleagues who became PR overnight. unfortunately, noneof whom i have spoken to have the intention to stay on. they will contribute productively during their stay here but they are pretty sure they will return home. these are the white collar workers holding executive positions.
so, it is up to one how they want to read this. one could argue that when they are here, they are a productive unit to the well-being of singapore, but they will eventually leave and be `replaced' by another FT. whether singapore's social integration, patriotism to the country and other aspects that defines nation building matures and remain intact remains to be seen.
What defines nation building would come to nought if even Singaporean would consider leaving or migrating when they are not happy with the country, or when there are trouble. But while living here, if the PR remains productive to the well-being of Singapore compared to Singaporeans who are cashing out their "birth right" before they migrate, I would much prefer PR.
Originally posted by sgdiehard:What defines nation building would come to nought if even Singaporean would consider leaving or migrating when they are not happy with the country, or when there are trouble. But while living here, if the PR remains productive to the well-being of Singapore compared to Singaporeans who are cashing out their "birth right" before they migrate, I would much prefer PR.
would one leave for the sake of leaving?
the situation with netting more pr is forced. the govenment do not have a choice. it is a matter of survival if inflows do not match the outflow to sustain its economic relevance.
in any given situation, i don't think any singaporean will leave if they have a choice or take to their leaving lightly. things aren't necessary better on the other as we all know. the `push' factor has got to be pretty potent.
Originally posted by will4:
I also read some of the local advised their PR fren not to take up local citizenship.
They should take up local citizenship, because it is easier to migrate to US or other countries when they want to.
I do know of PRC scholars who score pretty well in uni, and already have plans to work in the US right after their bond. Or even if they break bond and run to the US to work within a year plus, there's nothing much Sg could do also
My colleague has already have plans to migrate to Australia with his whole family lol well i feel happy for him thou.
Originally posted by sgdiehard:Birth right? what right as a Singaporean do you think you have inherited from your father, or your ancestor? Your ancestor could demonstrate against the colonial government and go on strike but now you can't even hold a peaceful demonstration.
The constitution of Singapore give special rights to Malay Singaporean, born in Singapore, Johore or anywhere. Chinese, Indian, Eurasian...Singaporean, by birth or nationalization, are all equal in every right. I don't have to convince anybody that I have the right of Singaporean. What better right do you think you have?
While I respect all who have stayed in this land, it must be clear that Singapore began its development only after its independent from Malaysia. If the LKY's party, including Goh Keng Swee, Toh C C, Rajaratnam....did not lead Singapore out of Malaysia, Singapore would not be what it is today. Don't blow too much about what your ancestors do for this land before then, they were probably just working for their colonial master.
What really is important for Singaporean today is what they intend to do for the land, especially those who don't like the present government or system. If you are among those who would migrate, let it is clear that you are not of my ranks.
well yawns,
as i have stated, those ancestors who worked this land before it is the singapore today. So what if they worked for colonial masters? They had a hard life in this land and thrive make it a better place. Those who came after that, is here for an easy ride.
No point trying to say that you are of the same ranks.
BTW, your grandchildren would be considered a "true" singaporean.
Its not really easy to migrate. You need money to start new overseas.
Humans are humans, anywhere they go, they wont be happy, even if they reach utopia.
Originally posted by redDUST:would one leave for the sake of leaving?
the situation with netting more pr is forced. the govenment do not have a choice. it is a matter of survival if inflows do not match the outflow to sustain its economic relevance.
in any given situation, i don't think any singaporean will leave if they have a choice or take to their leaving lightly. things aren't necessary better on the other as we all know. the `push' factor has got to be pretty potent.
Nobody would say they leave for the sake of leaving. I've heard people migrating because they don't want their children to be subjected to the tough competition in the education system here, especially learning Chinese. Some parents believe with the education here, their children can go anywhere in the world after that.
Migrating today is much easier than it was before, from the point of preparation, not in terms of acceptance by the host countries. Last time many people migrated to the UK or Australia only after 1 visit. Today people can do all kinds of preparations before they go. I would say earlier migrants were taking much greater risk than we do today.
In the past, people migrated with no plan to return. Today people leave their CPF money behind, leave their HDB flat or other properties behind, just in case.
Singapore is never a place to be migrated to, because it is small and vulnerable. This factor alone is making many people think hard if they should convert their PR to citizenship. The question is how far Singapore can continue to go. Political stability, its ability to survive among the neighboring countries (don't tell me this is PAP propaganda), just a few questions. In Australia, if the local whites and the lebonese riot on the streets in the gold coast, you go to Sydney, and when the bush fire come, you move to Perth. In Singapore, a major incident in Geylang, we go on the boat if the situation is not contained. Don't tell me this is PAP propaganda.
But what me and my family experienced so far is that my parents made the right choice. The people (those older ones) of Singapore were united and determined to build a nation, my parents trusted them and decided to be part of this nation building.
Leaving is indeed a difficult decision requiring complicated deliberation, it is not just about LKY.
Sure there are other considerations but the dishonorable despots do not inspire loyalty to the country because foreigners have a better deal than the citizens.
So many simply migrate and come back as a foreigner to join the dishonorable rulers in exploiting the rest that stays.
Furthermore, the dogs and the apathetic people that simply allows the dishonorable rulers to do what they like might soon suffer the consequences of their dishonorable policies with the world wide economic problems.
Originally posted by huzane89:well yawns,
as i have stated, those ancestors who worked this land before it is the singapore today. So what if they worked for colonial masters? They had a hard life in this land and thrive make it a better place. Those who came after that, is here for an easy ride.
No point trying to say that you are of the same ranks.
BTW, your grandchildren would be considered a "true" singaporean.
Its not really easy to migrate. You need money to start new overseas.
Humans are humans, anywhere they go, they wont be happy, even if they reach utopia.
If my grandchildren were "true" singaporean like you, I would be ashamed.
People who work for their master work to please their master, in return they were given 3 meals a day. The bangladeshi, PRC, indian, philippino here are working hard to build on this land, will their grandchildren be considered "true" Singaporean? No. But these workers are here as "FT" (as a respect to them), they do the work no Singaporean, especially the young ones are not capable of doing and they worked for their employers, not their master.
Who get an easy ride? only those who live on the inheritance from their parents.
Let me confirm again, you are not of my rank.
Sgdieheart,
When i was in Midef at Taglin Road and Mr Kayu and MP Chan worked 4 me and I saw a lot of these Panang chineses' files, I had told Mr.Kayu pls dont trust them, they r here to eat our fruits and when the sky changed they will leave us (who born here and sweat our blood here 4 the next g.)
Pls go back 2 Panang where u belonged in(pls dont ask how I know where u r from?) why u come here, 2 lick my cock!!!
Regards,
LKY
Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
Sure there are other considerations but the dishonorable despots do not inspire loyalty to the country because foreigners have a better deal than the citizens.
So many simply migrate and come back as a foreigner to join the dishonorable rulers in exploiting the rest that stays.
Furthermore, the dogs and the apathetic people that simply allows the dishonorable rulers to do what they like might soon suffer the consequences of their dishonorable policies with the world wide economic problems.
Can understand you are frustrated but Rome was not built in one day my friend.
Originally posted by Leeky:Sgdieheart,
When i was in Midef at Taglin Road and Mr Kayu and MP Chan worked 4 me and I saw a lot of these Panang chineses' files, I had told Mr.Kayu pls dont trust them, they r here to eat our fruits and when the sky changed they will leave us (who born here and sweat our blood here 4 the next g.)
Pls go back 2 Panang where u belonged in(pls dont ask how I know where u r from?) why u come here, 2 lick my cock!!!
Regards,
LKY
Who are in Singapore now, now that the sky had changed, you or me? Who is more trustworthy as a Singaporean?
Hahaha...I din come from Peneng, try again.....KL? Malacca?
Why are you signing off as LKY? Should sign off as MM, that's the title of LKY. You can't be LKY, not of the same caliber.
If your little brother is ichy, go rub against the wall, don't ask people to lick. yiak! You learn that in TW, or Coquitlam?
Originally posted by sgdiehard:If my grandchildren were "true" singaporean like you, I would be ashamed.
People who work for their master work to please their master, in return they were given 3 meals a day. The bangladeshi, PRC, indian, philippino here are working hard to build on this land, will their grandchildren be considered "true" Singaporean? No. But these workers are here as "FT" (as a respect to them), they do the work no Singaporean, especially the young ones are not capable of doing and they worked for their employers, not their master.
Who get an easy ride? only those who live on the inheritance from their parents.
Let me confirm again, you are not of my rank.
too bad for your "honour".
FTs may work here, have jobs that no s'porean youths want. But at the end of the day, they would think of going back to their homeland. Retire in india, phillipine or wherever they came from. At the end of the day, they would go back. Ask any maids, or bangladesh or china nurses etc. Would they want to retire and live in singapore? Of course not, they family is back in their homeland. They are just here to work. If singapore is at war, would they defend it? Most likely they would go home.
If they stayed and worked on this land, then of course, their children would be considered as "true" singaporeans.
"True" singaporeans deserve our birth rights. That's what our ancestors did, came here and build a future for their decendents.
Of course, i am not of your rank. You are lower than me. I wont want to "dirty" myself.