FUHUA SECONDARY PRINCIPAL CRAZY ONCE AGAIN!
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Sadly, there is no alternative punishment.Originally posted by furb:I understand that there is other alternatives to punishment. This is why I say in my previous posts that TS failed to provide information on whether any alternative punishment is given. I also mentioned that all my post is base on assuming that alternative punishments is given before school takes such extreme punishment.
Besides, TS is just posting what a student had written. -
This is getting more and more interesting...
I personally don't think the problem is about whether or not students refuse to follow the school rules and obey them. It's about whether or not they mindlessly follow them, or think through the logic behind these rules.
The arguments presented here are that coloured bras provide a distraction for the guys. Perhaps not for people like me who has 'gone out of the growing up stage' (I'm only 18, btw, and is still growing up), but for the young teenagers who get excited at every simple thing the girls are 'revealing'.
But trust me, I've been that stage before (and not too long ago). Yes, I do agree that at that immature age, young boys like us will tend to pay a bit more attention to the type of undergarment the girls wear (err...but I'm out of it, ya), and talk about it for hours. It's all part of growing up.
But still, that's all! It's not as if the guys took photos of the girls and spread it over the internet, neither did the girl got raped or something. Perhaps computer gaming provides more distraction for the guys, so does it mean that the school should ban students from playing computer games? (Perhaps some would say yes, I don't know)
Besides, I really don't find wearing coloured or fanciful undergarment 'indecent'. Yes, perhaps it attracts the attention of some young boys. Pretty girls with long hair also attracts the attention of some young teenagers with ragin homones...does it mean we should make all girls wear a mask?
Back to the part on following school rules again. Like I've mentioned, while some would say that it's all about discipline and learning how to obey orders, I personally think that as thinking individuals, we should never follow rules and regulations mindlessly. Rules are there for a reason, yes. But is the reason a valid reason? This is not about being rebellious.
Perhaps one may say that the student choose the school in the first place, thus he/her have to follow it's rule. But I think the student don't hate the school as a whole. It's just a very small part of the school rule that they are unsatisfied with. There's no need to ask them to leave the school if they don't like the school rules.
And please, this forum is a place for people to debate and share their opinion or ideas...not hurl insults at each other and start a flame war. Please do not simply accuse other people as a 'pampered child' to defend your stance, it's downright lame and childish! Provide a proper argument. Nobody pay attention to mindless insults (you know who I'm talking about...). -
please don't get jealous over your lack of parental guidance?Originally posted by babylynn:COMPLAIN TO YOUR MAMA... MUMMY SOMEONE BULLY ME!!
LOOKS WHO'S TALKING, U OR ME THAT SENT -
I think its getting more and more ridiculous instead. Stereotyping all teenagers as 'pampered child', too pampered? eh come on la, those kids you see might be just the black sheeps?Originally posted by mahawarrior:And please, this forum is a place for people to debate and share their opinion or ideas...not hurl insults at each other and start a flame war. Please do not simply accuse other people as a 'pampered child' to defend your stance, it's downright lame and childish! Provide a proper argument. Nobody pay attention to mindless insults (you know who I'm talking about...). -
Originally posted by babylynn:THEN GET YOURSELF OUT FROM HERE!!
And I suppose hypocrisy isn't well managed here. Talk about the need for respect and the basic requirement of well-mannered conversation is not even met.
How disquieting. -
Yes, you are right in the guys will not photos of the girls and spread it over the internet. Neither will the girls get raped in school, however that does not includes outside of school. About the distraction, its not about guys who talk about it after schools or during break. The distraction is when guys talk about it in lesson, thus missing important knowledge taught by teachers during lesson.Originally posted by mahawarrior:I personally don't think the problem is about whether or not students refuse to follow the school rules and obey them. It's about whether or not they mindlessly follow them, or think through the logic behind these rules.
........
But still, that's all! It's not as if the guys took photos of the girls and spread it over the internet, neither did the girl got raped or something. Perhaps computer gaming provides more distraction for the guys, so does it mean that the school should ban students from playing computer games? (Perhaps some would say yes, I don't know)
Besides, I really don't find wearing coloured or fanciful undergarment 'indecent'. Yes, perhaps it attracts the attention of some young boys. Pretty girls with long hair also attracts the attention of some young teenagers with ragin homones...does it mean we should make all girls wear a mask?
Back to the part on following school rules again. Like I've mentioned, while some would say that it's all about discipline and learning how to obey orders, I personally think that as thinking individuals, we should never follow rules and regulations mindlessly. Rules are there for a reason, yes. But is the reason a valid reason? This is not about being rebellious.
Yes, it not indecent to wear coloured bra, I agree. However, in this case it is seen through the uniform and it happens in school. You can be as indecent as you want outside but not in school as it affects others. You have to take note that school is a place for young teen/children to learn and students at this age is easily influenced. You can do harm to yourself, but not in process of when you are harming yourself, you also harm others.
If one start to be pervetic and spread his thoughts around, imagine how other guys would behave. Like I have said school is a learning insituition, therefore the one in-charge have to stamp out all obstacles that might prevent the students from studying.
Rules are created for a reason, whether is it for safety reason or to save school's face value. Whether you like it or not, you are in the school and you jolly well follow it. Don't like it? Leave then and see if other schools accept you. I've been a through sec school without any serious problem, except being late for 3 times for the entire sec school life and resulted in getting detention. I don't see the reason why can't others do it, besides those rules aren't affecting me at all. I can still play and laugh with those 'stupid' rules around.
Anyway, according to TS, students are caught and ask to remove their coloured bra and wait for their parents to come with white/skin-coloured bra for them. This shows that the girl will not be expose to students without their bra, neither will students be walking home with their bra. So why the heck are some saying it is humiliating for the girl to be expose to students and walking home without bra. Its only short term for the girl to be without their bra, isn't it?Originally posted by discriminated:Lastly, students were caught and asked to remove their non skin-coloured undergarments and wait till their parents come with a white/skin-coloured undergarment for them.
TS also mentioned that this result in low self-esteem among the girls? I find this sentence rather interesting.
Firstly, the students are to wait for parents to come thus no exposing to students without bra.
Secondly, without bra is only short term. Serve well as a punishment, not too overboard.
Thirdly, students nowadays have a rather thick skin don't you think? Even after getting scolded in front of class, kicked out of class, calling parents, suspension and other form of punishments, which is also so called humiliating, students still repeat their mistakes and some even laugh about it.
Forthly, how will it cause a serious low of self-esteem if the students only commit the mistake once and not many times? If so, isn't she being rebellious?
Low self-esteem? Think again. -
And yea, this black sheeps are making a fuss out of it, even though they are in the wrong and guiding those 'white' sheep along to become black. This is why school have to stamp out this black sheep.Originally posted by Y_Shun:I think its getting more and more ridiculous instead. Stereotyping all teenagers as 'pampered child', too pampered? eh come on la, those kids you see might be just the black sheeps? -
Guys guys guys...
If the student despite repeated warning still insist on carrying on the offense, please punish him/her severely. But I must agree that asking her to take out the bra is too extreme.
Maybe they should have a white T-shirt ready at all times in the school's office. If any girl persist in wearing colored undergarment, ask her to wear that t-shirt under her existing shirt... -
Do you know that most of the school doesn't allow wearing T-shirt under school uniform?Originally posted by bigmouthjoe:Guys guys guys...
If the student despite repeated warning still insist on carrying on the offense, please punish him/her severely. But I must agree that asking her to take out the bra is too extreme.
Maybe they should have a white T-shirt ready at all times in the school's office. If any girl persist in wearing colored undergarment, ask her to wear that t-shirt under her existing shirt...
Normally they will ask you to take it out. -
Well, its too bad you missed the point on the dignity of the poor girls. YOu condone and support the fact the girls should be made to walk around without bras. Like I said, what the school is doing is degrading these girls to a lower standard than prostitutes.Originally posted by furb:I feel sad for the all schoolgirls in Singapore because someone over here is looking at schoolgirls with the same mentality as looking at a prostitutes.
The school are to teach what is 'decency' to the female students in the school, you don't see schoolgirls behaving and wearing like prostitutes do you?
If you ask me, I think the way prostitutes wear is by far more distracting then the issue with bra being seen through the uniform.
If you are going to compare schoolgirls with prostitutes then I have nothing to say.
I'm inhumane? So, what about you?
I on the other hand oppose such an inhumane act. I say the school should not interefere with their private decisions of students and treat them like proper teenagers with a mind of their own. The sch should not deprive them of their dignity and assume them to be incapable of making decisions on their own. Therefore, since you condone the sch's decision to force these girls to go without their bra, you are inhumane and you lack any understanding on the dignity of the human race. Period. -
furb, are you a male or a female?
if youre a female, please take off ur bra and wear a thin white shirt and walk along orchard road.
if youre a male, please take off your underwear and wear a thin pants and walk along orchard road.
see if theres ppl staring at u, lowering your self-esteem. -
hmm, yeah.
maybe it's kinda extreme
i think the fuhua principal's hatching a plot.
saving electricity on airconditioning, and restricting pupils from wearing jackets
does anyone else draw the link?
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Can close thread already .... School wrong means school wrong it is damn obvious la
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Arggghhh! Look at the insanity! The flames, the CAPS and the awful grammer! I hope Death comes here to do a little spring cleaning.
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It's better than bra-less right? If she is wrong, make her wear the t-shirt underneath... does most of the schools make students go bra-less?Originally posted by furb:Do you know that most of the school doesn't allow wearing T-shirt under school uniform?
Normally they will ask you to take it out. -
Hey hey, look at the first post and then talk. The bra is remove and the girl is to wait for parents. The girl is not walking around without bra, neither is she walking home without bra. Get your facts right!Originally posted by Y_Shun:furb, are you a male or a female?
if youre a female, please take off ur bra and wear a thin white shirt and walk along orchard road.
if youre a male, please take off your underwear and wear a thin pants and walk along orchard road.
see if theres ppl staring at u, lowering your self-esteem.
Thin shirt? Seriously, School uniform is not thin at all. It is only after long time of washing will then the uniform be thin and if it happens, those with right mind will think it is time to change to a new set isn't it? -
Again you missed the point, the question is where do we draw the line on the action of the schools? It will set a negative precedence if schs were to start interfering in the private decisions of students. What the sch is doing is not only inhumane, but wrong in principle as well.Originally posted by furb:In the past people always say, the school is the second home to the stuents studying there since they spent most of their time in school. If so, you can say the school is also their parents isn't it?
Ok, back to the point, you said the main issue in this discussion is whether or not the school has a right to interfere in a students private decision and the answer is a clear no.
I'm not going to say is the answer going to be right or wrong because that is not my point. You said school is not allowed to interfere with students private decision, may I remind you that you said the word 'private'. Which part of bra being seen through the uniform to the public is private? Private means you to your own self, however now it clearly shows that people other then the student, herself, is involved.
Like I said brain have to be used here, school do not make whim rules like teeth have to be white and such. So quit using the impossible as examples.
When I say private decisions, it refers to decision you undertake without needing the authority to carry out. Do you ask the authorities for permission before you wear bra?
Like I mentioned before, even if there were "distraction" that involve other students, is the "distraction" so imperative that we see a reduction in the other students ability to score well in the O lvls?
Interefering in the students private decision is not the way to go and is counter productive. The school should be looking at other alternative means if they are really concerned about this small issue. -
But I do agree if I am a hot-blooded youth, colored bras can be quite a distraction...Originally posted by shade343:Again you missed the point, the question is where do we draw the line on the action of the schools? It will set a negative precedence if schs were to start interfering in the private decisions of students. What the sch is doing is not only inhumane, but wrong in principle as well.
When I say private decisions, it refers to decision you undertake without needing the authority to carry out. Do you ask the authorities for permission before you wear bra?
Like I mentioned before, even if there were "distraction" that involve other students, is the "distraction" so imperative that we see a reduction in the other students ability to score well in the O lvls?
Interefering in the students private decision is not the way to go and is counter productive. The school should be looking at other alternative means if they are really concerned about this small issue.
If they want to wear that, wear it during the weekends when out with friends.
It's in school where the foundation is being learn.
But punishments must have limit. -
Next time boys also kenna. During PE lesson, must check whether boys got wear coloured or branded underwear. If got wear colourful underwear or Calvin Klein one leh, must take off and excercise without underwear. Wah lao, PE shorts already so short if zao geng how ar? Self-esteem - 10.
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Originally posted by Chuichi Koshiramaru:Next time boys also kenna. During PE lesson, must check whether boys got wear coloured or branded underwear. If got wear colourful underwear or Calvin Klein one leh, must take off and excercise without underwear. Wah lao, PE shorts already so short if zao geng how ar? Self-esteem - 10. Aiyoh, no connection leh. I though guys can wear any underwear one?
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Who looks, if the school rules gets worse with new discipline masters like 'furb' and 'babylynn'.Originally posted by bigmouthjoe: Aiyoh, no connection leh. I though guys can wear any underwear one?
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This is new to me..Originally posted by Chuichi Koshiramaru:Next time boys also kenna. During PE lesson, must check whether boys got wear coloured or branded underwear. If got wear colourful underwear or Calvin Klein one leh, must take off and excercise without underwear. Wah lao, PE shorts already so short if zao geng how ar? Self-esteem - 10. -
First of all, you missed a point. I said it many times and here I shall repeat it again.Originally posted by shade343:Again you missed the point, the question is where do we draw the line on the action of the schools? It will set a negative precedence if schs were to start interfering in the private decisions of students. What the sch is doing is not only inhumane, but wrong in principle as well.
When I say private decisions, it refers to decision you undertake without needing the authority to carry out. Do you ask the authorities for permission before you wear bra?
Like I mentioned before, even if there were "distraction" that involve other students, is the "distraction" so imperative that we see a reduction in the other students ability to score well in the O lvls?
Interefering in the students private decision is not the way to go and is counter productive. The school should be looking at other alternative means if they are really concerned about this small issue.
Firstly, the information that TS gave did not mentioned that whether is there any other punishments that happened first before the punishment of taking off bra take place.
Secondly, I said that all my opinons is based on the school have given other form of punishments (and it did not work) before the punishment of taking off bra taken place.
And some of you said that it is inhumane or humiliating that the students have to walk around and also walk home without bra. However, taken from the information given the TS, instead of walking around and living without bra for the entire school day, students who have bra taken off will have to call their parents and wait for their parents to bring them a new bra.
You said private decision refers to decision you undertake without needing the authority to carry out and so the authority won't knows about it am I right? If so, will it affect to authority? No isn't it? So what if it affects the authority? If it affects, it ain't private at all and authority will take actions if it affect them negatively.
So far, undestand? -
aiyah. y muz dey wear sports bra then...
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Do you read? TS didn't mentioned but i mentioned.Originally posted by furb:First of all, you missed a point. I said it many times and here I shall repeat it again.
Firstly, the information that TS gave did not mentioned that whether is there any other punishments that happened first before the punishment of taking off bra take place.
Secondly, I said that all my opinons is based on the school have given other form of punishments (and it did not work) before the punishment of taking off bra taken place.
And some of you said that it is inhumane or humiliating that the students have to walk around and also walk home without bra. However, taken from the information given the TS, instead of walking around and living without bra for the entire school day, students who have bra taken off will have to call their parents and wait for their parents to bring them a new bra.
You said private decision refers to decision you undertake without needing the authority to carry out and so the authority won't knows about it am I right? If so, will it affect to authority? No isn't it? So what if it affects the authority? If it affects, it ain't private at all and authority will take actions if it affect them negatively.
So far, undestand?
THERE ARE NO PUNISHMENT THAT HAPPEN BEFOREHAND. :l
SECONDLY, the school only threatened to remove their bra, which apparently they didn't.
Oh, and the DM gave updates that the removal of bra was only a joke, and student wearing colored bras will still be sent out to buy white bras.