Countdown

• sofital

  29 May 08, 00:31

  Hi all;

  I'm wondering if someone know it in more details about this link

  http://www.maya12-21-2012.com/nibiru.html

• maggot

  29 May 08, 07:28

  Planet of the gods...from what I heard there is more than 1 planet heading towards us
• longchen

  29 May 08, 07:54

  From what i have read before Nibiru is a planet with a very long orbit. Also, there are legends that says that in the ancient past some of the 'gods' and 'demi-gods' came from Nibiru. These gods are related to the old European patheons of Greek gods. The 'gods' are bigger and taller than the humans on Earth. However, these 'gods' are not really gods but just more technological advanced and bigger sized humans. They use earth humans as slaves and to fight the war among each other. The 'gods' are powerful but violent and very prone to jeolousy. They also interbred with the earth humans giving rise to legends like Hercules.

  Regarding the year 2012, the Mayans calculated it as the end of this era. But that does not mean that it is the end of the world. 2012 should be seen as the end of a particular cycle and the embarkment of a new cycle after that.

  From my understanding only... the earth population will be reduced in the coming future. However, beyond a certain point the consciousness of humans also begin to evolve. This correspondes to a gradual 'upgrade' in their form. The form will gradually take on a glow. This is what a dream that i had suggested... if my interpretation is correct. There is a certain date too that suggest that about 1800-2000 years into the future, there may be another major leap in state.

  However, i wouldn't call all these changes enlightenment. It is that the civilization has less of the behavourial karmic tendencies that the form take on a glow. If you read some of the old Buddhist saying, there were beings in the past that has a glow, but due to increasing karma accumulation the glow gradually dissapear and become physical and solid in look. The mental state affects the form.

  This are just my understanding. Please read with discernment. Thanks.

   

• An Eternal Now

  29 May 08, 10:09

  Interesting... the 'gods' sounds like wat Buddhism would call 'Asuras'.

• Bodhi hut

  29 May 08, 10:36

   

  read a buddhism article....it say scienticfically planet earth has reach 46billion years...the lifespan of earth is 151 billions...

   

  Also seen some documentary long ago...it say there is a core under earth...this core is burning and it will one day explode...becoz of the great excess heat n pressure...

• Display Name

  29 May 08, 11:05

  I think the clash from nibiru planet won't occur so soon, it is not a sure to happen thing.
  The 2012 incidents is actually a huge flood that will make most of the south east asian countries submerged under water.
  For those people who want to continue 'enjoy' and attach in the worldly stuffs and plan to practice the dharma only at old age, it is time to wake up. It is only 4 more years to go...

  Maybe the government should consider buying an aircraft carrier or things like huge ship so when huge flood happen, at least there is a floating platform for them to do things.

• sofital

  29 May 08, 13:48

  How many percentage is it sure that 2012 incidents will happen?How is there  relationship to the recently huge earthquake and cyclone?

• longchen

  29 May 08, 14:35

  Originally posted by An Eternal Now:

  Interesting... the 'gods' sounds like wat Buddhism would call 'Asuras'.

  I think the Asuras maybe these kinds of Beings. The asuras are also mentioned in Hinduism Aryan(vedic) mythology in ancient India. The Aryans in India where originally from certain part of Europe, so some indian/vedic concepts and the Greek mythology may be related.

• Bodhi hut

  29 May 08, 16:01

  Originally posted by longchen:

  From what i have read before Nibiru is a planet with a very long orbit. Also, there are legends that says that in the ancient past some of the 'gods' and 'demi-gods' came from Nibiru. These gods are related to the old European patheons of Greek gods. The 'gods' are bigger and taller than the humans on Earth. However, these 'gods' are not really gods but just more technological advanced and bigger sized humans. They use earth humans as slaves and to fight the war among each other. The 'gods' are powerful but violent and very prone to jeolousy. They also interbred with the earth humans giving rise to legends like Hercules.

  Regarding the year 2012, the Mayans calculated it as the end of this era. But that does not mean that it is the end of the world. 2012 should be seen as the end of a particular cycle and the embarkment of a new cycle after that.

  From my understanding only... the earth population will be reduced in the coming future. However, beyond a certain point the consciousness of humans also begin to evolve. This correspondes to a gradual 'upgrade' in their form. The form will gradually take on a glow. This is what a dream that i had suggested... if my interpretation is correct. There is a certain date too that suggest that about 1800-2000 years into the future, there may be another major leap in state.

  However, i wouldn't call all these changes enlightenment. It is that the civilization has less of the behavourial karmic tendencies that the form take on a glow. If you read some of the old Buddhist saying, there were beings in the past that has a glow, but due to increasing karma accumulation the glow gradually dissapear and become physical and solid in look. The mental state affects the form.

  This are just my understanding. Please read with discernment. Thanks.

   

  
  I read an article as what you mention about being having a glown...I also read about being having a bigger size..actually the plane above us being are having a bigger in size...the article said..we use to be having a longer lifespan and from another plane..due to coming to this plane..we consumed some of the nutrients in this plane and due to the karmic forces..we start to strink and the lifespan will decrease....and it said that we use to have a lifespan of 80000yrs but as times goes by..we are now ard 100+/- it will come to a time where we cant even hit the age of 10...but it will go reversal...

   

  二�宇宙间众生�生的次第（先�）
  
  
  
  今日科学家尚�知宇宙间众生的情况，当然亦谈�上研究�生的程�问题，唯有进化论解释地�上�现的��生物的�生程�。佛教的论点与进化论亦相��，这点容有机会�说。佛教对宙间众生�生的次第有如此说：
  
  
  
  å�Žä¸¥ç»�：‘世界之åˆ�å…ˆæˆ�虚空，次æˆ�无色界，å†�æˆ�色界，å†�次æˆ�欲界。’佛教常讲‘空’，但此‘空’（如色ä¸�异空，色å�³æ˜¯ç©ºï¼‰å¹¶ä¸�是‘虚空’，佛教的‘空’是指‘如æ�¥è—�’或‘自性’，是一ç§�‘ç»�对的境界’，而‘虚空’是‘因色而有’的相对境界，佛教认为世界ã€�众生皆æº�于宇宙之本体（å�³è‡ªæ€§ï¼‰ï¼Œè™šç©ºäº¦ä¸�例外，由自性起‘无明’（å�³å¾®å°�的执著）然å�Žå°±å…ˆæœ‰‘虚空’（因分别而有），然å�Žå†�生出结构简å�•ï¼ˆä¹Ÿå°±æ˜¯æ‰§è‘—很å°�，业力很轻的）的无色界众生，这些众生没有颜色或物质，å�ªæœ‰‘æ„�念’（也就是由‘识’å½¢æˆ�的生命），我们人类若禅定修得很好，到达‘空定’，死å�Žå°±å�¯èƒ½ç”Ÿåˆ°è¿™ç§�天界。执著ç¨�深一点就有色界众生出现，这些众生å�ªæœ‰è‰²ç›¸ï¼Œä½†æ²¡æœ‰æ·«ã€�食二欲，在人间修禅定到四禅天以下，死å�Žä¼šç”Ÿåˆ°è‰²ç•Œè¯¸å¤©ã€‚梵天就是色界的åˆ�禅天。执著ã€�业力å†�大的众生就出生在欲界，欲界天的众生有食欲ã€�淫欲与ç�¡çœ ï¼Œæ­¤ç•Œæœ‰ç²¾ç¥žå¢ƒç•Œçš„欲界六天（å�³å››å¤©çŽ‹å¤©ï¼Œä»žåˆ©å¤©ï¼Œå¤œæ‘©å¤©ï¼Œå…œçŽ‡å¤©ï¼Œä¹�å�˜åŒ–天与他自在天），有物质界与神识å�ˆä¸€çš„‘人’与‘畜生’，亦有很苦的‘æ�¶é¬¼’与‘地狱’é�“众生。这一些ä¸�å�Œå¢ƒç•Œçš„众生是因为‘心的状æ€�ä¸�å�Œ’而产生的。以上是就大乘佛教的‘心’的观点æ�¥è¯´ä¼—生的起生次第，而å°�乘的阿å�«ç»�就以较‘实际’的观点æ�¥è¯´ï¼Œå¦‚起世ç»�：‘世间转已，如是æˆ�时，诸众生等，多得生于光音天上，是诸众生生彼天时，喜悦为食，自然光明，å�ˆæœ‰ç¥žé€šï¼Œé£žè¡Œè‡ªåœ¨ï¼Œå¯¿å‘½ä¹…è¿œ……，尔时世间转å��å·²æˆ�，空无有物，诸梵宫中，未有众生，光音天上，ç¦�业尽者，乃从下生梵宫殿中，ä¸�从胎生，自然化生’，这段说明ç¦�业尽的诸众生会由较高的天界下生到较低的天界。当然也暗示著会下生到更低的欲界，如人ã€�畜等。
  
  
  
  三�地�与人类的起�
  
  
  
  对于人类如何生起，大楼炭ç»�天地æˆ�å“�：‘佛告比丘，天地破å��，更始æˆ�å�Žï¼Œäººçš†åœ¨ç¬¬å��五阿å�«è´§ç½—天上，其天上人，以好喜作食，å�„有光明神足，其寿甚久远……，彼天人ç¦�德薄禄，命欲尽者，从阿å�«è´§æ¥¼å¤©ä¸Šï¼Œæ�¥ä¸‹æ¸¸æ­¤é—´åœ°ï¼Œ……å�–地味而食之，人食地味之å�Žï¼Œèº«å�³ç²—å�š……亡失光明神足ä¸�能å¤�飞天上……’这段è¯�说明人类最早是由飞行自在身体光明的天界众生，因ç¦�报尽ã€�业报é‡�，贪食地味，因此身体å�˜ç²—é‡�，无法é‡�回天上，就生在地ç�ƒï¼Œä½†ä½›å¹¶æ²¡æœ‰è¯´æ˜Žè¿™äº›å¤©äººåˆ°åœ°ç�ƒå�Žå�˜æˆ�什么模样。当时天人们å�ªæ˜¯å�˜æˆ�å�ˆäºŽåœ°ç�ƒç”Ÿå­˜æ�¡ä»¶çš„生物，å�Žå› åœ°ç�ƒç”Ÿå­˜æ�¡ä»¶ä¸�断改å�˜ï¼Œå¤©äººä»¬å°±åˆ¶å�šå¤�æ�‚çš„‘基因’（在生物的细胞内）æ�¥è®°å½•å…¶ç”Ÿå­˜çŽ¯å¢ƒä¸Žç”Ÿç‰©ä½“结构的关系，藉此记录的资料，‘神识’就制造出最适å�ˆå…¶ç”Ÿå­˜çŽ¯å¢ƒçš„生物体，ç»�过漫长时间的改å�˜è€Œæ‰�有今日的人类。这ç§�说è¯�与进化论的观点是相å�Œçš„（注：地ç�ƒçš„年龄由科学方法估计约四å��六亿年，三å��五亿å�ˆå‰�出现å�•ç»†èƒžç”Ÿç‰©ï¼Œå��亿年å‰�开始出现有性生殖，七点五亿年å‰�有多细胞æ¤�物出现，较å¤�æ�‚的动物如虾等出现时间约在三亿年以å‰�。约5000万年å‰�开始有ç�µé•¿ç›®åŠ¨ç‰©ï¼Œåˆ°2000万年å‰�出现猿类，而直立的猿人约出现在500万年å‰�，周å�£åº—的猿人出现在150万年å‰�．而10万年å‰�开始有农耕生活，约五万年å‰�æ‰�有今日的文明）
  
  
  
  对于地ç�ƒå½“åˆ�的情况，起世ç»�亦æ��述：‘å¤�次比丘……当于如是三摩耶时，此大地上出生地肥，周é��å‡�ä½�，……如有人熟煎乳æ±�，其上便有薄膜å�œä½�，亦如水膜å�œä½�水上……’，佛所说的‘地肥’有点类似ç�«å±±çš„岩浆，慢慢å‡�固å�Žå½¢æˆ�陆地就åƒ�水膜å�œåœ¨æ°´ä¸Šã€‚ä½›å�ˆè¯´ï¼š‘诸比丘å¤�于此时，此大地上所生地肥，å‡�然å�œä½�，æ¸�如乳酪，æˆ�就生酥，有如等是形色相貌，其味甘美，犹如上蜜，尔时众生……å�–此地味，食之ä¸�已，其身æ¸�æ¸�涩æ�¶ï¼Œçš®è‚¤é¢œè‰²æµŠæš—，形貌改异，无å¤�光明，亦ä¸�能飞行虚空，以地肥故，神通没ç�­……’。这段è¯�å�™è¯´ä¸šæŠ¥è¾ƒé‡�的天人看地ç�ƒåˆ�期的感觉（注：其感觉和我们ä¸�å�Œï¼‰ï¼Œè®¤ä¸ºåœ°ç�ƒæ˜¯ç”˜ç¾Žçš„食物，贪食著相就æˆ�为生物了。

   

  the rest of the points are in here, quite enrichment..its abit lengthy to post here..interested can proceed:

  http://bodhihut.17.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=1187

• maggot

  29 May 08, 21:34

  To confirm I think we need to wait or anyone have a powerful telescope that can see the red glow of the planet? From google I saw it looked like a red sun surrounded by moons And if I don't remember wrongly, Nostradamus say something about the sun rise from the west and sets in the east. Could it be this red sun planet?
• longchen

  30 May 08, 07:45

  Originally posted by Bodhi hut:

  
  I read an article as what you mention about being having a glown...I also read about being having a bigger size..actually the plane above us being are having a bigger in size...the article said..we use to be having a longer lifespan and from another plane..due to coming to this plane..we consumed some of the nutrients in this plane and due to the karmic forces..we start to strink and the lifespan will decrease....and it said that we use to have a lifespan of 80000yrs but as times goes by..we are now ard 100+/- it will come to a time where we cant even hit the age of 10...but it will go reversal...

   

  二�宇宙间众生�生的次第（先�）
  
  
  
  今日科学家尚�知宇宙间众生的情况，当然亦谈�上研究�生的程�问题，唯有进化论解释地�上�现的��生物的�生程�。佛教的论点与进化论亦相��，这点容有机会�说。佛教对宙间众生�生的次第有如此说：
  
  
  
  å�Žä¸¥ç»�：‘世界之åˆ�å…ˆæˆ�虚空，次æˆ�无色界，å†�æˆ�色界，å†�次æˆ�欲界。’佛教常讲‘空’，但此‘空’（如色ä¸�异空，色å�³æ˜¯ç©ºï¼‰å¹¶ä¸�是‘虚空’，佛教的‘空’是指‘如æ�¥è—�’或‘自性’，是一ç§�‘ç»�对的境界’，而‘虚空’是‘因色而有’的相对境界，佛教认为世界ã€�众生皆æº�于宇宙之本体（å�³è‡ªæ€§ï¼‰ï¼Œè™šç©ºäº¦ä¸�例外，由自性起‘无明’（å�³å¾®å°�的执著）然å�Žå°±å…ˆæœ‰‘虚空’（因分别而有），然å�Žå†�生出结构简å�•ï¼ˆä¹Ÿå°±æ˜¯æ‰§è‘—很å°�，业力很轻的）的无色界众生，这些众生没有颜色或物质，å�ªæœ‰‘æ„�念’（也就是由‘识’å½¢æˆ�的生命），我们人类若禅定修得很好，到达‘空定’，死å�Žå°±å�¯èƒ½ç”Ÿåˆ°è¿™ç§�天界。执著ç¨�深一点就有色界众生出现，这些众生å�ªæœ‰è‰²ç›¸ï¼Œä½†æ²¡æœ‰æ·«ã€�食二欲，在人间修禅定到四禅天以下，死å�Žä¼šç”Ÿåˆ°è‰²ç•Œè¯¸å¤©ã€‚梵天就是色界的åˆ�禅天。执著ã€�业力å†�大的众生就出生在欲界，欲界天的众生有食欲ã€�淫欲与ç�¡çœ ï¼Œæ­¤ç•Œæœ‰ç²¾ç¥žå¢ƒç•Œçš„欲界六天（å�³å››å¤©çŽ‹å¤©ï¼Œä»žåˆ©å¤©ï¼Œå¤œæ‘©å¤©ï¼Œå…œçŽ‡å¤©ï¼Œä¹�å�˜åŒ–天与他自在天），有物质界与神识å�ˆä¸€çš„‘人’与‘畜生’，亦有很苦的‘æ�¶é¬¼’与‘地狱’é�“众生。这一些ä¸�å�Œå¢ƒç•Œçš„众生是因为‘心的状æ€�ä¸�å�Œ’而产生的。以上是就大乘佛教的‘心’的观点æ�¥è¯´ä¼—生的起生次第，而å°�乘的阿å�«ç»�就以较‘实际’的观点æ�¥è¯´ï¼Œå¦‚起世ç»�：‘世间转已，如是æˆ�时，诸众生等，多得生于光音天上，是诸众生生彼天时，喜悦为食，自然光明，å�ˆæœ‰ç¥žé€šï¼Œé£žè¡Œè‡ªåœ¨ï¼Œå¯¿å‘½ä¹…è¿œ……，尔时世间转å��å·²æˆ�，空无有物，诸梵宫中，未有众生，光音天上，ç¦�业尽者，乃从下生梵宫殿中，ä¸�从胎生，自然化生’，这段说明ç¦�业尽的诸众生会由较高的天界下生到较低的天界。当然也暗示著会下生到更低的欲界，如人ã€�畜等。
  
  
  
  三�地�与人类的起�
  
  
  
  对于人类如何生起，大楼炭ç»�天地æˆ�å“�：‘佛告比丘，天地破å��，更始æˆ�å�Žï¼Œäººçš†åœ¨ç¬¬å��五阿å�«è´§ç½—天上，其天上人，以好喜作食，å�„有光明神足，其寿甚久远……，彼天人ç¦�德薄禄，命欲尽者，从阿å�«è´§æ¥¼å¤©ä¸Šï¼Œæ�¥ä¸‹æ¸¸æ­¤é—´åœ°ï¼Œ……å�–地味而食之，人食地味之å�Žï¼Œèº«å�³ç²—å�š……亡失光明神足ä¸�能å¤�飞天上……’这段è¯�说明人类最早是由飞行自在身体光明的天界众生，因ç¦�报尽ã€�业报é‡�，贪食地味，因此身体å�˜ç²—é‡�，无法é‡�回天上，就生在地ç�ƒï¼Œä½†ä½›å¹¶æ²¡æœ‰è¯´æ˜Žè¿™äº›å¤©äººåˆ°åœ°ç�ƒå�Žå�˜æˆ�什么模样。当时天人们å�ªæ˜¯å�˜æˆ�å�ˆäºŽåœ°ç�ƒç”Ÿå­˜æ�¡ä»¶çš„生物，å�Žå› åœ°ç�ƒç”Ÿå­˜æ�¡ä»¶ä¸�断改å�˜ï¼Œå¤©äººä»¬å°±åˆ¶å�šå¤�æ�‚çš„‘基因’（在生物的细胞内）æ�¥è®°å½•å…¶ç”Ÿå­˜çŽ¯å¢ƒä¸Žç”Ÿç‰©ä½“结构的关系，藉此记录的资料，‘神识’就制造出最适å�ˆå…¶ç”Ÿå­˜çŽ¯å¢ƒçš„生物体，ç»�过漫长时间的改å�˜è€Œæ‰�有今日的人类。这ç§�说è¯�与进化论的观点是相å�Œçš„（注：地ç�ƒçš„年龄由科学方法估计约四å��六亿年，三å��五亿å�ˆå‰�出现å�•ç»†èƒžç”Ÿç‰©ï¼Œå��亿年å‰�开始出现有性生殖，七点五亿年å‰�有多细胞æ¤�物出现，较å¤�æ�‚的动物如虾等出现时间约在三亿年以å‰�。约5000万年å‰�开始有ç�µé•¿ç›®åŠ¨ç‰©ï¼Œåˆ°2000万年å‰�出现猿类，而直立的猿人约出现在500万年å‰�，周å�£åº—的猿人出现在150万年å‰�．而10万年å‰�开始有农耕生活，约五万年å‰�æ‰�有今日的文明）
  
  
  
  对于地ç�ƒå½“åˆ�的情况，起世ç»�亦æ��述：‘å¤�次比丘……当于如是三摩耶时，此大地上出生地肥，周é��å‡�ä½�，……如有人熟煎乳æ±�，其上便有薄膜å�œä½�，亦如水膜å�œä½�水上……’，佛所说的‘地肥’有点类似ç�«å±±çš„岩浆，慢慢å‡�固å�Žå½¢æˆ�陆地就åƒ�水膜å�œåœ¨æ°´ä¸Šã€‚ä½›å�ˆè¯´ï¼š‘诸比丘å¤�于此时，此大地上所生地肥，å‡�然å�œä½�，æ¸�如乳酪，æˆ�就生酥，有如等是形色相貌，其味甘美，犹如上蜜，尔时众生……å�–此地味，食之ä¸�已，其身æ¸�æ¸�涩æ�¶ï¼Œçš®è‚¤é¢œè‰²æµŠæš—，形貌改异，无å¤�光明，亦ä¸�能飞行虚空，以地肥故，神通没ç�­……’。这段è¯�å�™è¯´ä¸šæŠ¥è¾ƒé‡�的天人看地ç�ƒåˆ�期的感觉（注：其感觉和我们ä¸�å�Œï¼‰ï¼Œè®¤ä¸ºåœ°ç�ƒæ˜¯ç”˜ç¾Žçš„食物，贪食著相就æˆ�为生物了。

   

  the rest of the points are in here, quite enrichment..its abit lengthy to post here..interested can proceed:

  http://bodhihut.17.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=1187

  Hi Bodhi Hut,

  Thanks for the article..

  I had a Western teacher who is not of Buddhist background but of Western mystical tradition. She too, with her psychic senses, saw the ancient formation of these light-beings 'evolving' into the current physical type human. In the beginning, these light-beings are actually asexual but gradually split into the 2 sexes.

  With so many sources pointing to the same origin. I guess it must be true.

• sofital

  30 May 08, 13:53

  Hi all

  Thanks for your sharing informaton.Well done

• Bodhi hut

  30 May 08, 14:36

  Originally posted by longchen:

  Hi Bodhi Hut,

  Thanks for the article..

  I had a Western teacher who is not of Buddhist background but of Western mystical tradition. She too, with her psychic senses, saw the ancient formation of these light-beings 'evolving' into the current physical type human. In the beginning, these light-beings are actually asexual but gradually split into the 2 sexes.

  With so many sources pointing to the same origin. I guess it must be true.

  
  Well..i think the explaination in that article is more convincing...but like other saying is that there is a creator who create humans...As for the glowing being you mentioned..they should be in the heaven or plane lower than buddha and bodhisavatta....in Mi Zong..they talk about Hua Zhan Shi Jie or Yi Zhen Fa Jie...the light being are not in this plane.. 

  Got some information which is posted by my forum member today..share it here...

  http://www.xanga.com/LevDau/657019082/item.html
  
  http://www.picassoclub.cn/forum/archiver/?tid-132275.html

   

• An Eternal Now

  30 May 08, 15:08

  Originally posted by Bodhi hut:

  
  Well..i think the explaination in that article is more convincing...but like other saying is that there is a creator who create humans...As for the glowing being you mentioned..they should be in the heaven or plane lower than buddha and bodhisavatta....in Mi Zong..they talk about Hua Zhan Shi Jie or Yi Zhen Fa Jie...the light being are not in this plane.. 

  Got some information which is posted by my forum member today..share it here...

  http://www.xanga.com/LevDau/657019082/item.html
  
  http://www.picassoclub.cn/forum/archiver/?tid-132275.html

   

  Actually the 'light beings' are still within the realms of Samsara, particularly the 2nd Jhana of the Form planes of existence. As you said they are planes 'lower' than the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas because they still belong to samsaric/non-enlightened realms. They are called light-sound beings, and use light to communicate. They don't use 'verbal' language. 'Yi Zhen Fa Jie' and 'Hua Zhang Shi Jie' are talking about quite different matters, they are talking about the nature of reality which I will explain later.

  One of the points of the teaching of the origin of Mankind is that Buddhism does not accept the teachings of a creator, for human beings have not 'descended' from the creation of a personal God but are the natural evolutions of the devas from the 2nd Jhana Light-Sound (Abhassara) realm of heaven.

  They are also not really 'Hua Zhang Shi Jie' or 'Yi Zhen Fa Jie'... Yi Zhen Fa Jie, which is the One-Thus-Dharma-Realm is talking about non-duality, it is talking about the true nature of all planes of existence altogether. That means of the 10 realms of existence (the 6 samsaric + 4 saintly realms of existence), whether they are the realms of ordinary sentient beings or enlightened beings, there is only One Taste, One Reality, One Mind... which is luminous[aware]-emptiness inseparable. Wherever you are and whatever you experience are only of this One Reality, One Dharmadhatu. Hence 'Yi Zhen Fa Jie' is not a particular place, but is the nature of all phase of existence. It is your true non-dual nature, which is the essence of everything.

  The experience of non-duality is described by Ken Wilber as such, "And so how do you know that you have finally and really overcome the Cartesian dualism? Very simple: if you really overcome the Cartesian dualism, then you no longer feel that you are on this side of your face looking at the world out there. There is only the world, and you are all of that; you actually feel that you are one with everything that is arising moment to moment. You are not merely on this side of your face looking out there. “In here” and “out there” have become One Taste with a shuddering obviousness and certainty so profound it feels like a five-ton rock just dropped on your head. It is, shall we say, a feeling hard to miss.
  

  At that point, which is actually your ever-present condition, there is no exclusive identity with this particular organism, no constriction of consciousness to the head, a constriction that makes it seem that “you” are in the head looking at the rest of the world out there; there is no binding of attention to the personal bodymind: instead, consciousness is one with all that is arising – a vast, open, transparent, radiant, infinitely Free and infinitely Full expanse that embraces the entire Kosmos, so that every single subject and every single object are erotically united in the Great Embrace of One Taste. You disappear from merely being behind your eyes, and you become the All, you directly and actually feel that your basic identity is everything that is arising moment to moment (just as previously you felt that your identity was with this finite, partial, separate, mortal coil of flesh you call a body). Inside and outside have become One Taste. I tell you, it can happen just like that!"

  .

  .

  
  But this nondual “state” is not itself another experience. It is simply the opening or clearing in which all experiences arise and fall. It is the bright autumn sky through which the clouds come and go- it is not itself another cloud, another experience, another object, another manifestation. This realization is actually of the utter fruitlessness of experiences, the utter futility of trying to experience release or liberation. All experiences lose their taste entirely- these passing clouds.

  
  You are not the one who experiences liberation; you are the clearing, the opening, the emptiness, in which any experience comes and goes, like reflections on the mirror. And you are the mirror, the mirror mind, and not any experienced reflection. But you are not apart from the reflections, standing back and watching. You are everything that is arising moment to moment. You can swallow the whole cosmos in one gulp, it is so small, and you can taste the sky without moving an inch.

  That is why in Zen, it is said that you cannot enter the Great Samadhi: it is actually the opening or clearing that is ever present, and in which all experience- and all manifestation- arises moment to moment. It seems like you “enter” this state, except that once there, you realize that there never was a time this state was not fully present and fully recognized- “ the gateless gate.” And so you deeply understand that you never entered this state; nor did the Buddhas, past or future, ever enter this state.

  
  In Dzogchen, this is the recognition of mind’s true nature. All things, in all worlds, are self-liberated as they arise. All things are like sunlight on the water of a pond. It all shimmers. It is all empty. It is all light. It is all full, and it is all fulfilled. And the world goes on it ordinary way, and nobody notices at all.

  -- http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2007/05/some-writings-on-non-duality-by-ken.html
  

  Hua Zhang Shi Jie is something similar, it is talking about seeing All in One/One in All. It is based on the principles of the Net of Indra. I just sent Thusness and Longchen a link recently, quite interesting... on this topic. http://deoxy.org/watch?v=ldzqbziuT_0&q=indras%20net

  BTW, Hua Zhang Shi Jie and Yi Zhen Fa Jie are not Mi Zong/Vajrayana concepts... they belong to the Mahayana schools, particularly the Hua Yen school (for the Hua Zhang Shi Jie) and the Tien Tai school for the latter. But really all traditions are talking about the same thing... whereas Tien Tai calls it 'Yi Zhen Fa Jie', other traditions such as Vajrayana talk about the same thing with terms like 'One Taste'.

  Now, regarding more of the Light-Sound Heaven beings... there's an article which I posted before, which I will post in the subsequent post.

• An Eternal Now

  30 May 08, 15:12

  http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol7no1a.htm

  Note that 'Abhidhamma Patika' is a wrong translation on the part of the editors, the source is the Ekottara Agama Sutra [Zheng Yi Ah Han Jing] or the equivalent of the [Pali] Digha Nikaya.
  

  Volume 7 no 1

  Feature

  THE EARTH PEOPLE - Part 1

  People often ask, "Why are there human beings on earth?", "Where did the ancestors of the human race come from?" or "How did the world come about?" Questions such as these have plagued mankind since time immemorial. The answers lie in the Buddhist scriptures and over the next four issues, Venerable Shen-Kai shall deliberate on them.

  The ancestors of the human race came from the Light-sound heaven (Abhasvara) In the Abhidhamma Patika and other Buddhist scriptures, it was precisely stated that the human race originated from the Light-sound heaven. Being the most intellectual of all living things on this earth, the ancestors of the human race could not possibly have been made from clay by some divine gods; this is a myth. They could not have been evolved from apes; this is a fallacy. People often ask: Where is the Light-sound heaven? Why is it called the Light-sound heaven? How did the human race come from the Light-sound heaven? According to Buddhism, the various celestial levels of existence, in ascending order, are divided into three worlds, namely: (i) Field of Desires (ii) Field of Forms (iii) Field of Formless (i) Field of Desires: Within the Field of Desires, there are: Heaven of Four Heavenly Kings (Catummaharajika) Thirty-three Heavens (Tavatimsa) - (there are 33 devas in this heaven comprising 8 devas in each direction of East, West, North and South together with the centre being that of Sakka. Sakyamuni Buddha was once the deva-king of this heaven.) Heaven of Devas Yama Tusita Heaven Nirmanarati Heaven Paranirmitavasavartin Heave (ii) Field of Forms: Above the Field of Desires is the Field of Forms where beings delight in Jhanic bliss achieved by renouncing sense-desires. This field consists of 4 Dhyana Heavens - the Heaven of 1st Dhyana, the Heaven of 2nd Dhyana, the Heaven of 3rd Dhyana and the Heaven of 4th Dhyana. In the Heaven of the 1st Dhyana or Jhana, there are: - The Heaven of Brahma's Retinue - The Heaven of Brahma's Ministers - The Heaven of Maha Brahma (Sakyamuni Buddha was once the heavenly king of this heaven) In the Heaven of the 2nd Dhyana, there are: - The Heaven of Minor Lustre - The Heaven of Infinite Lustre - The Heaven of Light-sound or Radiant Lustre In the Heaven of the 3rd Dhyana, there are: - The Heaven of Minor Purity - The Heaven of Infinite Purity - The Heaven of Extensive Purity In the Heaven of the 4th Dhyana, there are: - The Heaven of blessing-arising - The Heaven of blessing-attached - The Heaven of vast-reward - The Heaven of no thought - The Heaven of no vexation - The Heaven of no heat - The Heaven of virtue-view - The Heaven of virtue-appear - The Heaven of form ultimate (iii) Field of Formless: There are 4 other heavens within this Field of Formless. The heavens are totally devoid of matter or bodies. These are: The Sphere of infinite space The Sphere of boundless consciousness The Sphere of nothingness and The Sphere of no thought, no no-thought From the above three Fields, there are altogether 28 levels of heavens. The Light-sound heaven or Radiant Lustre is at the 3rd level of the Heaven of the 2nd Dhyana or Jhana of the Field of Forms. The beings of this heaven communicate not through sounds, but they emit pure radiant lights from their mouths that represent what they wish to express and the receiving party on seeing the lights is able to understand what they mean. As lights represent sounds, hence this heaven is called the Light-sound heaven. It is the most unique and wonderful level of the three heavens of the 2nd Dhyana and is also called the "Heaven of Radiant Lustre." … to be continued in the next issue, Volume 7, Issue No. 2

  © Copyright 2002.Jen Chen Buddhism Centre Designed by DCS Solutions Ltd

  http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol7no2a.htm

   

  Volume 7 no 2

  Feature

  THE EARTH PEOPLE - Part 2 The Arrival

  People often ask, "Why are there human beings on earth?", "Where did the ancestors of the human race come from?" or "How did the world come about?" Questions such as these have plagued mankind since time immemorial. In the Abhidhamma Patika and other Buddhist scriptures, it was precisely stated that the human race originated from the Light-sound heaven. In this Part 2 of The Earth People, Venerable Shen-Kai talks about the first phase of the earth's formation and the arrival of the "earth people".

  The evolving world goes through four stages, namely: 1. Formation 2. Existence 3. Destruction 4. Void or Emptiness Each stage has a time span termed a "medium kalpa" [1]. Twenty "small kalpas" make one "medium kalpa". The four stages, each termed a "medium kalpa", make up a "great kalpa". When the world reaches the final phase of the Stage of Destruction, there will be great fires burning down hell, planet earth, other stars and their cosmic worlds as well as the various heavens within the Field of Desires. Prior reaching the heaven of the 1st Jhana of the Field of Forms, the Devas, Bodhisattvas, Sages and those sentient beings who have performed great virtuous deeds in the lower worlds will naturally be saved. They have already been ascended to the Heaven of Radiant Lustre where they will enjoy happiness and heavenly bliss. Following the passing of twenty small kalpas in the Stage of Void or Emptiness, the world will return to the beginning of a new Stage of Formation. A big golden heavenly cloud will appear from the Heaven of Radiant Lustre and heavy rain will fall to drench the burning worlds. After the floodwater has receded, the various heavens below the heaven of the 1st Jhana (or Dhyana) will reappear. The massive forces of swirling on the remaining materials left over by the receding floodwater will gradually solidify. This process is accompanied by the reappearance of various planets in the sky - many are spherical in shape and others, elliptical. This will, of course, include our earth and the orbiting moon, as well as all the worlds below including the lowest level of hell. As the extreme heat energies rotate and concentrate, many suns are formed - this is what the astronomers called the stars, planets and satellites. Within each galaxy system, the stars have their orbits rotating around the sun, planets have their own orbits around the stars, and satellites around the planets. The revolving stars, planets and satellites coupled with their own rotations maintain motions, thus creating day and night. Further, the process produces day, month, year and the four seasons. However, it is to be noted that the time scales are different between earth, the various worlds of existence in heavens and other stellar systems. For this period, a passage in the Chinese Old Text story "Qiong-Lin" recorded similar description on the formation of the world. The text reads: "When earth was first separated from heaven; pure light air float to form the sky and the polluted air sink to form the ground; the sun, moon and five stars are called the seven-Polis; the heaven, earth and humans are called the three-lords; and the sun is the master of the "Yang" [2] with the moon as the image of the "Yin" [3] The above description is very close to what the Buddha said. Further, records from Buddhist scriptures match very well with what astronomers of today have found. It is in this manner that the world is returned to the great natural phenomenon of the universe. During the first phase of the formation of earth, the earth's crust covering the ground was not fully solidified. The ground surface appeared milky in colour. Looking from the celestial plane, the earth shone brightly and afar. In the heaven of Radiant Lustre, many of those celestial beings whose blissful life in the heaven was coming to an end and who by disposition were more restless and impetuous, on seeing the brightness, and out of curiosity, began to travel down to the earth. They used their "clairvoyance feats" to fly down and reached different continents of the earth. They saw fluid springing out from the ground and they dipped their fingers in it. They tasted the fluid and found it extremely tasty, sweet like honey. While the fluid was so tasty, everyone craved for more. Those who had most, their bodies became rough and heavier. They began to lose their light illusory physical forms and their bodies slowly formed into the material body of bone and flesh. The weight forced them to the ground and they lost their "clairvoyance feats" and "natural heavenly clothes", and were unable to fly through the skies to return to the celestial world. They began to lose many of their intrinsic celestial qualities such as celestial colours, fragrant scent, brightness, beauty, wisdom and their innate miraculous quality. In particular, their "clairvoyance eyes" turned into human eyes; and their "clairvoyance ears" became human ears. They became unable to remember their past lives. They lost their special ability to read the minds of others. They were unable to communicate by radiant light from their mouths and they needed to depend on sounds from the movements of their tongues. While without sufficient languages and vocabulary, they needed sign language to assist them to fully communicate with each other. They became ordinary human beings on earth. After running out of the tasty fluid, they resorted to feed on thick weedy plants, then hard crops from the wild. At that time, the life span of human being was long and there was no disease or sickness. Later, they learned to plant crops and vegetables. During the period of feeding from nature, those who were greedy in feeding themselves acquired darker skin colours, ranging from brown to black. Others who did not feed as much and those who arrived later had lighter skin colour, ranging from fair to yellow. As time went on, together with the influence by climatic conditions of different regions (equatorial, temperate and cold regions), various skin coloured races of people were formed. … to be continued in the next issue, Volume 7, Issue No. 3 Note: [1] Kalpa: 1 small kalpa = 16.8 million years 20 small kalpas = 1 medium kalpa = 336 million years 80 small kalpas = 4 medium kalpas = 1 great kalpa = 1.344 billion years [2] Yang: Chinese philosophy; the masculine or positive principle in nature [3] Yin: Chinese philosophy; the feminine or negative principle in nature

  © Copyright 2002.Jen Chen Buddhism Centre Designed by DCS Solutions Ltd

  http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol7no3a.htm

   

  Volume 7 no 3

  Feature

  THE EARTH PEOPLE - Part 3 From Celestial Beings to Human Beings

  The Abhidhamma Patika and other Buddhist scriptures have stated that the human race originated from the Light-sound heaven. How do they become the human race of today? What will happen to this earth eventually? Venerable Shen-Kai answers these questions and more, in this concluding serial of The Earth People. In addition we learn that the earth, as with all phenomena in the universe, is subject to the four stages of formation, existence, destruction and emptiness. There is no beginning and no end, and the best way for us to live is to emulate the spirit and virtuous deeds of the Bodhisattvas.

  In the early days, small groups of people lived in scattered places; each group used its own language for communication. The physical separation between the groups and the lack of efficient means of transportation resulted in the creation of hundreds and thousands of different languages. These people were the ancestors of the many different races in the world today. The early inhabitants, after losing their “celestial clothing”, moved around naked. While they played, their emotions on love and relationship arose resulting in sexual desires. They began to feel shy and shameful. At that time, grass and other plants were grown on earth and they used leaves as clothes, partly to cover their naked bodies and partly to protect themselves from the cold. From the perspective of the other worlds, the earth’s light had turned green, separating the seas and the land. The devas from other celestial worlds dared not come anymore. The human beings on earth began to live as husbands and wives. They raised children. They lived in caves and later, they learned to build dwelling houses. With improved conditions, the population grew. The six-sensory organs of the human being (eyes, ears, nose, tongue, body and mind) began to differentiate and this resulted in affliction and vexation. The innate bright and innocent celestial nature disappeared, and in their places arose greed, anger, ignorance….thereby formed the basis of Asura sentient beings. The Devas, Human and Asura are beings of the three good realms. With the arising of the evil deeds of killing, stealing, sexual misconduct… resulting in the sentient beings in the three evil realms of animal, ghost and hell. Together, these formed the transmigration process in the six realms of existence. With this, all sentient beings have four modes of birth, namely, i. Womb-born beings (jalabuja); ii. Egg-born beings (andaja); iii. Moisture-born beings (samsedaja); iv. Gaseous form-born beings (opapatika). and thousands and millions of different life forms. These constitute the corresponding living spheres of the seas, land, sky and motion. The thinking of humanity and their lives changed from simple to complex states. Some portions of the human race turned from the barbaric stage to a civilised world. Some portions of primitive man that fed on raw flesh and blood of birds and beasts gradually changed to civilisation. The introduction of farming and trading is the beginning of agriculture and commerce sectors. Some lived on making of farming tools, cooking utensils and production of building materials, this was the beginning of industry. In order to administer peace and justice arising from arguments and fights caused by greed, anger, ignorance, killing, stealing and sexual misconduct, virtuous and upright people were elected to maintain law and order, and to manage the affairs of people in the society. From these came education, social ethic and democratic government. The advent of languages created written texts which led to the flourishing of modern civilisation. The barbaric era ended. Communities moved from small tribal groups into big societies, from societies to countries, and from the competitive nature between countries, and they further evolved through scientific progress into the atomic age and the cosmic age. When the human inhabitants first arrived on earth, the average life span at that time was longer than 84,000 years. As the people distanced themselves from good deeds and committed various evil deeds, the life span shortened. For every 100 years, the average life span is reduced by 1 year. The human life span continued to shorten and when the life span dropped down to an average of 10 years, disasters and calamities struck. For those who were cultivating good deeds and had been staying away as hermits, they survived. For those who had survived the disasters and calamities, they realised their past mistakes and repented. Each began to cultivate good deeds and promoted to the society to carry out good deeds. With the effect of the communal good karma, the human life span began to lengthen again. And when the age has reached 84,000 years, the same decreasing process would repeat due to the arising of evil or unwholesome deeds. One cycle of such an increasing-decreasing life span is called a “small Kalpa”[1]. Twenty small kalpas make up a “medium kalpa”. With this, the Stage of Formation is completed. Next come the Stage of Existence. In this stage, the increasing-decreasing life span of human beings also underwent twenty small kalpas before it reaches the Stage of Destruction. At the beginning of the Stage of Destruction, everything had developed to the extremes. All the natural resources had been completely exhausted and the earth severely damaged. The destruction process also went through a period of twenty small kalpas. In the final days, the seas dried up. Strong winds, big fires and heavy floods prevail. The Three Disasters (The three major disasters for world destruction – fire, water and wind) and Eight Difficulties (The eight conditions in which it is difficult to encounter a Buddha or hear his Dharma: in the hells; as hungry ghosts; as animals; in Uttarakuru (the northern continent where all is pleasant); in the long-life heaven (where life is long and easy); as deaf, blind and dumb; as worldly philosopher; in the intermediate period between a Buddha and his successor.) all come upon the earth. This is truly the “End of the World”. When the earth is damaged, it enters into the Stage of Emptiness. This emptiness stage also lasts for a long period of twenty small kalpas. At the end of this period, big golden yellow clouds would appear and heavy rain would pour down from the Light-sound heaven to put out the fires. A new world is thereby created. According to the above described process, the world has to go through the four stages of Formation, Existence, Destruction and Emptiness which are the four “medium kalpas”. One “Great Kalpa” needs to go through four “medium kalpas” totaling eighty “small kalpas”. In the Buddhist scriptures, the term “Three Great Kalpas” refers to the Great Kalpas of the three periods of past, present and future. In the previous world before our present earth world, the era was called “Kalpa of Adornment”. During twenty small kalpas in the Stage of Existence of the Adornment Kalpa, there were one thousand Buddhas in existence to maintain the virtuous adornment of their world, hence its unique naming. Today, the current era is called the “Kalpa of Virtue”. In the twenty small kalpas of the Stage of Existence of this era, one thousand Buddhas will also be born. The present Sakyamuni Buddha is the fourth Buddha. When it comes to the fifth Buddha, his name will be Maitreya Buddha. Today, he is commonly referred to as “Maitreya Buddha – the Buddha to be”. He is presently not a Buddha and hence the name. The next aeon is called the “Kalpa of Stars”. In this Kalpa of Stars, within the twenty small kalpas of the Stage of Existence, there will also be one thousand Buddhas. When the earth of the “Kalpa of Stars” era is destroyed, a new earth will be formed again. If the people of our present world wish to lead a long and blissful life, it is really possible to fulfil this wish. All that is needed is for the people to carry out good deeds, to cultivate and emulate the aspiration of the Bodhisattvas, to contribute to the beneficial deeds of Bodhisattvas, … and within the birth-death transmigration in the six realms of existence to continually maintain the human form lifetime after lifetime. When finally the “End of the World” comes, their “nature-soul” will be saved and they will be born in the Heaven of Light-sound where they will enjoy heavenly bliss. The world may become damaged, but our “nature-soul” is non-ceasing. When a new earth is formed, those beings will come down from the Heaven of Light-sound, and due to the effect of the communal virtuous karma, together a new world is created that will be a brighter, more stable, peaceful and blissful Buddha World. It is hoped that everyone will emulate the spirit and virtuous deeds of the Bodhisattvas lifetime after lifetime, and never to regress from the Bodhi path and enlightenment, but to continuously cultivate through the aeon of “Three Great Kalpas”. While there are a thousand Buddhas born in each Great Kalpa, if you could meet the Buddha in your lifetime and be guided and blessed; then it is definitely possible to become a Buddha in the next Great Kalpa after the “Kalpa of Stars” era. Therefore, Jen Chen Buddhism advocates the development of a blissful world on this earth. Such virtuous deeds shall bring about boundless blessings and longevity, and in the coming “kalpa” eras, everyone will become a Buddha. Note: [1] Kalpa: 1 small kalpa = 16.8 million years 20 small kalpas = 1 medium kalpa = 336 million years 80 small kalpas = 4 medium kalpas = 1 great kalpa = 1.344 billion years

  © Copyright 2002.Jen Chen Buddhism Centre Designed by DCS Solutions Ltd

• An Eternal Now

  30 May 08, 15:17

  Originally posted by longchen:

  I think the Asuras maybe these kinds of Beings. The asuras are also mentioned in Hinduism Aryan(vedic) mythology in ancient India. The Aryans in India where originally from certain part of Europe, so some indian/vedic concepts and the Greek mythology may be related.

  That make sense... thanks for the sharing.

• longchen

  30 May 08, 15:20

  Originally posted by Bodhi hut:

  
  Well..i think the explaination in that article is more convincing...but like other saying is that there is a creator who create humans...As for the glowing being you mentioned..they should be in the heaven or plane lower than buddha and bodhisavatta....in Mi Zong..they talk about Hua Zhan Shi Jie or Yi Zhen Fa Jie...the light being are not in this plane.. 

  Got some information which is posted by my forum member today..share it here...

  http://www.xanga.com/LevDau/657019082/item.html
  
  http://www.picassoclub.cn/forum/archiver/?tid-132275.html

   

  Hi Bodhi Hut,

  Just a sharing of my opinion..

  I think..it is not entirely correct to think of the Buddha as residing on any specific plane. We are too used to think in terms of objects and things external to ourselve.

  The Buddha or buddha nature is the 'shared reality' of all Beings. It is really quite hard to explain as we are too used to think into terms of places, objects, time, etc.

  Perhaps that is why in Tibetan buddhism there is the notion of the 3 bodies of the Buddha.. namely Nirmanakaya,  Samboghakaya and the Dharmakaya. The Dharmakaya is the share reality of all Beings.

   

• An Eternal Now

  30 May 08, 15:45

  Thats right...

  Buddha's body is always apparent,
  Filling the entire cosmos,
  Always intoning far-reaching sound
  Shaking all lands in all quarters.
  
  Buddha manifests bodily everywhere,
  Entering into all worlds,
  Revealing occult spiritual power
  According to the inclinations of beings.
  
  Buddha appears before all beings
  In accordance with their minds;
  What the sentient beings see
  Is the Buddha's mystic power.
  
  His radiance has no bounds
  And his teaching too is infinite;
  Buddha children enter and observe
  According to their knowledge.
  
  The Buddha's body has no birth
  Yet can appear to be born.
  The nature of reality is like space:
  Therein do the Buddhas dwell.
  
  No abiding, yet no departing:
  Everywhere the Buddha's seen;
  His light reaches everywhere,
  His fame is heard afar.
  
  No substance, no abode,
  And no origin that can be found;
  No signs, no form:
  What appears is like reflections.

  p. 164-165

  Avatamsaka Sutra
  

• Bodhi hut

  30 May 08, 16:43

  Originally posted by longchen:

  Hi Bodhi Hut,

  Just a sharing of my opinion..

  I think..it is not entirely correct to think of the Buddha as residing on any specific plane. We are too used to think in terms of objects and things external to ourselve.

  The Buddha or buddha nature is the 'shared reality' of all Beings. It is really quite hard to explain as we are too used to think into terms of places, objects, time, etc.

  Perhaps that is why in Tibetan buddhism there is the notion of the 3 bodies of the Buddha.. namely Nirmanakaya,  Samboghakaya and the Dharmakaya. The Dharmakaya is the share reality of all Beings.

   

  LC
  Totally agreed..

  It maybe quite hard for me to express english buddhism terms..hahaha..because i read buddhism in chinese.......AEN explaination aint wrong...but each buddhism sect has their own termilogy at times so it can be abit confusing...

   

  This is a tablation of the planes..or should use chinese (FA JIE)

  http://www.kaiwu.com/jcxs/sfjb.htm#1

• An Eternal Now

  30 May 08, 18:10

  Originally posted by longchen:

  Hi Bodhi Hut,

  Just a sharing of my opinion..

  I think..it is not entirely correct to think of the Buddha as residing on any specific plane. We are too used to think in terms of objects and things external to ourselve.

  The Buddha or buddha nature is the 'shared reality' of all Beings. It is really quite hard to explain as we are too used to think into terms of places, objects, time, etc.

  Perhaps that is why in Tibetan buddhism there is the notion of the 3 bodies of the Buddha.. namely Nirmanakaya,  Samboghakaya and the Dharmakaya. The Dharmakaya is the share reality of all Beings.

   

  Oh ya btw the 3 bodies is also found in Mahayana teachings, but the teachings of the 3 bodies are not found in Theravada. There are a few mentionings of the dharma body/dhammakaya in the Pali suttas but not the 'nirmanakaya' or 'sambhogakaya'.

• longchen

  30 May 08, 20:15

  Originally posted by An Eternal Now:

  Oh ya btw the 3 bodies is also found in Mahayana teachings, but the teachings of the 3 bodies are not found in Theravada. There are a few mentionings of the dharma body/dhammakaya in the Pali suttas but not the 'nirmanakaya' or 'sambhogakaya'.

  I see... thanks.

  I can understand the nirmankaya and dharmakaya. The sambhogakaya remains a vague mystery to me.

• Bodhi hut

  30 May 08, 22:36

  my understanding is..法身，应身，化身。。。。in chinese..

   

  extract from my forum

  北方世界中有，连��世界，是佛报身之净土。 连��世界之三�尊者， 毗��那佛 文殊�薩 普賢�薩 �称�严三圣。 毗��那的��是，光明�照，�一切处，大日�照。 �佛�之中，有清净法身佛毗��那佛，圆满报身��那佛，�百�化身佛释迦牟尼佛。 三身四智http://www.dharma.com.tw/X2GB/D21Story/S5044.htm

• sofital

  30 May 08, 22:44

  Originally posted by An Eternal Now:

  Oh ya btw the 3 bodies is also found in Mahayana teachings, but the teachings of the 3 bodies are not found in Theravada. There are a few mentionings of the dharma body/dhammakaya in the Pali suttas but not the 'nirmanakaya' or 'sambhogakaya'.

  It is true

• justdoit77

  31 May 08, 08:26

  Originally posted by longchen:

  Hi Bodhi Hut,

  Just a sharing of my opinion..

  I think..it is not entirely correct to think of the Buddha as residing on any specific plane. We are too used to think in terms of objects and things external to ourselve.

  The Buddha or buddha nature is the 'shared reality' of all Beings. It is really quite hard to explain as we are too used to think into terms of places, objects, time, etc.

  Perhaps that is why in Tibetan buddhism there is the notion of the 3 bodies of the Buddha.. namely Nirmanakaya,  Samboghakaya and the Dharmakaya. The Dharmakaya is the share reality of all Beings.

  yup, agree.
  Likewise I think we shouldn't think of which place or realm to go after death.

• An Eternal Now

  31 May 08, 14:06

   

  Hope this helps... btw I heard that only 8th Bhumi Bodhisattvas and above can perceive Sambhogakaya as they wish. Source: http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol9no3a.htm

  Volume 9 Issue No. 3

  All Form is Non-form

  by Venerable Master Shen-Kai

  The myriad of things and phenomena in this world are formed by aggregations of numerous causes and conditions comprising four elements: earth, water, fire and wind. As such, they do not have independent natures of their own. A tree, for example, is the result of a combination of nutrients, water, sunlight and air. Thus, they are in fact empty because when the conditions that created and sustained them are no longer present, these objects will return to emptiness. However, we don't see them in this light. We think they are real, absolute and permanent. But they are not. They are dependent upon other conditions. We need to truly comprehend and awaken to this fundamental truth of emptiness. The phrase 'all form is non-form' is from the Diamond SÅ«tra. Buddha said, "SubhÅ«ti, what do you think? Can we use our ordinary flesh-eyes to see the TathÄ�gata’s physical form and thus believe we are seeing the true TathÄ�gata ?" SubhÅ«ti replied, "No, World-honoured One. We cannot look upon the unreal form of the TathÄ�gata’s manifestation and think we have perceived the non-arising and non-ceasing true body of the TathÄ�gata." How is that? The 16-foot physique of the TathÄ�gata is a bodily form produced by an aggregation of causes and conditions. When life ends, that body decays and eventually vanishes. It is not the truly pure Dharma-kÄ�ya of the TathÄ�gata because the Dharma-kÄ�ya has no form to be seen; it is empty and tranquil. How could flesh-eyes of sentient beings see the true form of the TathÄ�gata’s Dharma-kÄ�ya? Buddha told SubhÅ«ti, "Not only is the TathÄ�gata’s bodily form a false form produced by the aggregation of causes and conditions, which does not have real substance, so is any kind of thing in the universe, in this world as well as beyond this world. All living and non-living things, shapes and colours are merely formed by aggregations of causes and conditions. They are impermanent and will change as causes and conditions disperse. They are as illusory as the flower in the mirror or the moon in the water! "If looking at appearances of objects, sentient beings are able to lucidly awaken to its aggregation of causes and conditions, and understand impermanence, their arising and ceasing; and if at that very instant, distinguishing does not arise, then without discrimination, they can enter into deep stillness. In stillness, pure wisdom reveals itself. With supreme wisdom, they realise that all worldly form is created by causes and conditions. Its nature is empty; it is not reality. In this way, they will directly perceive the TathÄ�gata’s Dharma-kÄ�ya." SubhÅ«ti was the Arahat who best understood emptiness. Thus, with regards to emptiness, he had profound realisation. We see this in a story: Once, Buddha went to the heavenly palace of TrayastrimÅ›Ä�s to preach Dharma to his mother. He only returned to earth after having been gone for a few months. All of his disciples missed him. When he returned, they rushed to welcome him, each hoping to be the first to pay their respects to him. Being the most advanced in supernatural ability amongst the Buddha's female disciples, BhiksunÄ« Lián-huÄ�-sè (蓮花色) used her supernatural powers and transformed herself into the image of Saint-king CakravartÄ«. Then, with great poise, she went to stand right up in front. She very happily paid her respects toBuddha and said, "Disciple Lián-huÄ�-sè is the first to pay respects to Buddha today. Oh, I’m overjoyed!" Buddha replied with a smile, "Lián-huÄ�-sè, the first to see the TathÄ�gata wasn’t you. It was SubhÅ«ti!" BhiksunÄ« Lián-huÄ�-sè was astonished! SubhÅ«ti had not joined in the queue to welcome the Buddha. How could he have been the first to meet the Buddha? Buddha then said, "The bodily form of the TathÄ�gata is not seen by our perceptions. He who sees the Dharma, sees the TathÄ�gata." As it turned out, when Buddha returned to earth, SubhÅ«ti had been in the meditation hall sitting in stillness, deeply observing the emptiness of all things and phenomena, clearly understanding the reality of inherent emptiness, and thus realising the formless Dharma-kÄ�ya of TathÄ�gata. Even though he had not been there in the queue, he had in fact truly seen the TathÄ�gata. Buddha has three bodies (TrikÄ�ya). One is 'NirmÄ�na-kÄ�ya'(化身), or the 'Emanation Body'. According to the sentient beings' capacity for understanding, Buddha manifests the illusory forms of physical bodies in numerous worlds. Because of their heavy karmic hindrances, some disciples were only able to see the 16-foot golden body of the Buddha, but were unable to see the 32 physical characteristics and 80 accompanying physical features of a great person (i.e. DvÄ�trimÅ›advara-laksana and Anuvyañjana). Another body of Buddha is 'Sambhoga-kÄ�ya' (报身), or the 'benefiting body', of which are two kinds: one is the 'body which benefits oneself', and the other is the 'body which benefits others'. The former is the Buddha's own attainment and awakening to his meritorious intrinsic pure Buddha-nature, in the state of Dharma joy. The latter is the appearance of enlightened, liberated Bodhisattvas to guide beginner-Bodhisattvas (i.e. sentient beings who emulate Bodhisattvas and practise the Bodhisattva Way) according to prevailing causalities, enabling these beginner-Bodhisattvas to benefit from the teachings of Greater Vehicle (MahÄ�yÄ�na) with Dharma joy. Both NirmÄ�na-kÄ�ya and Sambhoga-kÄ�ya are physical forms which are visible. However, the perfect Sambhoga-kÄ�ya of Great Bodhisattvas is a form that is infinite and of awesome majesty. It is not something that ordinary sentient beings like us can see. What ordinary people see is the NirmÄ�na-kÄ�ya form. The third body of Buddha, named 'Dharma-kÄ�ya'(法身), is the Truth Body of the TathÄ�gata, and also the reality of all phenomena. It permeates all of space and is omnipresent. An ancient sage said, "Green bamboos are entirely Dharma-kÄ�ya, luxuriant chrysanthemums are all PrajñÄ�; each grass, each tree, all in the ocean of Buddha-nature. Green bamboos are used for expressing the state of Dharma-kÄ�ya, but bamboos are by no means Dharma-kÄ�ya. Luxuriant chrysanthemums are used for displaying the function of PrajñÄ�, but chrysanthemums are by no means PrajñÄ�." The myriad of things and phenomena in this world are formed by aggregations of numerous causes and conditions comprising four elements and five skandhas , arising by causality and ceasing by causality; their nature is inherently empty. And everything in the world is as such. They do not exist as individual entities. Hence, the nature of all things and phenomena is empty, tranquil and all pervasive. However, people are unaware of this and are grasping on to their belief that the numerous forms in the universe truly exist. But if you can truly comprehend this and awaken to the realisation that the nature of all forms is emptiness, then instantaneously you perceive the pure Dharma-kÄ�ya of TathÄ�gata.

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