Gambling, like forex trading, never pays....
-
then might as well say .... everything is a gamble...Originally posted by Chin Eng:you only view gambling insomuch as there is money involved.
crossing the road you play with something larger - your life.... of course YOUR life may be worth less that the money you have - you're entitled to this opinion.
.... but it's quite funny to see you define all the differences (as you say, so many of them) yet because of one or two similarities you define them as the same....
are you becoming just like that chap that said "odds ARE everything" ?
CE: Today I was gambling...
Fren: and where did you gamble?
CE: I was gambling at Orchard Road.
Fren: huh? Where in Orchard Road...?
CE: CK Tang...
Fren: huh? You gambled at CK Tang?
CE: Yes I took a gamble and bought a shirt.
Fren: You call buying a shirt, shopping, gambling?
CE: Of course... you think gambling only involves money issit?
Fren:
CE: Today I gambled at the road.
Wife: You mean now they have road side stalls for gambling?
CE: No I gambled with my life driving in my car.
Wife: You call driving gambling?
CE: Of course, driving around is also a gamble because I could have gotten into an accident.
Wife: -
close examination of the cover instantly told me he knew nothing about gambling. That was kinda the first clue.Originally posted by Chin Eng: actually my encounter with him goes way back..... sure I was wrong a couple of times (and had stated clearly that I was wrong), but most of the times, andrew writes crap, get use to it.
.... Oh.... do ask him about the book about gambling that he has purported to have written.... it's in his siggies.... all you see is a cover. Can't find it anywhere in the marketplace.
And why are you looking to buy the book lol -
oh finally i understand why we're arguing. It's all a big misunderstanding guys. We're both right.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:then might as well say .... everything is a gamble...
are you becoming just like that chap that said "odds ARE everything" ?
CE: Today I was gambling...
Fren: and where did you gamble?
CE: I was gambling at Orchard Road.
Fren: huh? Where in Orchard Road...?
CE: CK Tang...
Fren: huh? You gambled at CK Tang?
CE: Yes I took a gamble and bought a shirt.
Fren: You call buying a shirt, shopping, gambling?
CE: Of course... you think gambling only involves money issit?
Fren:
CE: Today I gambled at the road.
Wife: You mean now they have road side stalls for gambling?
CE: No I gambled with my life driving in my car.
Wife: You call driving gambling?
CE: Of course, driving around is also a gamble because I could have gotten into an accident.
Wife:
For Andrew, what really happened is, he created his own definations for certain words like gambling. That's why none of us understood his arguments.
For the rest of us normal people, i guess the dictionary has to do.
Apparently, in Andrew's world. Any action that involves money is a gamble. But non monetary stuff like playing Russian roulette does not fall in that category.
Also, i'm not certain, but i think the forex in Andrew's world is played with dice.
And sweeping statements probably have something to do with brooms. I'm not sure.
ps: thank god for the edit button. New jokes are exploding in my head every second. -
Originally posted by deathbait:oh finally i understand why we're arguing. It's all a big misunderstanding guys. We're both right.
For Andrew, what really happened is, he created his own definations for certain words like gambling. That's why none of us understood his arguments.
For the rest of us normal people, i guess the dictionary has to do.
Apparently, in Andrew's world. Any action that involves money is a gamble. But non monetary stuff like playing Russian roulette does not fall in that category.
Every time you open your mouth something funny comes out...
When you go shopping, you do not say... "I went gambling... you say I went shopping."
Neither do you say... "I was gambling" when you play "playing Russian roulette " .... you say "I was playing Russian roulette." -
I also never say i went gambling. I say:Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
Every time you open your mouth something funny comes out...
When you go shopping, you do not say... "I went gambling... you say I went shopping."
Neither do you say... "I was gambling" when you play "playing Russian roulette " .... you say "I was playing Russian roulette."
1) i played the forex today
2) I played baccarat today
3) I was playing at the roulette table in the afternoon
So erm, what's your point again? -
and if you said... "I went gambling" you would have been right...
-
Once again you show your ignorance at the gambling community/world. How you think you can write a book on it is beyond me.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:and if you said... "I went gambling" you would have been right...
No one ever says "i went to gamble today".
But that's neither here nor there.
My point is, your argument that russian roulette was flawed because no one ever says what you claim they would say if they were truly gambling.
I constantly say "i played cards today". That's as general as it goes. I probably will never in my lifetime say the words "i went to gamble today".
With your defination of gambling, no one ever gambles. Really. Ask any casino patron coming out of the casino. "What did you do?" They'll tell you what they played, not that they "gambled" -
Originally posted by deathbait:Once again you show your ignorance at the gambling community/world. How you think you can write a book on it is beyond me.
No one ever says "i went to gamble today".
But that's neither here nor there.
My point is, your argument that russian roulette was flawed because no one ever says what you claim they would say if they were truly gambling.
I constantly say "i played cards today". That's as general as it goes. I probably will never in my lifetime say the words "i went to gamble today".
With your defination of gambling, no one ever gambles. Really. Ask any casino patron coming out of the casino. "What did you do?" They'll tell you what they played, not that they "gambled"
and when people tell you that they went gambling, they are neither here nor there????
and just because you will never in my lifetime say the words "i went to gamble today", nobody in this world says "i went to gamble today" ????
nobody in the world? Like odds ARE everything?
ask "Ask any casino patron" ????
None of the casino patrons you ask will ever say they "gambled" and will ALWAYS say that they "played"... and the like "odds ARE everything" that is not a sweeping statement, is the truth?
Please don't make me laugh until I fall off my chair... -
Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
I'm almost certain you didn't understand what i was saying the previous post.
and when people tell you that they went gambling, they are neither here nor there????
and just because [b]you will never in my lifetime say the words "i went to gamble today", nobody in this world says "i went to gamble today" ????
nobody in the world? Like odds ARE everything?
ask "Ask any casino patron" like "odds ARE everything ????
None of the casino patrons you ask will ever say they "gambled" and will ALWAYS say that they "played"... and the like "odds ARE everything" is not a sweeping statement, is the truth?
Please don't make me laugh until I fall off my chair...
[/b]
Read it again.
Better yet, calm down before you reply again so this time you actually type in english. Yoda speak is charming and all, but hardly efficient for discussions.
I'm just pointing out that your filter to seperate gambling from other activities is ridiculous. Because a person doesn't use the word "gamble" or "gambling" in association with an activity, it's not gambling? Wow. Just Wow. You never case to amaze me with your logic.
oh i see what i did here:and when people tell you that they went gambling, they are neither here nor there????
my bad. I need to stick to short words and non-complex sentences. I keep forgetting i'm arguing with Andrew. My apologies. Crap i did it again. I mean "i'm sorry". -
How to calculate expected return?Originally posted by deathbait:Lol andrew
I like the way you attempt to link hard mathematical science to religion. Faith in a divine entity is so far removed from hard, proven mathematical proofs it's hilarious you're trying to concile the two.
I'm going to elaborate on my statement that "odds are everything" now. Partly because i'm tired of waiting for you to tell me why it's stupid, but mostly because I think it's better to explain an idea in detail than to just write vague statements(i'm looking at you, andrew), and this IS for the public after all, not just andrew.
Why do i say odds are everything when you're looking to invest?
Let's look at the objective of investing. When you invest, you want to meet certain criteria, or come close to them
1) make correct decisions
2) avoid making bad decisions
3) generate income in the long run
4) hedging
How do we make correct decisions? How do we know which decisions are bad? Introduce the idea of expected returns.
Expected returns are not to be confused with real returns. Your expected returns could be 300%, while at the same time, your real returns are -300%. What expected returns means is, in the long run, your real returns will match your expected returns, provided you continue to follow the prescribed strategy.
Obviously then, you want expected returns to be as positive as possible. This is not just for the forex, but for everything we do in life. A simple example would be choosing between two chicken rice stalls to buy lunch from. Assuming they both taste and cost the same with no queues, your expected returns are obviously higher if you buy from the stall that gives more chicken. And that is certainly the way you decide between two food stalls in real life.
Assuming you understand the above example, i'll elaborate a little on why andrew is wrong now to agree that emotional detachment plays a part in the investment process. Assume now that the stall that gives less chicken is run by your best friend. You are emotional bound to buy from him now. You are generating sub standard expected returns. It is a violation of (2), and you're now making a wrong decision.
Occasionally, the wrong decision may pay off. For example, the "more chicken stall" runs out of chicken just as you reach the head of the queue, giving you a "loss". But in the long run, you never go wrong making the correct choice based on expected returns.
But since we're on the topic of emotional detachment, i'll like to elaborate a little more here on the dangers of it(because being human, none of us are truly ever able to isolate it from our decision making). Emotional detachment is a dangerous thing when you're investing in the markets. Here's why:
The human mind is designed to learn from experience. Telling a child not to touch a hot stove won't work. The child will only avoid the hot stove after being burnt once. Only then will he start to heed advice regarding hot objects. Because he has learnt from experience.
Similarly, our brains learn to repeat actions that give a favorable return. In the complex world of the trade markets though, this primitive mechanism is a dangerous one for us. As has been pointed out above, the correct move(positive expected returns) is not always the best move in the short run. In fact, most decisions only give us an edge of about 10-15% over a random outcome. That's a lot of bad decisions that give positive short term results! And your brain inteprets those positive results as related to those bad decisions! This is why emotional attachment has to be kept in check. Play according to the facts, not your emotions.
Ok, going back to the odds. Why are odds important then? Well, the holy grail of all decision making is to know the odds. To know the odds is to never lose value in a decision again. For most decisions we make in our lives, we can at best approximate the odds. It is a pretty elusive figure.
Expected returns are calculated by odds. Odds is simply the probability of wins against losses. Every decision we make has it's upsides and downsides. But by calculating your expected returns accurately, you can see if that decision will lead to more upsides or downsides. Thereafter, the correct move can be made.
In a casino gamble, most odds are readily apparent. Expecially when no one has to make any decisions apart from how much to bet. Take roulette. Assuming we only buy 1 number, you expect to win once every 37 times. You
paid 1:36. 1:36 is your odds of winning. you're getting 1:35 payoff. That means your expected returns is negative.
By knowing the odds, you can determine that the correct move(if all that interests you is making money) is not to play the game. The better move is to be the house, of course.
Translate this to markets, or the forex in this case. You may be thinking by now that after this whole lecture, you're gonna be rich, because you will always make the right decisions. Well, the odds in these arenas are less well defined. Imperfect information baby. To determine the odds is what you have your traders for. It's why you pay the funds/banks a fee to manage the money for you. The traders aren't there all day playing with their gut. They are there because whether they understand the concept or not, they are in charge of estimating the odds to make the right call.
What are the odds that SIA share price will plummet to 0 today? You can tell me offhand it's close to 0, and you will be right. But that doesn't help you make good decisions. If i were to ask you a more relevant question, "what is the probability that SIA price will rise 20 cents today?", you would be stumped.Perhaps you'll try to guess a number, and that is what emotional investors do, subconsciously. That is obviously the wrong way. What if I gave you predefined odds? 2:1, SIA will rise 20 cents today. Knowing the odds, would that not give you confidence to buy SIA?
Odds ARE everything. They are the holy grail to investing. They are everything because the man with the odds will always make money. Knowing the odds is equivilant to never making a losing trade. Because even if the trade loses money, he is making the correct decision.
How again, my dear andrew, are odds not everything? Are you still going to insist luck and emotion plays a part? You are more of a gambler than the people you are trying to help, my dear boy.
You will of course excuse my maniacal laughter here. After all, the one time i actually make a point that supports Andrew's campaign, he shoots it down as grossly stupid=) -
ask "Ask any casino patron" ????Originally posted by deathbait:Once again you show your ignorance at the gambling community/world. How you think you can write a book on it is beyond me.
No one ever says "i went to gamble today".
But that's neither here nor there.
My point is, your argument that russian roulette was flawed because no one ever says what you claim they would say if they were truly gambling.
I constantly say "i played cards today". That's as general as it goes. I probably will never in my lifetime say the words "i went to gamble today".
With your defination of gambling, no one ever gambles. Really. Ask any casino patron coming out of the casino. "What did you do?" They'll tell you what they played, not that they "gambled"
"odds ARE everything ..." hmmm I wonder what gems you will be coming up with next.... -
good questionOriginally posted by ami128:How to calculate expected return?
sorry i left it out
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/e/expectedreturn.asp
that link explains it rather well i think. -
Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
At this point I don't think i even need to reply to these feeble replies any more. Until you have some real stuff to say, i say to you sir, keep your trap shut. Class is in session, and i'm actually teaching REAL things. You've done enough damage with your rubbish sprouting. God knows how many people you've ruined to make that quick buck off your books.
ask "Ask [b]any casino patron" ????
"odds ARE everything ..." hmmm I wonder what gems you will be coming up with next.... [/b] -
Originally posted by ami128:How to calculate expected return?
Download Odds Calculator Shareware Freeware Software at Super ...
....but if you think that "odds ARE everything..." good luck to you...
Odds Calculator Shareware Freeware Downloads. This program calculate preflop ... is a software developed to simplify and advance your online poker gambling ...
www.supershareware.com/software/odds-calculator.html - 56k - Cached - Similar pages
-
"odds ARE everything ..." is as true as when you "Ask any casino patron" you will have the same answer.... -
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&rlz=1I7HPAB&defl=en&q=define:gamble&sa=X&oi=glossary_definition&ct=titleOriginally posted by AndrewPKYap:then might as well say .... everything is a gamble...
are you becoming just like that chap that said "odds ARE everything" ?
1. money that is risked for possible monetary gain
2. take a risk in the hope of a favorable outcome; "When you buy these stocks you are gambling"
3. a risky act or venture
4. play games for money
see definition in bold
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/gamble
gam·ble
1. to play at any game of chance for money or other stakes.
2. to stake or risk money, or anything of value, on the outcome of something involving chance: to gamble on a toss of the dice.
–verb (used with object)
3. to lose or squander by betting (usually fol. by away): He gambled all his hard-earned money away in one night.
4. to wager or risk (money or something else of value): to gamble one's freedom.
5. to take a chance on; venture; risk: I'm gambling that our new store will be a success. 6. any matter or thing involving risk or hazardous uncertainty.
7. a venture in a game of chance for stakes, esp. for high stakes.
see definition in bold
therefore, the definiton of gambling does not necessarily involve money.
it is truly unbecoming for one such as yourself not to know the different definitions..... you DID say you are writer, correct??? -
just think... if "odds ARE everything" would people let you download the software for FREE as shareware?
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=gambling+odds+calculation+program&sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1B3GGGL_enSG239SG239
[/quote]Results 1 - 10 of about 1,950,000 for gambling odds calculation program. (0.11 seconds) -
shush andrew. Go away. Come back after class. Or when you've finally realised what odds are.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:....but if you think that "odds ARE everything..." good luck to you... -
I think Andrew has finally lost it.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:just think... if "odds ARE everything" would people let you download the software for FREE as shareware?
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=gambling+odds+calculation+program&sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1B3GGGL_enSG239SG239
[/quote]Results 1 - 10 of about 1,950,000 for gambling odds calculation program. (0.11 seconds)
Not that i'm grieving over it of course -
well, i am gambling on the fact that this book might be real and there may be something insightful to learn from it.....Originally posted by deathbait:close examination of the cover instantly told me he knew nothing about gambling. That was kinda the first clue.
And why are you looking to buy the book lol
.... but it's a gamble.....
.... the book HAS TO EXIST, because andrew says it exists.... if it exists it must be available for sale.....
.... in the unlikely event that the book is NOT available for sale, can i conclude that the book does not exist .... and EGADS! andrew may not be speaking the truth.... hmm... i think this is unlikely....
.... so andrew for the umpteen time, where can i purchase the book? -
I see a wounded andrew trying to hide his pain behind those smiley.
Andrew, maybe it is about time to give up and write another book about wanking. I am sure you no one will dare to challenge you. -
.... how about "Gambling, Speculations and Wanking - They Are Not Real!"Originally posted by Gazelle:I see a wounded andrew trying to hide his pain behind those smiley.
Andrew, maybe it is about time to give up and write another book about wanking. I am sure you no one will dare to challenge you.
It's just my suggestion.... -
Let me finish the conversation:Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:then might as well say .... everything is a gamble...
are you becoming just like that chap that said "odds ARE everything" ?
CE: Today I was gambling...
Fren: and where did you gamble?
CE: I was gambling at Orchard Road.
Fren: huh? Where in Orchard Road...?
CE: CK Tang...
Fren: huh? You gambled at CK Tang?
CE: Yes I took a gamble and bought a shirt.
Fren: You call buying a shirt, shopping, gambling?
CE: Of course... you think gambling only involves money issit?
Fren: But why?
CE: I bought a shirt but I am not sure if my wife will like me wearing that shirt.... so it's a gamble....
CE: Today I gambled at the road.
Wife: You mean now they have road side stalls for gambling?
CE: No I gambled with my life driving in my car.
Wife: You call driving gambling?
CE: Of course, driving around is also a gamble because I could have gotten into an accident.
Wife: Yes, it's a gamble, seeing all those reckless drivers on the road. In fact, parking a car in a parking lot can be a gamble some times.... look at the guy who parked his car in a private car park and someone just come and scratch it...
Yes.... life is a gamble. -
DelusionalOriginally posted by Gazelle:I see a wounded andrew trying to hide his pain behind those smiley.
Andrew, maybe it is about time to give up and write another book about wanking. I am sure you no one will dare to challenge you. -