belief in god VS athiest
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which to believe?
last good friday i attended a friends cell group meeting... and i was asked the "golden" question .. Do you believe?
i said i had to think about it ..
but i'm still thinking about it now ..
i've been an athiest my whole life ... big bang, evoloution
and then suddenly i've been asked to believe ..(not that i'm not expecting it ..)
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but it's the way people asks you to believe ..
look at the links http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urlTBBKTO68 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkhQLt1vbWU | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO9IPoAdct8
they make it sound as if they have been forced to believe ..
i'm contemplating weather i should bellieve or not but they way they are promoting it makes me feel very obligated ..
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from a chirstiant's view point , can you pls tell me how you feel about those videos and if all christiants feel the same ..
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i'm in a very confused state now so those of you who want to BullShit, Pls, PLS go another topic ... tyvm
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all boils down to faith. either you have it or you dont
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if u have been an atheist for ye whole life, why are u so easily swayed by others?
i dun believe, do you?
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belive in Jerry Almighty -
Originally posted by ctstalin:
if u have been an atheist for ye whole life, why are u so easily swayed by others?
i dun believe, do you?
i'm not swayed .. but just wondering if i should have a belief ..
got the "unsecrure" feeling u know?
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tts why im agnostic
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Originally posted by FireIce:
tts why im agnostic
huh? whats that?
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well... u got any problems just believing in science ? To me there is no loophole with science. Before u believe maybe u should try to question more about everything like their scriptures etc. Then see if u find any loopholes or not. If u think everything make sense to u, then maybe u should just convert
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too many lives have been lost in the Crusades.. no more.. There wont be another Catholic Inquisition!
Illuminati!!
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Of course you are not expected to believe straight away (though I HAVE heard testimonies of people who accepted Christ immediately after they heard the message/step into the church). What I am asking is for you to be open to the message that was shared during the Good Friday cell meeting.
If your friend's church was under LoveSingapore, I'm pretty sure you've watched "The Crossing". It was a pretty old film but it sorta brings the message "Christ died for the unbelievers too" across. Certainly, Christianity is more than just a film or a page in the Bible or History book. It's a relationship with God.
Question: Do you feel a prompting /stirring in your heart when the message was shared or during the worship session?
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You need to do your own research and question the beliefs you take for granted. Read critically for and against the various religions and science by scientists, sociologists, religious figures, etc. Evaluate what you object to - theology/science/rationalisation as an institution, regime or philosophy. Pursue knowledge for its own sake. And finally, you have to make the decision for yourself.
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u believe ur one
i believe my one
u dun come and ask me join ur one
i dun ask u come and join my one
ownself jaga ownself one
u want to believe in shui jiao or lan jiao oso can
as long as u happy can oredi -
Originally posted by bhkw:
which to believe?
last good friday i attended a friends cell group meeting... and i was asked the "golden" question .. Do you believe?
i said i had to think about it ..
but i'm still thinking about it now ..
i've been an athiest my whole life ... big bang, evoloution
and then suddenly i've been asked to believe ..(not that i'm not expecting it ..)
====================
but it's the way people asks you to believe ..
look at the links http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urlTBBKTO68 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkhQLt1vbWU | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO9IPoAdct8
they make it sound as if they have been forced to believe ..
i'm contemplating weather i should bellieve or not but they way they are promoting it makes me feel very obligated ..
=====================
from a chirstiant's view point , can you pls tell me how you feel about those videos and if all christiants feel the same ..
=====================
i'm in a very confused state now so those of you who want to BullShit, Pls, PLS go another topic ... tyvm
There are two ways to live your life.
1. Believe in things that are not proven
2. Believe only in things that are proven
From these two alternatives, you have:
1a. If you choose one, you can believe any crap like A Magical Pink Unicorn is living among us and takes care of us even though we cannot see it.
2a. To be scientific and logical is difficult.
So most people simply find something to believe in, and live their lives according to some organisation, so that they do not have to try to figure it out for themselves.
So to put it simply, if you are lazy and stupid, you should just cling on to the beliefs of one of the major established beliefs system (small off-shoots of these can be dangerous) for that will eliminate the need to think intelligently and logically.
I always tell people, dont, laugh at religious people, they have it easy. It is so much easier to say, Jesus, Buddha, the priest, the pastor said this and so this is what I do. It is so difficult to try to determine the probability of each relevant fact and then logically string them together to find a valid conclusion.
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
There are two ways to live your life.
1. Believe in things that are not proven
2. Believe only in things that are proven
From these two alternatives, you have:
1a. If you choose one, you can believe any crap like A Magical Pink Unicorn is living among us and takes care of us even though we cannot see it.
So to put it simply, if you are lazy and stupid, you should just cling on to the beliefs of one of the major established beliefs system (small off-shoots of these can be dangerous) for that will eliminate the need to think intelligently and logically. -
Originally posted by ctstalin:
if u have been an atheist for ye whole life, why are u so easily swayed by others?
i dun believe, do you?
hi five me too...and dun forget that DPRK is a atheist country...
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Originally posted by Beautiful951:
Re this link you provided: Belivers are normal too.
As usual, in the link you provided, it is full of hot air and full of claims without even one piece of verifable evidence or even link to verifable evidence.
As usual believers will simply quote such crap and say.... so and so said it (in this case, the article, but usually it is Jesus, Buddha, pastors, priests, monk... say.... ) and refuse to find out and work it out for themselves, refuses to think logically....
Re this link you provided: about your pink unicorn
The argument is that people experience god, jesus, holy spirit, evil spirits, lord krishna, lord ganesh and so on and so forth but they do not experience The Pink Unicorn
Why should one claim that their experience is "of god" and then claim that oether people's experience is "of the devil"?
Just because people claim that their experience is "of god", "of the holy spirit" "of the son" "of the father" you believe them???!!!
Look at Thaipusam. When people go into trance, and claim that god was in them, christians and people not fo their religion will say that the devil was in them or it is just a natural phenomena of mind over the body.
The key of course is that if someone choose to say that their expriences are "of Jesus" or change his mind and say (the same person with the same experiences) that they are "of Lord Ganesh" nobody can say that they wrong or prove that they are wrong.
You want to believe things that are not proven or do you want to stick to things that are logically backed up with empirical data?
see my post above whatever your answer...
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Seen it
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...and people are supposed to believe that? Oh yes, the lazy and stupid will.
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
...and people are supposed to believe that? Oh yes, the lazy and stupid will.
As usual, in the link you provided, it is full of hot air and full of claims without even one piece of verifable evidence or even link to verifable evidence.
As usual believers will simply quote such crap and say.... so and so said it (in this case, the article, but usually it is Jesus, Buddha, pastors, priests, monk... say.... ) and refuse to find out and work it out for themselves, refuses to think logically....
But I think that it is useful to a point when it talks about the skeptics in general, saying that believers are stupid in general does emphasize on the point that even skeptics are not quite so rational. They do not want anyone to have a different viewpoint from themselves. We can add, "just like believers". Is there anyone truly free from beliefs? I doubt that. Even the most hardcore skeptic will believe in something apart from science. And that is because our world is so amazing that science does not explain everything that happens on its surface.
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Originally posted by bhkw:
huh? whats that?
Basically you believe in the existence of a god, but not neccessarily of the currently established religions.That's my belief as well, science primarily deals with the identifying of Nature's laws but who/what establishes those laws?
But then again, i don't believe it would be possible to understand a mind that could create stuff like that.
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If an entity can pop up from nowhere to create/establish laws, why can't the universe pops up from nowhere with laws created and established? Don't waste your time over useless what if, what if... and live life in reality with everything as given (and finding out what is "given")
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Originally posted by Beautiful951:
As usual, in the link you provided, it is full of hot air and full of claims without even one piece of verifable evidence or even link to verifable evidence.
As usual believers will simply quote such crap and say.... so and so said it (in this case, the article, but usually it is Jesus, Buddha, pastors, priests, monk... say.... ) and refuse to find out and work it out for themselves, refuses to think logically....
But I think that it is useful to a point when it talks about the skeptics in general, saying that believers are stupid in general does emphasize on the point that even skeptics are not quite so rational. They do not want anyone to have a different viewpoint from themselves. We can add, "just like believers". Is there anyone truly free from beliefs? I doubt that. Even the most hardcore skeptic will believe in something apart from science. And that is because our world is so amazing that science does not explain everything that happens on its surface.
The difference of course is that skeptics understand "beliefs" as "beliefs" and not some "god given truths".
Why is that important? When you form your conclusions in life and make your decisions, you need to differentiate "beliefs" from "facts" and conclude/decide/act accordingly. You do not conclude/decide/act in a delusional manner confusing "beliefs' and "facts".
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Yes. But inside of many of us, are many fears. Of the dark and many others. Are you saying that you have no fear of anything irrational?
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
If an entity can pop up from nowhere to create/establish laws, why can't the universe pops up from nowhere with laws created and established? Don't waste your time over useless what if, what if... and live life in reality with everything as given (and finding out what is "given")
Physical rules dominate every aspect of our lives, even evolution. I'm just personally fascinated with the idea of what intelligence you would need to create the world around us. Reverse engineering how the world and life is shaped.I don't see why the idea of someone or something creating the universe and the rules that dominate it would seemed so offensive.
I don't advocate worshipping any beings to ask for any advantages in life, that's the human trait of establishing control over one another. I certainly don't see why any beings would neccessarily think like humans and regard the universe as we see it.
There's no proof saying there isn't a god that created the universe and vice versa. Your views aren't exactly any more valid than mine, i don't pretend i know more of the universe than anyone else but if the facts aren't there i'm just going to pursue my line of thought.
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Originally posted by Beautiful951:
Yes. But inside of many of us, are many fears. Of the dark and many others. Are you saying that you have no fear of anything irrational?
I never say you cannot believe to "ease your irrational fears" and yes religion and beliefs are excellent in easing people's "irrational fears."
Yes I have irrational fears but because they are irrational, they pass. You need to have coping strategies that are reality based to cope with the occasional emotional upheavals.
What is worse and can have long lasting damage is when people make decisions base on illusions, delusions and beliefs.
You need to make decisions base on facts, logic and not let your emotions and beliefs interfere in your decision making.
That is intellectually difficult and tiring/time consuming and that is why I said, religion is good for lazy and stupid people.
If you cannot cope with your irrational fears and you do not have the intellectual capabilities to reason and find logical solutions to your problems, then I recommend religion to you.
As a believer you just cling on to some beliefs as "god given truths" and you do not have to find the truth, to make your decisions. If the decision turns out to be wrong, you say "It is god's will" or "It will eventually turn out for the better".
No matter how delusional that is, it helps you emotionally to cope! Which is why I tell non believers not to look down on believers because they have found a way to live life, even if it is based on stupidity and laziness, that is simple and elegant.