Tang dynasty -we are part turks?
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The Tang ruling family claimed descent from the famed Han Dynasty general (Li Kuang-li) as well as the Daoist sage (Lao-tzu). On their maternal side, many Turkic women and princesses had entered their blood.
The Tang had absorbed at least 1 million Tu-chueh (Turk) tribes into China proper after victorious battles.
Even Li Shimin's 2nd son continued to speak in a Turkish dialect and lived in a yurt (tent) outside the capital walls of Chang'an. -
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According to historical records: "Many huren (people of non-Han origin) who had lived in Chang'an for a long time married Han women and produced children." "Huren intermarry with the Han people, and now many youngsters in Chang'an are of mixed blood."
So it seems maybe we do have turkish connection!
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Originally posted by Catknight:
where's the great philosophers and chivalry of Tang culture in them??
its political....
thanks to the communism and cultured revolution in China most of it has been wipe out. Most of the Northern chinese may not necessary have pure chinese ancestry. -
We probably have Mongol, Xiongnu, Manchu blood anyhow.
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Originally posted by Stevenson101:
We probably have Mongol, Xiongnu, Manchu blood anyhow.
not really if your origin are from the south.....chances is that you are much more origin than those in Bejing.....
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how come no one mention ottoman?
or osman???
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Originally posted by EarlNeo:
how come no one mention ottoman?
1288 Ottoman Empire appears in Bursa - tang dynasty already bye bye hello water margin
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
not really if your origin are from the south.....chances is that you are much more origin than those in Bejing.....
We don't really have a record of how much migrations our ancestors' have done.And i'm sure quite a fair chunk of them would often migrated south to escape the constant invasions from the north.
But yes, i'd probably have much in common with the Southerners over the Northerners.
However, my point is some of us would most likely have some traces of those 3 tribes, especially the Mongols. Considering the stringent control of marriage for the Manchu, maybe not too much of those.
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Originally posted by tan reborn:
1288 Ottoman Empire appears in Bursa - tang dynasty already bye bye hello water margin
coz turkish is the descendant of ottoman mah.... and if tang is b4 turk
and so... how come tang is part of turk? time line oso wrong liao leh.....
no such thing as turkish during Tang dynasty leh.... not even ottoman...
actually, no one know where ottoman or osman came from...not even themselves.... rummour are that they are from the left over or exile xiong nu clan....
TS got do research b4 posting boh?
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Originally posted by EarlNeo:
coz turkish is the descendant of ottoman mah.... and if tang is b4 turk
and so... how come tang is part of turk? time line oso wrong liao leh.....
no such thing as turkish during Tang dynasty leh.... not even ottoman...
actually, no one know where ottoman or osman came from...not even themselves.... rummour are that they are from the left over or exile xiong nu clan....
TS got do research b4 posting boh?
you are right about the xiong nu - emperor qin and han dynasty
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
its political....
thanks to the communism and cultured revolution in China most of it has been wipe out. Most of the Northern chinese may not necessary have pure chinese ancestry.
Definition of pure chinese ancestry ? -
Originally posted by Stevenson101:
We don't really have a record of how much migrations our ancestors' have done.And i'm sure quite a fair chunk of them would often migrated south to escape the constant invasions from the north.
But yes, i'd probably have much in common with the Southerners over the Northerners.
However, my point is some of us would most likely have some traces of those 3 tribes, especially the Mongols. Considering the stringent control of marriage for the Manchu, maybe not too much of those.
It would depend on your ancestry particularly if there are families Clans formation
particulary dialect groups such as the Teochew has its own formation of names being carry forward in a string of chinese poem and it is always the male that carry the name...These occured during the Song Dynasty when the invasion by Mongol while the chinese fled south inview of war and seperation they came up with poem as a source to identify family clans.
I would figure the mongol would have taken the woman as wives and slaved. But woman does not carry sir names. Yuen Dynasty only lasted 2 consecutive generation.
Further to add it also depend on when ur great or grandparent sail down to SG, if it was done at the end of Manchu it reduce chances of displacement from War II. and communist intergration.
So don't be surprise for most Singaporean pretty much origin from the south...some of the traddition that singaporean practice can be trace for a rather long period of time in history.
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
It would depend on your ancestry particularly if there are families Clans formation
particulary dialect groups such as the Teochew has its own formation of names being carry forward in a string of chinese poem and it is always the male that carry the name...These occured during the Song Dynasty when the invasion by Mongol while the chinese fled south inview of war and seperation they came up with poem as a source to identify family clans.
I would figure the mongol would have taken the woman as wives and slaved. But woman does not carry sir names. Yuen Dynasty only lasted 2 consecutive generation.
Further to add it also depend on when ur great or grandparent sail down to SG, if it was done at the end of Manchu it reduce chances of displacement from War II. and communist intergration.
So don't be surprise for most Singaporean pretty much origin from the south...some of the traddition that singaporean practice can be trace for a rather long period of time in history.
i only know my grandpa came from china - guan dong - san toh (mountain head)last time tcs - now media corp actor chew chor meng involve in the shooting
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Originally posted by Stevenson101:
Definition of pure chinese ancestry ?
typical would be your family trees....thru Clan organization to link to your blood line. -
Originally posted by tan reborn:
i only know my grandpa came from china - guan dong - san toh (mountain head)last time tcs - now media corp actor chew chor meng involve in the shooting
汕头 lah....wa loa what mountain head....Your head.
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
It would depend on your ancestry particularly if there are families Clans formation
particulary dialect groups such as the Teochew has its own formation of names being carry forward in a string of chinese poem and it is always the male that carry the name...These occured during the Song Dynasty when the invasion by Mongol while the chinese fled south inview of war and seperation they came up with poem as a source to identify family clans.
I would figure the mongol would have taken the woman as wives and slaved. But woman does not carry sir names. Yuen Dynasty only lasted 2 consecutive generation.
Further to add it also depend on when ur great or grandparent sail down to SG, if it was done at the end of Manchu it reduce chances of displacement from War II. and communist intergration.
So don't be surprise for most Singaporean pretty much origin from the south...some of the traddition that singaporean practice can be trace for a rather long period of time in history.
Wait, when you're talking about origins you saying family names or genetics here?
When i mean we have traces of Northern blood i'm talking about their genes, not their family names.
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Originally posted by Stevenson101:
Wait, when you're talking about origins you saying family names or genetics here?
When i mean we have traces of Northern blood i'm talking about their genes, not their family names.
In these days an age you could always do a genetics test...but thru cultured bias and behavior chances is that the guys family would not take in daugther who came from mixed ancestor....thats why the match married....ensured bloodline.
The southern families village stayed together in a block....literally all same sir names. It would be difficult to intergrate with the mongol.
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Talking abt turkish relationships with the chinese, the xinjiang riots make me think once they were so close even Li shimin(Taizong) Emperor of tang dynasty mum was xianbei tribe of turkish origins.But now was no longer enlightened Tang era, people have become more coarse and self centered sigh!
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
汕头 lah....wa loa what mountain head....Your head.
what's wrongis there any thing wrong with not writing 汕头 so i use mountain head - why cannot
am i misleading anyone here
at least i know where my ancestor orginate (my root) - to me enough already
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It's just a wild thought but if we clone a Li shimin using latest state of the art biotechnonlogy in PRC now, do you think he can bring china to great heights again?
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Pity the man died at aged 50 , he done more for china than any other emperors and could have even done more if he lived longer
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Originally posted by tan reborn:
what's wrongis there any thing wrong with not writing 汕头 so i use mountain head - why cannot
am i misleading anyone here
at least i know where my ancestor orginate (my root) - to me enough already
there aren't any direct english translation so you would have to write in ping ying