I, a Singaporean Chinese refuse to speak Mandarin
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I am an English speaking Chinese Singaporean. I have been reading this forum and talking to many Singaporeans (duh) and I just can't understand why some Singaporeans of Chinese ancestry say things such as "if you can't speak Chinese, you have lost your roots", "English is not our language" etc.
Let me make some points clear.
1. I am Singaporean, not Chinese. I have never been to China. My culture is Singaporean not Chinese. Anyone who has been to China will know Singapore culture and Chinese culture are like night and day, totally different. Our laws, medical system, social conventions, dressing, thinking, schools, transport, everything are TOTALLY DIFFERENT.
2. I, like all Singaporeans, grew up in school with English as our first language. I only use English at work and at home, since Singapore is runs on English. Our laws, newspapers and everything else are all in English.
I don't understand why under such an environment, some people still reject the use of English and speak Mandarin.
3. English IS Singapore's language. Some Singaporeans reject English as a "foreign language", the language of the British and Americans etc and say that as "Chinese" we should speak Mandarin, our ancestral language, our "roots". This is just a very bigoted view which is based on ignorance.
If we subscribe to this "foreign language" argument, every English speaking country in the world except English would be speaking a "foreign language" and have lost their ancestral "roots"!
If we follow this argument, in Britain, the Welsh should speak Welsh. Scottish should speak Scots, those at Cornwal should speak Cornish. Those in Northern Ireland should speak Irish.
Ireland should speak Gaelic or Irish, not English, a "foreign" language from England.
Americans, who are mostly of Irish, Germans, Polish descent would all be speaking a "foreign language". After all, they should speak German, Polish or Irish language, not English! And African Americans should be speaking Afrikaans?
English is no more a foreign language to Singaporeans than it is to the Americans, Canadians and 80% of British people.
If Singaporean Chinese should speak Mandarin, then German Americans should all speak German, Irish Americans, Irish, African Americans, Afrikaans etc.. But they like Singaporeans, are not German/Irish/African, the link has long been cut, they are Americans, they speak American English.
4. I think Singaporeans should be clear that they are Singaporeans not Chinese citizens. Just like African Americans are Americans not Africans. German Americans are Americans not Germans...so on and so forth.
I say we speak Standard Singapore English proudly with our Singaporean accent. (Mild) Singlish is fun as well, no it is not "bad English" because if you compare it with some British dialects such as "Geordie" or "Scottish English" or even "Welsh English", it is actually easier to understand.
If a foreigner does not understand my accent or comment that I sound weird, I would tell him he is the one who sounds weird! This is Singapore and this is our accents. If you can't speak with a Singaporean accent, then of course we can't understand you well, don't compain.
5. Mandarin is not even my ancestral language if you want to be anal about it. Mandarin is the dialect of Beijing and my forefathers were probably from Fujian, though I have some Malay blood in me as well.
6. Mandarin is useful? If you are dealing with China, yes. But lets not forget that 55 countries worldwide and almost all supranational organs use English.
The biggest economy in the world, America, uses English. Europeans all speak English as their second language these days. Canadaians, Australians, etc. And without English, you cannot find a good job in Singapore.
7. Lets not forget my "forefathers" and probably yours ran away from China and took up Singapore citizenship for a reason. He didn't want to be a Chinese citizen.
So don't tell me to speak Mandarin (a beijing dialect) in Singapore (an English society).
If you can't speak English in Singapore, I suggest you hang your head in shame, for you have truly "lost your roots".
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why cant you just speak both?
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oni in sg
got people refuse to speak the language their ancestors spoke.
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ä½ é«˜å…´å°±å¥½
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Originally posted by ChoCoChips:
oni in sg
got people refuse to speak the language their ancestors spoke.
If you had read my post, you would realise that in America, Britain, Ireland and every English speaking country, 90% of them are not speaking the language their ancestors spoke!
That is, if you can read.
And you might need a brain as well.
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Originally posted by Ranson:
If you had read my post, you would realise that in America, Britain, Ireland and every English speaking country, 90% of them are not speaking the language their ancestors spoke!
That is, if you can read.
And you might need a brain as well.
哦�好��
看�我在英国认识的人
都是�的
T.T
就好象我那个wales fren
他说的welsh 都是�的
我去wales
看到说welsh 的人
都是�的.
lastly
ä½ çš„90% come from where?
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First and foremost i actually took some time to read that fail story of yours. You dont even deserve for me to look for a cool story bro picture. Yes some of our ancestors originate from china and yes our roots belong to there. If china culture and bla bla bla is different from ours, what makes you think that in london/british/US, our culture is similar to theirs.
For god's sake, our national language is malay and not english/chinese. Thus i wont elaborate on point 3
As for the rest of the points, nobody cares if you speak england or china or iraq here. Fact is language, is just a communication medium that we use. For point no.7 , our forefathers escaped from china that time due to world war 2 happening in china. I suggest reading up on your secondary history textbook. And btw, in dialects we mean hokkien/cantonese/teochew , and not chinese which is a language. Lastly china like india is a developing country, we shall observe with open eyes in the future, will it be the ang mos that is rushing to learn chinese or the other way around.
Once again on your last few sentence, nobody cares what language you speak. Its not our fault that you got butt hurt over these things and decided to QQ here. I speak TTFU's language and i am proud of it
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. . . I feel sorry for his ancesters . ...
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Originally posted by Ranson:
If you had read my post, you would realise that in America, Britain, Ireland and every English speaking country, 90% of them are not speaking the language their ancestors spoke!
That is, if you can read.
And you might need a brain as well.
In America, Britain, etc etc, students are encouraged to pick up second and third languages. In fact many of them are picking up Mandarin.
A person with any foresight at all would strive to be bilingual, trilingual or even multi-lingual. Only an idiot would refuse to be proficient in more than 1 language.
Get it you elitist son of a b****
How's my fucking english?
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My culture is Singaporean not Chinese.
Singaporean culture? Singaporeans use a lot of Mandarin in the heartlands. Lots of it. Are you sure Mandarin is not part of Singapore culture? Yet if it is part of Singaporean culture, why are you not speaking it?
Our laws, newspapers and everything else are all in English.
Check your facts and get it right.
English IS Singapore's language.
...
they are Americans, they speak American English.
Mandarin, Tamil, Malay are all part of Singapore's language. If your argument is to be subscribed, you should learn our national language as well.
I think Singaporeans should be clear that they are Singaporeans not Chinese citizens.
...
This is Singapore and this is our accents. If you can't speak with a Singaporean accent, then of course we can't understand you well, don't compain.
Neither are Singaporeans American Citizens.
This is Singapore, this is us. Why don't speak Mandarin?
Europeans all speak English as their second language these days. Canadaians, Australians, etc.
So what's wrong with speaking Mandarin as second language?
So don't tell me to speak Mandarin (a beijing dialect) in Singapore (an English society).
Don't worry, we won't tell you to. We will just speak Mandarin among ourselves.
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Can i get a refund for my 5 minutes please ?
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Originally posted by TTFU:
Can i get a refund for my 5 minutes please ?
10 mins for me :(
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There were Chinese schools in Singapore even during the British colonial days, and they were teaching in Mandarin.
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Originally posted by Ranson:
I am an English speaking Chinese Singaporean. I have been reading this forum and talking to many Singaporeans (duh) and I just can't understand why some Singaporeans of Chinese ancestry say things such as "if you can't speak Chinese, you have lost your roots", "English is not our language" etc.
Let me make some points clear.
1. I am Singaporean, not Chinese. I have never been to China. My culture is Singaporean not Chinese. Anyone who has been to China will know Singapore culture and Chinese culture are like night and day, totally different. Our laws, medical system, social conventions, dressing, thinking, schools, transport, everything are TOTALLY DIFFERENT.
2. I, like all Singaporeans, grew up in school with English as our first language. I only use English at work and at home, since Singapore is runs on English. Our laws, newspapers and everything else are all in English.
I don't understand why under such an environment, some people still reject the use of English and speak Mandarin.
3. English IS Singapore's language. Some Singaporeans reject English as a "foreign language", the language of the British and Americans etc and say that as "Chinese" we should speak Mandarin, our ancestral language, our "roots". This is just a very bigoted view which is based on ignorance.
If we subscribe to this "foreign language" argument, every English speaking country in the world except English would be speaking a "foreign language" and have lost their ancestral "roots"!
If we follow this argument, in Britain, the Welsh should speak Welsh. Scottish should speak Scots, those at Cornwal should speak Cornish. Those in Northern Ireland should speak Irish.
Ireland should speak Gaelic or Irish, not English, a "foreign" language from England.
Americans, who are mostly of Irish, Germans, Polish descent would all be speaking a "foreign language". After all, they should speak German, Polish or Irish language, not English! And African Americans should be speaking Afrikaans?
English is no more a foreign language to Singaporeans than it is to the Americans, Canadians and 80% of British people.
If Singaporean Chinese should speak Mandarin, then German Americans should all speak German, Irish Americans, Irish, African Americans, Afrikaans etc.. But they like Singaporeans, are not German/Irish/African, the link has long been cut, they are Americans, they speak American English.
4. I think Singaporeans should be clear that they are Singaporeans not Chinese citizens. Just like African Americans are Americans not Africans. German Americans are Americans not Germans...so on and so forth.
I say we speak Standard Singapore English proudly with our Singaporean accent. (Mild) Singlish is fun as well, no it is not "bad English" because if you compare it with some British dialects such as "Geordie" or "Scottish English" or even "Welsh English", it is actually easier to understand.
If a foreigner does not understand my accent or comment that I sound weird, I would tell him he is the one who sounds weird! This is Singapore and this is our accents. If you can't speak with a Singaporean accent, then of course we can't understand you well, don't compain.
5. Mandarin is not even my ancestral language if you want to be anal about it. Mandarin is the dialect of Beijing and my forefathers were probably from Fujian, though I have some Malay blood in me as well.
6. Mandarin is useful? If you are dealing with China, yes. But lets not forget that 55 countries worldwide and almost all supranational organs use English.
The biggest economy in the world, America, uses English. Europeans all speak English as their second language these days. Canadaians, Australians, etc. And without English, you cannot find a good job in Singapore.
7. Lets not forget my "forefathers" and probably yours ran away from China and took up Singapore citizenship for a reason. He didn't want to be a Chinese citizen.
So don't tell me to speak Mandarin (a beijing dialect) in Singapore (an English society).
If you can't speak English in Singapore, I suggest you hang your head in shame, for you have truly "lost your roots".
you definitely have a point
after reading the replies from others (which are more emotionally-charged), you logically listed out point-by-point in an objective manner
i support your arguments
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Originally posted by ChoCoChips:
哦�好��
看�我在英国认识的人
都是�的
T.T
就好象我那个wales fren
他说的welsh 都是�的
我去wales
看到说welsh 的人
都是�的.
lastly
ä½ çš„90% come from where?
In Wales, only about 20% of the people can speak Welsh fluently now
People usually speak Wales English now, which is a variety of English
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
you definitely have a point
after reading the replies from others (which are more emotionally-charged), you logically listed out point-by-point in an objective manner
i support your arguments
Wah so our points have no merit at all ah?
Our replies may have been emotionally charged but that doesn't mean that we did not counter his points logically.
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
In Wales, only about 20% of the people can speak Welsh fluently now
People usually speak Wales English now, which is a variety of English
cuz schs no longer teach liao.
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Originally posted by TTFU:
First and foremost i actually took some time to read that fail story of yours. You dont even deserve for me to look for a cool story bro picture. Yes some of our ancestors originate from china and yes our roots belong to there. If china culture and bla bla bla is different from ours, what makes you think that in london/british/US, our culture is similar to theirs.
For god's sake, our national language is malay and not english/chinese. Thus i wont elaborate on point 3
As for the rest of the points, nobody cares if you speak england or china or iraq here. Fact is language, is just a communication medium that we use. For point no.7 , our forefathers escaped from china that time due to world war 2 happening in china. I suggest reading up on your secondary history textbook. And btw, in dialects we mean hokkien/cantonese/teochew , and not chinese which is a language. Lastly china like india is a developing country, we shall observe with open eyes in the future, will it be the ang mos that is rushing to learn chinese or the other way around.
Once again on your last few sentence, nobody cares what language you speak. Its not our fault that you got butt hurt over these things and decided to QQ here. I speak TTFU's language and i am proud of it
National language is Malay or not, is politically defined. A "National Language" is not intrinsic in nature that it should be a particular language.
Mandarin itself, is another dialect, as pointed out by TS already. It is only elevated to the status of National Language by the government.
The political definition of dialects and languages by political entities is not supported by linguists.
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Originally posted by ChoCoChips:
cuz schs no longer teach liao.
Which is exactly the point TS is driving at
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Originally posted by littlemissbonkers:
Wah so our points have no merit at all ah?
Our replies may have been emotionally charged but that doesn't mean that we did not counter his points logically.
. . ..
May be . . .
Bangulzai afraid he can't ... take the heat.
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Originally posted by TTFU:
First and foremost i actually took some time to read that fail story of yours. You dont even deserve for me to look for a cool story bro picture. Yes some of our ancestors originate from china and yes our roots belong to there. If china culture and bla bla bla is different from ours, what makes you think that in london/british/US, our culture is similar to theirs.
For god's sake, our national language is malay and not english/chinese. Thus i wont elaborate on point 3
As for the rest of the points, nobody cares if you speak england or china or iraq here. Fact is language, is just a communication medium that we use. For point no.7 , our forefathers escaped from china that time due to world war 2 happening in china. I suggest reading up on your secondary history textbook. And btw, in dialects we mean hokkien/cantonese/teochew , and not chinese which is a language. Lastly china like india is a developing country, we shall observe with open eyes in the future, will it be the ang mos that is rushing to learn chinese or the other way around.
Once again on your last few sentence, nobody cares what language you speak. Its not our fault that you got butt hurt over these things and decided to QQ here. I speak TTFU's language and i am proud of it
Your post shows how ignorant you are.
Most of our ancestors (assuming you are singaporean chinese) are either 1. straits chinese (came here hundreds of years ago) 2. those who came over in the 1920s when hundreds of millions of Chinese were starving to death.
My forefather, and I know because I talked to my grandma, was DESPERATE to get the heck out of China and never to return for eternity.
Surprised you know Malay is our national language. But it is only for historical reasons since our laws, education, business all run on English.
Originally posted by we sacrifice:. . . I feel sorry for his ancesters . ...
I feel sorry for you and your ancestors. I mean, they would probably turn in their graves if they saw what a lowlife retarded trash you have turned out to be.Originally posted by eagle:Mandarin, Tamil, Malay are all part of Singapore's language. If your argument is to be subscribed, you should learn our national language as well.
True, but I am afraid I can't learn 4 languages, neither do I see the need to do so, so I stick to the predominant one and the one I am best at - English. Which is probably the most useful language by far in Singapore and the world we live in today.
Besides, a language brings with it culture as well and I feel more aligned and comfortable with English.
This is Singapore, this is us. Why don't speak Mandarin?
Because I was educated in English? My country's laws are in English? Civil service, working society all run in English? I feel more comfortable and proficient in English?
So what's wrong with speaking Mandarin as second language?
Nothing wrong at all.
Don't worry, we won't tell you to. We will just speak Mandarin among ourselves.
Glad to hear that. I don't want you to lower my IQ.
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Originally posted by littlemissbonkers:
Wah so our points have no merit at all ah?
Our replies may have been emotionally charged but that doesn't mean that we did not counter his points logically.
ok ok you all have good merits in replying at least =p
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
Which is exactly the point TS is driving at
no leh
what i saw was
hes practically rejecting the language,
will the people he spoke of
the imaginary 90%, reject whatever languages that were spoken before?
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
Which is exactly the point TS is driving at
Are you sure?He obviously has an agenda.
Just look at his other threads.
Another elitist asshole in the making.