I, a Singaporean Chinese refuse to speak Mandarin
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
so funny nick. but no language policies threads anymore. even have, most people give shallow replies one. no fun.
Anyway Quarrel Forum so pollute, flames and dungs all over.
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Originally posted by Clivebenss:
Anyway Quarrel Forum so pollute, flames and dungs all over.
except Angel7030 so angel-like only
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
except Angel7030 so angel-like only
haha....hum inc.
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Originally posted by Clivebenss:
haha....hum inc.
registered in taiwan roc
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I'm with you, I rather speak ENGLISH!
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Originally posted by Ranson:
I am an English speaking Chinese Singaporean. I have been reading this forum and talking to many Singaporeans (duh) and I just can't understand why some Singaporeans of Chinese ancestry say things such as "if you can't speak Chinese, you have lost your roots", "English is not our language" etc.
Let me make some points clear.
1. I am Singaporean, not Chinese. I have never been to China. My culture is Singaporean not Chinese. Anyone who has been to China will know Singapore culture and Chinese culture are like night and day, totally different. Our laws, medical system, social conventions, dressing, thinking, schools, transport, everything are TOTALLY DIFFERENT.
2. I, like all Singaporeans, grew up in school with English as our first language. I only use English at work and at home, since Singapore is runs on English. Our laws, newspapers and everything else are all in English.
I don't understand why under such an environment, some people still reject the use of English and speak Mandarin.
3. English IS Singapore's language. Some Singaporeans reject English as a "foreign language", the language of the British and Americans etc and say that as "Chinese" we should speak Mandarin, our ancestral language, our "roots". This is just a very bigoted view which is based on ignorance.
If we subscribe to this "foreign language" argument, every English speaking country in the world except English would be speaking a "foreign language" and have lost their ancestral "roots"!
If we follow this argument, in Britain, the Welsh should speak Welsh. Scottish should speak Scots, those at Cornwal should speak Cornish. Those in Northern Ireland should speak Irish.
Ireland should speak Gaelic or Irish, not English, a "foreign" language from England.
Americans, who are mostly of Irish, Germans, Polish descent would all be speaking a "foreign language". After all, they should speak German, Polish or Irish language, not English! And African Americans should be speaking Afrikaans?
English is no more a foreign language to Singaporeans than it is to the Americans, Canadians and 80% of British people.
If Singaporean Chinese should speak Mandarin, then German Americans should all speak German, Irish Americans, Irish, African Americans, Afrikaans etc.. But they like Singaporeans, are not German/Irish/African, the link has long been cut, they are Americans, they speak American English.
4. I think Singaporeans should be clear that they are Singaporeans not Chinese citizens. Just like African Americans are Americans not Africans. German Americans are Americans not Germans...so on and so forth.
I say we speak Standard Singapore English proudly with our Singaporean accent. (Mild) Singlish is fun as well, no it is not "bad English" because if you compare it with some British dialects such as "Geordie" or "Scottish English" or even "Welsh English", it is actually easier to understand.
If a foreigner does not understand my accent or comment that I sound weird, I would tell him he is the one who sounds weird! This is Singapore and this is our accents. If you can't speak with a Singaporean accent, then of course we can't understand you well, don't compain.
5. Mandarin is not even my ancestral language if you want to be anal about it. Mandarin is the dialect of Beijing and my forefathers were probably from Fujian, though I have some Malay blood in me as well.
6. Mandarin is useful? If you are dealing with China, yes. But lets not forget that 55 countries worldwide and almost all supranational organs use English.
The biggest economy in the world, America, uses English. Europeans all speak English as their second language these days. Canadaians, Australians, etc. And without English, you cannot find a good job in Singapore.
7. Lets not forget my "forefathers" and probably yours ran away from China and took up Singapore citizenship for a reason. He didn't want to be a Chinese citizen.
So don't tell me to speak Mandarin (a beijing dialect) in Singapore (an English society).
If you can't speak English in Singapore, I suggest you hang your head in shame, for you have truly "lost your roots".
Cool story bro
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I didn't bother going through everything but seriously what is wrong wanting to speak Mandarin?
Personally, I prefer to converse in English but due to work, I have been conversing more in Mandarin instead of English because my customers feel more comfortable speaking Mandarin.
End of the day, I feel as Singaporeans we can choose what we want to speak because we know and understand at least 2 languages. Isn't it nice that you have a choice on what language to speak?
Therefore, if English is your choice of language for every day use, by all means go for it but that doesn't mean you should shove your choice down the throat of others who prefer to converse in Mandarin/Malay/Tamil/Hokkien etc
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Originally posted by elindra:
I didn't bother going through everything but seriously what is wrong wanting to speak Mandarin?
Personally, I prefer to converse in English but due to work, I have been conversing more in Mandarin instead of English because my customers feel more comfortable speaking Mandarin.
End of the day, I feel as Singaporeans we can choose what we want to speak because we know and understand at least 2 languages. Isn't it nice that you have a choice on what language to speak?
Therefore, if English is your choice of language for every day use, by all means go for it but that doesn't mean you should shove your choice down the throat of others who prefer to converse in Mandarin/Malay/Tamil/Hokkien etc
Someone didn't have the mental capacity to handle Mandarin, that's why the "excuses".
His English wasn't exactly wonderful too.
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
If I worry about flaming, I wouldn't even have posted anything in the first place
You can go through all my historic linguistic threads in many previous threads
I will maintain my stand.
bleah >_<
I'm really amazed and in awe at your interests in all these. Good job!
Are you a linguist?
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Originally posted by eagle:
Someone didn't have the mental capacity to handle Mandarin, that's why the "excuses".
His English wasn't exactly wonderful too.
I think he should read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language
on how English came about.
English is a West Germanic language that originated from the Anglo-Frisian and Old Saxon dialects brought to Britain by Germanic settlers and Roman auxiliary troops from various parts of what is now northwest Germany, Denmark and the Netherlands.
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haiz, ���，�相为谋。
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Everyone has their personal preference... It's just like TS dun like to eat spinach... He can always eat cabbage or lettuce or some other thing...
Well, it's his/her view... There's no correct or wrong though...
But then again, I'm curious, why cant TS learn both?
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omg i seriously love you for saying that.
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we must understand the difference between being a singaporean and being a chinese.
being singaporean is being a citizen of singapore, a nationality. being chinese reflects who and what we are.
show our ICs and people will know our nationality. the very second we emigrate our nationality changes.
race is totally different. it stays with us forever. we can change our nationality but we can never change our race. even if we speak english like the caucasians we still arent them. we can become americans overnight but we can NEVER magically turn into caucasians.
we speak chinese to acknowledge OURSELVES, our roots and our ancestors, not for china!!! race is not something we can choose. but of course we are all free to choose what language to learn and speak.
imagine this;
a chinese who cant speak chinese. a malay who cant speak malay. an indian who cant speak indian.
frankly there arent any or many malays who cant speak malay or an indian who cant speak indian. but there are many chinese who cant speak chinese. and choose to avoid taking it as a subject. and there are parents who didnt try to stop that.
Why? Why is this so? are chinese more 忘本？are we more gullible? have we become so pragmatic that everything we do must be about whether it furthers our career? i think it is. we are susceptible to 'attacks' from other cultures. see how americanised we are.
i have nephews who mock at the chinese while watching chinese movies. they are too americanised. they speak and behave like caucasians.
"thats so cool!!", they like to say. "cool 个鸟", i feel like answering.
i dont understand what is so big deal about being able to speak english. you can speak the best english in the world but if you cant even speak your own language i feel sorry for you and your ancestors.
its a shame many chinese dislike their own language.
崇洋，�悲���
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It is ok if you cant speak mandarin as there alot of Singaporeans who also do. The push for Mandarin in SG is for political reason as I do accept the other reasons given such as to know your roots or engage in China in business. How many Singaporeans are engaged in business? I am sure it is a small portion as compared to Western companies. Look at who are the big players in China, they are not Chinese speaking people. Anyway, China is improving its English speaking population tremendously.
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Originally posted by dragg:
we must understand the difference between being a singaporean and being a chinese.
being singaporean is being a citizen of singapore, a nationality. being chinese reflects who and what we are.
show our ICs and people will know our nationality. the very second we emigrate our nationality changes.
race is totally different. it stays with us forever. we can change our nationality but we can never change our race. even if we speak english like the caucasians we still arent them. we can become americans overnight but we can NEVER magically turn into caucasians.
we speak chinese to acknowledge OURSELVES, our roots and our ancestors, not for china!!! race is not something we can choose. but of course we are all free to choose what language to learn and speak.
imagine this;
a chinese who cant speak chinese. a malay who cant speak malay. an indian who cant speak indian.
frankly there arent any or many malays who cant speak malay or an indian who cant speak indian. but there are many chinese who cant speak chinese. and choose to avoid taking it as a subject. and there are parents who didnt try to stop that.
Why? Why is this so? are chinese more 忘本？are we more gullible? have we become so pragmatic that everything we do must be about whether it furthers our career? i think it is. we are susceptible to 'attacks' from other cultures. see how americanised we are.
i have nephews who mock at the chinese while watching chinese movies. they are too americanised. they speak and behave like caucasians.
"thats so cool!!", they like to say. "cool 个鸟", i feel like answering.
i dont understand what is so big deal about being able to speak english. you can speak the best english in the world but if you cant even speak your own language i feel sorry for you and your ancestors.
its a shame many chinese dislike their own language.
崇洋，�悲���
kudos, totally agree with you.
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The thread title's already full of oxymorons lol. If you refuse to speak mandarin, dun even call urself a chinese. What right have you got. You are simply a singaporean.
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
except Angel7030 so angel-like only
arh, Anglo-Saxon(Ranson) and Angel alike, really ? Angel is more pretty, you know.
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:lol: ... nobody stopping u for refusing to speak mandrain .. u r the one that suffer in the end ..
is always good to know a language or two ..
Let us all speak hokkien .. yea -
Und wer kann hier Deutsch sprechen? :)
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Originally posted by eagle:
Let's see. If it's due to governmental policies, then in Singapore, we should continue to speak Mandarin. Mother tongue is still widely tested in Singapore; it's still used as entry criteria at PSLE into Sec Sch.
Let's include day to day activities as well. English may be the dominant working language, but being >70% Chinese population, Mandarin is the dominant heartland language, widely used in speech all over Singapore.
Finally, using the Welsh as an example isn't a reason on not speaking Mandarin at all. There are just too many differences in the comparison that has not been considered.
. . .. I concur
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Originally posted by eagle:
His is not a logical conclusion.
Just because someone or some other culture or race did it (supposing it is true), doesn't mean we should do it (refuse to speak Mandarin).
There's no logic whatsoever in his points, other than the fact that it is his choice to refuse.
Finally, I fail to see how his subtle conclusion that speaking Mandarin will lower his IQ is logical as well.
.. . .. . .. topic starter . . .. . basically . . . has deep rooted attitude problem . . .
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I'm not going to bother going through every single post of this thread, but what I can say is this: just because we don't live in China doesn't mean that we can go without Chinese.
I mean, seriously, what's so wrong about being effectively billingual? Yeah, sure, some people in here may say that many Americans no longer speak the language of their ancestors, but guess what: many Americans do have at least a basic grasp of a foreign language (French, Spanish, German, etc).
If you don't want to honour your ancestors or anything, then consider this: having some knowledge of a second language can give you a step up in real life. If you want to be really selfish, then hey, a good knowledge of Mandarin can help you deal with suppliers and business partners based in China. Simple?
You don't want to learn a second language, then fine; that's your decision. If you find it dumb to be billingual, then that's fine with me to.
Just don't diss others who are happy seeing things from a broader point of view.
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Asslick English language more TS. Just because you dont have the ability to learn 2 languages and be bilingual, Doesnt mean chinese language sucks. The quarrels went on till 4..30 ytd ? lol.... seriously if he has the ability to learn 2 languages well, will he still QQ here ? I doubt so. But then again, its not our fault that you got butthurt.
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Ranson kann nicht Deutsch sprechen, so können wir sagen nichts über ihn in deutscher Sprache.