Females Should Serve National Service.
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i also dont know how to do soc and range.
they can learn the art of sewing and cooking inside the force ma.
anyway, i am crapping. i dont expect them to serve duh.
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there are reasons why some men cannot go into combat, while others can.Originally posted by hisoka:ask them if you release those conscripted men from non-combat roles. then got need or not lor. no good reason to get the men in non-combat roles in over women also mah....
conscripting women complicates things in an organisation like the armed forces.
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wanting women to serve and toughen themselves up, while giving them non-physical jobs...Originally posted by borntolive:Females Should Serve National Service.
Get a taste of wad NS is like..N stop taking guys for granted
In my opinion..gals should serve NS to thoughen themselves up...i feel that most local gals r too frail n thin..
They dont have to do those too physical demanding work..Positions like medic, nurses, admin work can be issued to them...
I dont get it...Why females no need to serve NS???
i wonder if u're just jealous that they can go into university and start working 2 yrs ahead of u.
make up ur mind. -
yes there are reasons, i am jsut saying that release those that can't since they cannot do combat roles which iis the main reason why guys are conscripted(thats the rationale isn't it??). if you want to conscript some pple to do those non-combat roles then either do it by ballot or some other mechanism.Originally posted by ^tamago^:there are reasons why some men cannot go into combat, while others can.
conscripting women complicates things in an organisation like the armed forces.
actually i wont believe that when they can prove it to me. i believe its just an once off exercise and after that there wont be a problem.
and to add on, not sure about the rest, but for the admin staff like clerks, there are already females being employed doing the more senior admin positions at the same places, so no reason why it cannot be done. -
if we ballot, u will complain that it is unfair if u're balloted. ppl will debate over this. there will never be an end.Originally posted by hisoka:yes there are reasons, i am jsut saying that release those that can't since they cannot do combat roles which iis the main reason why guys are conscripted(thats the rationale isn't it??). if you want to conscript some pple to do those non-combat roles then either do it by ballot or some other mechanism.
actually i wont believe that when they can prove it to me. i believe its just an once off exercise and after that there wont be a problem.
and to add on, not sure about the rest, but for the admin staff like clerks, there are already females being employed doing the more senior admin positions at the same places, so no reason why it cannot be done.
hence, one for all, all for one, only guys get conscripted.
this also denies those who intentionally injure or disable themselves just so that they can be declared unfit. it just gives the idea that it is stupid to be fit.
the admin staff, they are DXO, they have a proper job scope and stuff. it is no different from a public sector job (though i think it's the worst of all public sector jobs). there is the requirement for salaried and employed persons in these positions as such things as payroll, manpower, leave etc that cannot be fully or sometimes even partially handled by NSF, which will lead to a conflict of interest and possibly even corruption. to counter this, the only way is for them to sign on or sign as DXO, get full pay, and not meagre NS allowances.
hope this is clear enough. if u've been through NS, if u've talked to ur S1, admin side, know how they work, u shld understand how the hierachy works. -
i was raising the dxo(ok i admit i can't remember the name DXO :lolOriginally posted by ^tamago^:if we ballot, u will complain that it is unfair if u're balloted. ppl will debate over this. there will never be an end.
hence, one for all, all for one, only guys get conscripted.
this also denies those who intentionally injure or disable themselves just so that they can be declared unfit. it just gives the idea that it is stupid to be fit.
the admin staff, they are DXO, they have a proper job scope and stuff. it is no different from a public sector job (though i think it's the worst of all public sector jobs). there is the requirement for salaried and employed persons in these positions as such things as payroll, manpower, leave etc that cannot be fully or sometimes even partially handled by NSF, which will lead to a conflict of interest and possibly even corruption. to counter this, the only way is for them to sign on or sign as DXO, get full pay, and not meagre NS allowances.
hope this is clear enough. if u've been through NS, if u've talked to ur S1, admin side, know how they work, u shld understand how the hierachy works.
as an example that the admin staff can be females. i know what they are and what they do. pls do read properly, thx. hope this is clear.
not a good reason for the the unfairness part. i should think that all males is much mroe unfair than balloting. so your once and for all is not justified nor reasonable.
regarding the downgrading part, i guess they will just have to get on their asses and tighten up the noose. actually i would say in the present system there is already in some part the trend of downgrading to avoid onerous positions. but you will note that there are still lots that do not think of geting downgrades, and its not becuase they are dumb.
in all i would say that there are insufficient reasons or justification for it to be all males in the non-combat roles. conscription can be done just as easily on females using other methods( such as balloting) to decide based on the numbers needed( this is an important requirement btw )
and i think we are not even debating whether females are really unable to take up combat roles. -
Aiya we guys already wasted our 2 and a half yrs of time already,why drag the ladies to waste their time too.
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u might think unfair, but who is to judge the line between who will serve and who will not, such that we can all come to an agreement on whether that is fair or not.
if u're in the position as Minister, do u think to go by balloting, no one will say that it is unfair? if u're drafted into army due to balloting and ur fren is not, u will think otherwise. if ur fren happens to be male in a joint balloting, worst.
as far as we're concerned, if u're a male, ni shi nan ren, u serve. full stop.
limiting our discussion as per the topic, female can be admin, but as a NSF or DXO? for a female NSF (assuming there is such a thing) to take an admin role of a DXO is unacceptable, as there is, once again, conflict of interest.
another thing, for the role of other non-combat roles e.g. medic (except admin) to be effective, you still need men, no matter the fact that they may have been downgraded. the fact that they have been revocated into the vocation means they can serve. (if they think they cannot they can always consult their MO, case closed.)
to have women in military operations for the sake of them wasting 2 years cannot be justified. we have allowed those willing to take on such challenges sign on, but the rest, they will always prove more useful in homeland defence. u have to consider issues like menstruation, harrassment, morale etc.
as far as i am concerned, this is case closed. u can proceed to the armed forces forum, they will enlighten u further. -
When we talk about terrorist, will woman be excused from getting hurt from them. Even when the man like us sometime can be helpless (before we can act, they are gone). Hence, it would be better, if they can at least fence off or let the terrorist know that "Don't play play hal" -
i said that ballotting is probably more fair than conscription by sex. i never say it is fair. pls understand the difference.Originally posted by ^tamago^:u might think unfair, but who is to judge the line between who will serve and who will not, such that we can all come to an agreement on whether that is fair or not.
if u're in the position as Minister, do u think to go by balloting, no one will say that it is unfair? if u're drafted into army due to balloting and ur fren is not, u will think otherwise. if ur fren happens to be male in a joint balloting, worst.
as far as we're concerned, if u're a male, ni shi nan ren, u serve. full stop.
limiting our discussion as per the topic, female can be admin, but as a NSF or DXO? for a female NSF (assuming there is such a thing) to take an admin role of a DXO is unacceptable, as there is, once again, conflict of interest.
another thing, for the role of other non-combat roles e.g. medic (except admin) to be effective, you still need men, no matter the fact that they may have been downgraded. the fact that they have been revocated into the vocation means they can serve. (if they think they cannot they can always consult their MO, case closed.)
to have women in military operations for the sake of them wasting 2 years cannot be justified. we have allowed those willing to take on such challenges sign on, but the rest, they will always prove more useful in homeland defence. u have to consider issues like menstruation, harrassment, morale etc.
as far as i am concerned, this is case closed. u can proceed to the armed forces forum, they will enlighten u further.
again i say the admin structure can allow for females. not the dxo taken over by nsfs. the female nsf can be clerks, right?? some how i think either you just refuse to get the point, trying to avoid it or are abit dense.
we?? what we?? who are the we? case closed? perhaps which is why pple are trying to get it open since certain pple are presumptiously shutting it out.
you argue certain roles need to be taken by males to be effective, are you by the same sentence admitting that for other roles the sex doesn't matter or females may even be more suitable? i'm not even arguing why you think the role can be done better by the male.
i am not advocating conscription to waste their 2 years i am advocating conscription as needed. note that said we can free up the males in exchange for the time the females spend to serve. in essence the time "wasted" is the same. and it is not a wastage for the sake of it, and it can be justified.
as far as i am concerned you have presumptiously closed the case and nothing you have said or at the af forum has satisfactorily cleared the case. perhaps you are the one who needs to be enlightened. -
So u trying to say that a gal being pregnant is guys fault? It take 2 hands to clap leh..Of course if a guy want to have sex, the gal must agree, ...OF course there will be other cases of irresponsible bastards who have sex out of pleasure without thinking of consequences..Originally posted by HENG@:we will when men will allow themselves to be fucked by dicks and get pregnant, to get a taste of what getting fucked is like and stop taking girls for granted.
talk about MCP huh. Its one thing to suggest gals do NS, its another to suggest it for the WRONG reasons. -
don't say girld, even guys kao bei kao bu about NS already, can't imagine what will happen if we get girls into the picture.
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imagine catfight in BCCTOriginally posted by Gordonator:don't say girld, even guys kao bei kao bu about NS already, can't imagine what will happen if we get girls into the picture. 
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anyway, hasn't this topic been discussed many many times already?
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yeah lor. but fun lah.Originally posted by Gordonator:anyway, hasn't this topic been discussed many many times already?
but nothing we can do unti the government/pap decides to actually open their eyes and examine the problem rather than jsut dismissing it. -
Originally posted by martin_lim85:imagine catfight in BCCT
Down there no discipline de ar? Still can catfight? -
NS for males already got so much b*tching by the guys. Imagine girls!
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or during lunchtime go emart window shoppingOriginally posted by ndmmxiaomayi:
Down there no discipline de ar? Still can catfight? or takes m16 scratch back (No offense girls) -
i said that ballotting is probably more fair than conscription by sex. i never say it is fair. pls understand the difference.
but this will lead to more troubles. it's fairness versus practicality. do u think ppl will accept that whether they waste 2 years (which is a lot of time) or not depends on something that is not as concrete as going by gender? i think we will end up with more defaulters years back, and by now we're invaded by malaysia.
again i say the admin structure can allow for females. not the dxo taken over by nsfs. the female nsf can be clerks, right?? some how i think either you just refuse to get the point, trying to avoid it or are abit dense.
the structure allow for females, u can have female NSF clerks, but do u really wan that to happen. can u guarantee the minimum quota of ppl to sign on as regulars just to handle sensitive issues?
we?? what we?? who are the we? case closed? perhaps which is why pple are trying to get it open since certain pple are presumptiously shutting it out.
you argue certain roles need to be taken by males to be effective, are you by the same sentence admitting that for other roles the sex doesn't matter or females may even be more suitable? i'm not even arguing why you think the role can be done better by the male.
in fact, for most roles in the military context, males are more effective.
i am not advocating conscription to waste their 2 years i am advocating conscription as needed. note that said we can free up the males in exchange for the time the females spend to serve. in essence the time "wasted" is the same. and it is not a wastage for the sake of it, and it can be justified.
so you wan to escape your NS liabilities? there is no exchange, guys will have to serve, unless u wan this important pillar of the nation to collapse. just look at the mervyn tan case and the ensuing furore.
as far as i am concerned you have presumptiously closed the case and nothing you have said or at the af forum has satisfactorily cleared the case. perhaps you are the one who needs to be enlightened.
that is because it is not my duty to answer ur question. i will only go thus far. if u think u have a valid point, by all means, pls write to the newspaper, and we can have a good debate at the national platform. -
they have examined all the issues and publicly stated their stand. LKY wanted females to conscript when the NS idea was mooted, Goh Keng Swee thought otherwise.Originally posted by hisoka:yeah lor. but fun lah.
but nothing we can do unti the government/pap decides to actually open their eyes and examine the problem rather than jsut dismissing it.
i dun understand why u said they have dismissed it without a reason. -
Originally posted by ^tamago^:they have examined all the issues and publicly stated their stand. LKY wanted females to conscript when the NS idea was mooted, Goh Keng Swee thought otherwise.
i dun understand why u said they have dismissed it without a reason. Soon they will reconsider again.. -
The M16 very jialat. Not only have to tahan screaming from girls who don't to shoot, also have to be a substitute for scratching.Originally posted by martin_lim85:or during lunchtime go emart window shopping or takes m16 scratch back (No offense girls)
Even I girl also cannot laughing.
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Eh, why not?
There are many females out there that are as fit, if not fitter than the typical male. -
i sayign recently lah. what happened 1 million years ago i dun care.Originally posted by ^tamago^:they have examined all the issues and publicly stated their stand. LKY wanted females to conscript when the NS idea was mooted, Goh Keng Swee thought otherwise.
i dun understand why u said they have dismissed it without a reason.
recently everytime the thing came up they just dismiss with some reothoric and then next pls.... -
imagine G.I JaneOriginally posted by seow:Eh, why not?
There are many females out there that are as fit, if not fitter than the typical male.