Why do all religions make sense?
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Originally posted by laoda99:
Why? I am not a clone
Originally posted by Owl^:Have you taken ur pills yet...
Paranoid chatter
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AND
So u agree or not agree with the points in the earlier reply ?spiritual awakening like being Born Again and Enlightenment for example are personal experiences. On what basis you say that they are "wrong?" How can personal experiences be "wrong?"
Read back the pasage. I am saying tat the individuals think their experience is surprisingly different from the experiences of the other people and assume the other people experience who contradicts his r wrong.The one having the experiences understands it to be "divine." So what are you trying to say?
I am trying to say they r not divine No matter how they like it to be divine, it is very probable they r simply not.You can only tell if you yourself have the experience. You MUST be Born Again YOURSELF You MUST be Enlightened YOURSELF. Why do you trust other people's personal experiences?
How do u know an individual has been "enlightened" ? They have a golden aura ? They score full points in maths ? Everything they say must be right ? They never make mistakes forever ? Nah... u can't tell the difference. Physically they r still the same. I can say I have been enlightened myself. Can u say I am wrong ? U can't, because how can personal experiences be wrong
I don't know why do u bring in "trust other people experience". I am simply comparing all the accounts of the people who claims they made spiritual breakthrough and derive a logical conclusion from it. If u can't even do tat then u can't tell a mad person from a sane one. How do u know a person is mad when he talks/hurt himself or say he can see ghosts eerywhere ? They r his personal experience as well. How would u know ? So every claim from every mad people r all true ?Guide the seekers to being Born Again and becoming Enlightened. These are special favours
If tat is wat u mean in the earlier statement, then I guess people who r good at brainwashing and psychology is the most enlightened one. Surely u got to acknowledge there r pursuasive people around tat can twist the mind of the weakYou reap what you sow. It does not matter how you justify your actions; whether the devil or a voice in your head asked you to do it
I still don't see how the above have any link with the others. -
Religion is a personal matter. You have appointed yourself judge of other people's personal experiences.
I am curious, why? On what authority? Are you some sort of god?
How do you know what you know? Did you do brain surgery on them? Can brain surgery discover people's experiences?
What if God simply refuses to give people like you evidence of His existence?
What if God simply refuses to give people like you experience of His existence?
What if people like you will never experience God because you are just too arrogant and God refuses to have anything to do with arrogant people?
What makes you so sure that Buddhist Enlightenment will produce physical changes that you can see? How do you know that if you do not see a golden aura means that they are not enlightened?
The individuals think that their experiences are of divine origins; who are you to say that it can never be?
What is your point other than it can't be it can't be?
People tell you that they have a headache and you are behaving like a child who has never experienced headache and keep insisting that there is no such thing as a headache? -
May be some of them have not seen or experience " Paranormal Sparks " ....Originally posted by casino_king:Religion is a personal matter. You have appointed yourself judge of other people's personal experiences.
Or their destinys are design to be " Earthly beings:non-spiritual delights ".
You shld encourage such "personalities" to seek for...simply challenge them for spiritual tasks....
Personal opinion...no obligation! -
pills yeah......lots of....~gilaaaaaaaaaaaOriginally posted by Owl^:Have you taken ur pills yet...
Paranoid chatter -
Join them all if you're skeptical of them and find out for yourself.Originally posted by casino_king:Yet they fight each other and even fight among themselves.
To worse phenomena is that they also try to sell each other short. Like the way to sell themselves is to destroy the other religions.
Hinduism makes sense if you try to understand Hinduism.
Christianity makes sense if you try to understand Christianity.
Buddhism makes sense if you try to understand Buddhism.
Islam makes sense if you try to understand Islam.
Yet within Hinduism the Hindus; Christianity the Christians; Buddhism the Buddhists and Islam, mainly the Sunnis and Shites cannot agree among themselves.
From the outside, I look at them with awe and wonder and at the same time with much disgust.
Then you talk to the scientists who disavows all religions; they too make sense. 
You'll believe when you're touched by one of them.
Alternatively, join them all if you're afraid to go burn in hell or suffer any other consquences in afterlife.
Religion is there to instill fear and hopes in everyone. The purpose is always to make you live a honourable, peaceful and fulfilling life. A person without a religion is a person without fear and hopes in life. This might makes the person dangerous cos he/she is not bound by any moral obligations to do good to people around him/her. A person with no fear is also a person with no hopes in life, cos he/she will try to achieve everything by themselves...thus might potentially lead to self-isolation. Nobody can bear living in this world alone when they're alone.
IF anyone felt that they're alone in this world even when your parents, friends are still alive and around you. Then they are truly alone and miserable, I would suggest taking up a religion to fill up the voided portion of the heart. One must always be the student in life and never assume the position of the master, for the master doesn't exist anywhere. The master of your life lives within yourself, you need to seek her out.
Good luck. -
I encourage you to find out for yourself or experience for yourself what Buddhists call Enlightenment and What Jesus called "Born Again" to appreciate in a more profound manner what religion is all about.Originally posted by parn:Join them all if you're skeptical of them and find out for yourself.
You'll believe when you're touched by one of them.
The master of your life lives within yourself, you need to seek her out.
Good luck. -
Religion is a personal matter. You have appointed yourself judge of other people's personal experiences.
Judge of other people personal experiences ? Nah... u r putting words into my mouth and nto understanding my arguments. I am just thinking critically on your issue of "spiritual awakening" I have already stated many times tat "spiritual awakening" is not unique and many other people experiences the same thing. Do u agree tat there r people from different cults who claim exactly, if not more intense experience and yet their religion is really "unbelievable" ?
I am curious, why? On what authority? Are you some sort of god?
I didn't say the people who had experience "spiritual awakening" to be lying about their experience, I am saying tat many people from different religion has their share of witnesses on tis aspect as well. So wat is the possible conclusion ? U can only conclude either all religions are completely right (which is impossible because they contradicts each other) or tat "spiritual awakening" is mainly a random occurences or not conclusive enough to determine the validity of a religion. So wat other logical conclusion can u reach ?
Just basing on tis is a very weak stand to say the religion is real.What if God simply refuses to give people like you evidence of His existence?
I don't know man... on one hand he is desperate for people to believe in him and on the other he refuse to give them a reason to. Isn't tat strange ? The more simple answer is simply because he does not exists (so no evidence is present) and yet the church wanna retain believer so insist they use faith (no doubt from believer and accept everything said to them). The idea of sin is simply to make u feel guilty and put all the blame of the problem on yourself (the evil and imperfectness of world is not attributed to god even though he is the one who made it and he is supposed to be powerful to change it)
What if God simply refuses to give people like you experience of His existence?
What if people like you will never experience God because you are just too arrogant and God refuses to have anything to do with arrogant people?What makes you so sure that Buddhist Enlightenment will produce physical changes that you can see? How do you know that if you do not see a golden aura means that they are not enlightened?
No, I do not think tat buddhists got a golden aura of halo when they r enlightened. I am no buddhist myselfThe individuals think that their experiences are of divine origins; who are you to say that it can never be?
Consider cults saying tat their experiences r of "divine" origin yet their scipture is faulty like hell, I can really say tat one should exercise caution and think critically before accepting it at face valueWhat is your point other than it can't be it can't be?
U have not shown me any reason why "it must be it must be it must be"People tell you that they have a headache and you are behaving like a child who has never experienced headache and keep insisting that there is no such thing as a headache?
Talking about headache, it is really scientifically shown tat it really exists. There r physical changes tat can be seen in a person when it is suffering headache and it is repeatable in the sense tat other people tat faces the same headaces shown similar symptom. The cure for headache is shown to work reasonably and the causes to why it occur is also shown to follow a certain trend. The logic behind headache is given and it is logical with no contradictory evidence tat point otherwise. As such I will not insist there is no such thing as headache even if I do not have one. Can u say the same to "spiritual awakening" ?
U tell everybody tat ghost exists just because u see a shadow passing through your doorway and insist tat it is the necessary and sufficient evidence to prove ghost exists. When other people advise tat it means nothing, u put up a defend and say they r like a child. I wonder who is the real child here. -
You from EH?Originally posted by laoda99:pills yeah......lots of....~gilaaaaaaaaaaa
Nor wonder la....la...hmmm -
and u say singaporeans r not stupidOriginally posted by Honeybunz:Ok lor... they all make sense then.
*Still dun quite understand this thread... Naymind*
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woowoowoowoo ~I am owl~Originally posted by Owl^:You from EH?
Nor wonder la....la...hmmm
nah....i m just too free........... -
This guy looks like he has asperger syndrome. Look it up and you will have a better understanding of his behavior.
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enlightenment.
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This guy is aum_shinrikyo boss and if you believe that he represents enlightenment, you are mistaken.
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How did you know that spiritual awakening is not "personal and unique?"Originally posted by stupidissmart:Judge of other people personal experiences ? Nah... u r putting words into my mouth and nto understanding my arguments. I am just thinking critically on your issue of "spiritual awakening" I have already stated many times tat "spiritual awakening" is not unique and many other people experiences the same thing. Do u agree tat there r people from different cults who claim exactly, if not more intense experience and yet their religion is really "unbelievable"; ?
I didn't say the people who had experience "spiritual awakening" to be lying about their experience, I am saying tat many people from different religion has their share of witnesses on tis aspect as well. So wat is the possible conclusion ? U can only conclude either all religions are completely right (which is impossible because they contradicts each other) or tat "spiritual awakening" is mainly a random occurences or not conclusive enough to determine the validity of a religion. So wat other logical conclusion can u reach ?
Just basing on tis is a very weak stand to say the religion is real.
How did you know that all who claim to have spiritual awakening have it?
How did you know that God is desperate for people to believe in Him?Originally posted by stupidissmart:I don't know man... on one hand he is desperate for people to believe in him and on the other he refuse to give them a reason to. Isn't tat strange ? The more simple answer is simply because he does not exists (so no evidence is present) and yet the church wanna retain believer so insist they use faith (no doubt from believer and accept everything said to them). The idea of sin is simply to make u feel guilty and put all the blame of the problem on yourself (the evil and imperfectness of world is not attributed to god even though he is the one who made it and he is supposed to be powerful to change it)
How did you know that there is no reason why God does not want to give man a reason to?
How did you know that God does not exists just because there is no evidence present?
How did you know that God did not intentionally refused to give man evidence of His existence?
How did you know that it is not because God wants man to come to Him by Faith and not by evidence?
How did you know that it was not God who wanted man to come to Him by Faith and not the church that demanded it?
How did you know that sin is not a natural consequence of a limited and finite universe populated by finite and mortal beings?
How did you presume to know what Good and Evil is?
How did you know that it is not the presence of sin and the mortality of man that causes him to seek and put his Faith in the perfect God?
How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising his imperfection and recognising the perfection of God?
How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising the perfection of God and recognising that he is powerless to expect and demand anything from God?
How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising his limitations and that he has no understanding of God and must simply put his Faith in God?
How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising his limitations and that he has no understanding of God and must simply put his Faith in God?
How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising his limitations and that he is completely at the mercy of God?
How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising that despite his limitations had an instant realisation that God reconises him?
How did you know that Faith in God is not the only way to be born again. -
Originally posted by casino_king:This guy is aum_shinrikyo boss and if you believe that he represents enlightenment, you are mistaken.
but he says so.
his personal experience leh.
and alot of people share his divine experience leh.
ok. bad joke. -
This guy --> CKOriginally posted by casino_king:This guy looks like he has asperger syndrome. Look it up and you will have a better understanding of his behavior. -
If his followers seek enlightenment instead of putting their faith in a man, then they would not have done what they did.Originally posted by Ito_^:
but he says so.
his personal experience leh.
and alot of people share his divine experience leh.
ok. bad joke.
This can be said of all the religions; like Islam (know Allah instead of follwing the dictates of "religious experts"; ) Christianity (Born Again instead of simply indulging in church activities and beliefs; ) Hinduism (know the ultimate God of Hinduism instead of being stuck on idols; ) Judaism, (know God instead of following the Laws) and so on....
Members of religious organisations must insist that they be guided into the ultimate truths and experiences instead of simply asked to follow a set of practices and beliefs and be contented with that. -
As a delibrate Free Thinker.... All religion do not make sense to me.. especially to me.
While i believe all major religion teaches us to be morally good.. sometimes according to their own interpretation... I personally believe that's easier said than done.
Many religion has history of political agendas, manupilations and bloodshed... ... Buddhism and hinduism..are sort of the exception because they usually are not involved in politics.
Don't spam me.. but historically - the Christians and Catholic faith has the highest bloodshed count.. thru Imperialism to racism.
To me the bible is just a story book...
Please don't shoot me...
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Are you a free thinker because you think, that is, made a deep study of the religions and then conclude that religion does not make sense?Originally posted by MobyDog:As a delibrate Free Thinker.... All religion do not make sense to me.. especially to me.
While i believe all major religion teaches us to be morally good.. sometimes according to their own interpretation... I personally believe that's easier said than done.
Many religion has history of political agendas, manupilations and bloodshed... ... Buddhism and hinduism..are sort of the exception because they usually are not involved in politics.
Don't spam me.. but historically - the Christians and Catholic faith has the highest bloodshed count.. thru Imperialism to racism.
To me the bible is just a story book...
Please don't shoot me...
Or are you free thinker because you refuse to find out and think and remain with superficial understanding of religions?
What do you think? -
Hmm. How about Islam then? Especially considering recent times?Originally posted by MobyDog:As a delibrate Free Thinker.... All religion do not make sense to me.. especially to me.
While i believe all major religion teaches us to be morally good.. sometimes according to their own interpretation... I personally believe that's easier said than done.
Many religion has history of political agendas, manupilations and bloodshed... ... Buddhism and hinduism..are sort of the exception because they usually are not involved in politics.
Don't spam me.. but historically - the Christians and Catholic faith has the highest bloodshed count.. thru Imperialism to racism.
To me the bible is just a story book...
Please don't shoot me...
You should also do a search on "hindu-islam violence", which has been happening in India for quite a while.
Here's a link for reference.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=hindu+muslim+violence -
What the religion teach and what the followers do are two different things.Originally posted by SumOne:Hmm. How about Islam then? Especially considering recent times?
You should also do a search on "hindu-islam violence", which has been happening in India for quite a while.
Here's a link for reference.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=hindu+muslim+violence
What your teacher in school taught and what you learnt in school are two different things. -
I have already answered these 2 questions before. U can read back to the earlier post I made (believer share similar experience etc) And furthermore, I have asked a quesrion in retur. How do u know tat spiritual awakening" is divine and not natural ?
How did you know that spiritual awakening is not "personal and unique?"
How did you know that all who claim to have spiritual awakening have it?How did you know that God is desperate for people to believe in Him?
because he resort to threathen to force comversion ?How did you know that there is no reason why God does not want to give man a reason to?
for a omnipowerful god, he won't be forced by circumstances. Yet now there is really no evidence for believer to believe in himHow did you know that God does not exists just because there is no evidence present?
Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. People give an extraordinary claim tat a perfect being exists yet give no evidence. So naturally the claim is not valid. If u can offer extraordinary evidence then I will agree with uHow did you know that God did not intentionally refused to give man evidence of His existence?
If he want men to know, he simply just appear and tell men of his presence. He can simply reveal hell or heaven. But he do not do such thingsHow did you know that it is not because God wants man to come to Him by Faith and not by evidence?
Tat is the whole idea, why use faith and not logic ? To play with men intelligence ?How did you know that it was not God who wanted man to come to Him by Faith and not the church that demanded it?
It doesn't matter whether it is from church or godHow did you know that sin is not a natural consequence of a limited and finite universe populated by finite and mortal beings?
u should be the one to provide evidence since there is a claim (idea of sin) made here. BTW wat is your question ?How did you presume to know what Good and Evil is?
Even a child know wat is good and evil. I am talking about the gramatical kind. U want me to quote from the dictionary ?How did you know that it is not the presence of sin and the mortality of man that causes him to seek and put his Faith in the perfect God?
Sin and morality of men is put in by godHow did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising his imperfection and recognising the perfection of God?
Nothing is perfect. If u need to recognise the "perfectness" of god, then u have to show extraordinary evidence god exists firstHow did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising the perfection of God and recognising that he is powerless to expect and demand anything from God?
Same as above. The burden of proving lies on u.How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising his limitations and that he has no understanding of God and must simply put his Faith in God?
There r probably a few thousand "god" around by different faith and cult. Why do u believe in your one and not the other "thousands"How did you know the only way to have Faith in God and be born again is not man recognising his limitations and that he has no understanding of God and must simply put his Faith in God?
Why do u not put your faith in some cult ? With faith alone u can believe in any cult or c ock and bull story in tis world
the rest r question of the same nature so in short they r answered one point or another. -
Hello people
I will like to post my own view regarding this topic. I must say I am not an expert in this religions stuff, but let me share with you what is my view about it.
I personally feel religions is a faith issue. It consist mainly of 2 components:
1. A meaning about life or a purpose in life
2. And Hope.
Now let me just ask a simple question:
If, shall what you believe in(may it be a religion or yourself or science) is totally not truth. Meaning shall you find out that your faith is a lie, what your feeling will be, and what will you do?
Regards -
It is their personal experience. How did you know?Originally posted by stupidissmart:I have already answered these 2 questions before. U can read back to the earlier post I made (believer share similar experience etc) And furthermore, I have asked a quesrion in retur. How do u know tat spiritual awakening" is divine and not natural ?
I don't, I listen to their story and I might trust them or i might not. How did you know that they don't?Originally posted by stupidissmart:How did you know that all who claim to have spiritual awakening have it?
God or man threatened? Did God threatened you?Originally posted by stupidissmart:because he(God) resort to threathen to force comversion ? Rolling Eyes
Of course there is no evidence, do you think that God is desperate? Do you think that Faith in God is doing God a favour? Do you think that puuting your Faith in God because you have the evidence is worth puuting your Faith in God?Originally posted by stupidissmart:for a omnipowerful god, he won't be forced by circumstances. Yet now there is really no evidence for believer to believe in him
see paragraph aboveOriginally posted by stupidissmart:Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. People give an extraordinary claim tat a perfect being exists yet give no evidence. So naturally the claim is not valid. If u can offer extraordinary evidence then I will agree with u
see paragraph above with an addition: Do you think it is worthwhile to have faith in a God that reveals himeself to you?Originally posted by stupidissmart:If he want men to know, he simply just appear and tell men of his presence. He can simply reveal hell or heaven. But he do not do such things
see paragraph above with an addition: Do you think it is worthwhile to have faith in a God you can logically comprehend?Originally posted by stupidissmart:Tat is the whole idea, why use faith and not logic ? To play with men intelligence ?
Neither, you realise it for yourself.Originally posted by stupidissmart:It doesn't matter whether it is from church or god
I think you mentioned something about sin in your earlier reply. The question is: How do you know that sin is not a natural consequence of being finite and mortal?Originally posted by stupidissmart:u should be the one to provide evidence since there is a claim (idea of sin) made here. BTW wat is your question ?
Even a Child understands that there are consequences to one's actions. To say Good or Evil is to presume that you can see the consequences from eternity to eternity. Can you see from eternity to eternity?Originally posted by stupidissmart:Even a child know wat is good and evil. I am talking about the gramatical kind. U want me to quote from the dictionary ?
Are you saying that God should have created Gods and not man? How can anyone have Faith in God if he presumes to know better than God?Originally posted by stupidissmart:Sin and morality of men is put in by god Rolling Eyes
Evidence again? Read the earlier paragraphsOriginally posted by stupidissmart:Nothing is perfect. If u need to recognise the "perfectness" of god, then u have to show extraordinary evidence god exists first
Evidence again? Read the earlier paragraphsOriginally posted by stupidissmart:Same as above. The burden of proving lies on u.
Even Hindus understand that there is only one ultimate God even though there might be many "understanding" or God.Originally posted by stupidissmart:There r probably a few thousand "god" around by different faith and cult. Why do u believe in your one and not the other "thousands"
Why put your faith in cults? Why not Lee Kuan Yew? Why not Dear Leader Kim? Nobody asked you to put your faith in anything other than Faith in God.Originally posted by stupidissmart:Why do u not put your faith in some cult ? With faith alone u can believe in any cult or c ock and bull story in tis world