Is spending on Defence a waste of money?
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threadstarter about to go NS ? ...
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Wat crap is this -
british were fighting hard against the Nazis over at their english channel...their resources distributions to her colonies are cut off esp with the Imperial Japanese troops presence in the pacific. the troops stationed in the lion city were few in numbers while the volunteers and resistence of multi-racial sgreans back then were ill-equipment and poorly trained as compared to the Imperial japanese soldiers. the japs were not testing the island's defence...they were sworned to conquer asia and meet hitler's troops at europe (russia).Originally posted by MrFugue:simi wayang? last time british forces wayang and the japanese all the more wanted to test singapore's defense fortress....sometimes if you wayang even more...the aggressor might be more determined.
re: sg's defense
it's important but i think the defense spending could be cut down especially when the period is under abdullah (more stability)
doesn't make sense to increase spending now?
one thing to take note in the recorded history of the jap invasion in WW2 over sg island. sg and brits troops did not wayang during that battle. the number of japs killed during the battle almost equals to that killed in capturing the whole of Malaya alone.
in times when a new adersary and threat has arise...not to sg alone but to the region and to the world, maintaining an army helps deter the agression from terrorists and organized crime groups and gangs. be it doc M or abdullah...it is not malaysia's business to question, to influence, to suggest or even to assure that sg need not step up and spend on military and security hardware, training and facilities. -
weapons cost...not the manufacturing alone but even the training and maintainance. our weapons are mostly of defensive nature and capabilities..hardly capable of mass destruction when used as offensive.Originally posted by dragg:i agree with everyone that we need to spend on defence.
but how much is enough? are we overspending?
frankly i have a feeling that the kind of weapons we buy are mostly to elevate our status. nothing to do with the real defence. -
excuse me hor what troops in lion city few in numbers the allied troops outnumbered the invading japanese by almost 3 to 1Originally posted by newmanmback:british were fighting hard against the Nazis over at their english channel...their resources distributions to her colonies are cut off esp with the Imperial Japanese troops presence in the pacific. the troops stationed in the lion city were few in numbers while the volunteers and resistence of multi-racial sgreans back then were ill-equipment and poorly trained as compared to the Imperial japanese soldiers. the japs were not testing the island's defence...they were sworned to conquer asia and meet hitler's troops at europe (russia).
one thing to take note in the recorded history of the jap invasion in WW2 over sg island. sg and brits troops did not wayang during that battle. the number of japs killed during the battle almost equals to that killed in capturing the whole of Malaya alone.
in times when a new adersary and threat has arise...not to sg alone but to the region and to the world, maintaining an army helps deter the agression from terrorists and organized crime groups and gangs. be it doc M or abdullah...it is not malaysia's business to question, to influence, to suggest or even to assure that sg need not step up and spend on military and security hardware, training and facilities. -
have u watched 2001's production of "behind Enemy Lines"? a US marine pilot (owen wilson) was disillusioned with his career, repeative and seemingly pointless trainings onboard his designated aircraft carrier with the Pacific Fleet and decided to quit the military after the imminent close of his current contract. when a routine flyover a 'no-fly' zone uncovers the brutal masacre of unarmed civilians over at the Bosnia region, his fighter jet was shot down his pilot executed by racists troops. as a navagator he then understood how important seemingly unimportant and wasteful training sesions come in use as he made his way to recover pictorial evidences of the masacre capture in the jet's high powered digital camera at the navigator's seat. he then comprehend what his superior (played by Gene Hackman) actions in being tough with him on his frequent defaults while in the force.Originally posted by SharkBoy87:SG spend billions of defence. I wonder why must SG spend so much on military hardware and all sorts of military exercise? Won't it be better to use it on something useful.
Why do people feel good that they just fired a round, a missile or something when it's all taxpayers money? Are all these exercises conducted to inflate the balls of occifers, so that they feel good wasting taxpayers money?
Why should we pay so much to the regulars when all they do is play-acting?
(I mean, not that I wish a war to happen but that's the time when they are useful, isn't it? For the rest of the time, it's mostly "bang bang bang".
People always call regulars "tan4 jiak" or "jiak leow bi" one. Perhaps, regulars can't prove others wrong.
We are also spending millions on military research. If these money were used for other research, won't it be better?
yeh its just a movie, probably highly piped up but if u understand why we train for a war/ battle that seems hardly possible to take place or worthy to fight for, look at the faces of your friends, relatives, kins and kith. for when that day do come, u are not fighting for a gahmen u dun like...u r fighting for what that is all you cherish and love if its the only last good thing you can do before your dying breath -
u know anything abouut WW2? the invading japanese soilders attacking sg island at that moment outnumbers those who are left to fight in the island alone back in 1942.Originally posted by vito_corleone:excuse me hor what troops in lion city few in numbers the allied troops outnumbered the invading japanese by almost 3 to 1
allied troops overall (if u are just 'presuming' but i can giv it to you) may outnumber the axis 3:1.
please i am toking about that particular battle at sg back in 1942 and u r lookin at the overall troops ration of allied vs axis? what u correct frequency or not? -
I'll rather the government continue building up OUR defence rather than sitting back and doing nothing.
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What war? S'pore isn't even capable of going into any war............not to mention winning or losing. If you little ones have gone for your NS, you will know why.Originally posted by Anti-RuleSS:Maybe yes maybe not but i still believe that singapore will never win a war if there is one. -
Ya, perhaps I'm like this Owen Wilson character.Originally posted by newmanmback:have u watched 2001's production of "behind Enemy Lines"? a US marine pilot (owen wilson) was disillusioned with his career, repeative and seemingly pointless trainings onboard his designated aircraft carrier with the Pacific Fleet and decided to quit the military after the imminent close of his current contract. when a routine flyover a 'no-fly' zone uncovers the brutal masacre of unarmed civilians over at the Bosnia region, his fighter jet was shot down his pilot executed by racists troops. as a navagator he then understood how important seemingly unimportant and wasteful training sesions come in use as he made his way to recover pictorial evidences of the masacre capture in the jet's high powered digital camera at the navigator's seat. he then comprehend what his superior (played by Gene Hackman) actions in being tough with him on his frequent defaults while in the force.
yeh its just a movie, probably highly piped up but if u understand why we train for a war/ battle that seems hardly possible to take place or worthy to fight for, look at the faces of your friends, relatives, kins and kith. for when that day do come, u are not fighting for a gahmen u dun like...u r fighting for what that is all you cherish and love if its the only last good thing you can do before your dying breath
I'm a regular in the arm forces and I sometimes think that I'm wasting taxpayers money. I go for prepare for exercises, go for exercises but at the end of the day, I can't find a sense of satisfaction. After all, I can relate to the corparate world outside and I really feel not useful and not contributing to the society.
I thought of switching career to become a defence engineer in DSO but it boils down to the same thing. Doing research, but don't know for what..... Still waste money...... Or maybe I should go China buy spec and sell here, then I'll make money.( Check my other post).
Haiz.... -
Wrong. Had the British held on for a week more, the 22nd Brigade would have been able to relief the forces along the Kranji coast.Originally posted by newmanmback:u know anything abouut WW2? the invading japanese soilders attacking sg island at that moment outnumbers those who are left to fight in the island alone back in 1942.
allied troops overall (if u are just 'presuming' but i can giv it to you) may outnumber the axis 3:1.
please i am toking about that particular battle at sg back in 1942 and u r lookin at the overall troops ration of allied vs axis? what u correct frequency or not?
The troop numbers at the time of the Causeway invasion, were in favour to the Allies. It's the leadership that refused to drag the war into the city, by which, they would have probably won a war of attrition.
Civilians would have been killed and our CBD a urban battleground.But Percival made the wrong call.. -
Military for defence...not war! Who in the right mind will even suggest Sg as an agressor? As we know our military hardware are often seen deployed in times of disasters. We are always there to help our neighbours in samitarian acts for the sake of humanity, survival and peace. But we have never suggested or intervene in another nation's politics and how they should run their country.Originally posted by de_middle:What war? S'pore isn't even capable of going into any war............not to mention winning or losing. If you little ones have gone for your NS, you will know why.
There's one thing though that the Sg military can do. Faced with threats and when the time comes when we have to fire at least one round or one light missile at the agressor we will and should never hesitate if that action more than justifies the wrong done to our sovereignty. -
Well, you say why spend so much when no war is going to happen? It is because that we spend so much that's why no war is happening to SG. It's a form of deterrence. And indirectly, buffing up our defence is also why you are able to rant about these kind of issues at your home on your computer without fearing any missles landing on your doorstep or whatsoever. It will only be a waste of money if a war happens now and for all the money spent on our defence, we would still get owned. That will be a waste of money indeed.
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Defence industries earn money too....locally produced weapons have been sold to other nations, earning useful revenue
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We sure are spending heavily alright but I'm not sure if the NS defence system we have can defend and protect us from flying testing missiles by our neighbours (who are getting free ideas from North Korea).
If a testing misfires and lands on us, can our current defence system shield and protect us or do we need a more super-expensive defence system?
Does that mean we have to spend more to get a better defence system?
What do we really need to do?
Will more military defence spending deter or prompt others to arm themselves (and therefore do more test fires)?
Personally, I prefer to spur a dwindling than growing arms race here.
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hw bout e ministers pay??Originally posted by SharkBoy87:SG spend billions of defence. I wonder why must SG spend so much on military hardware and all sorts of military exercise? Won't it be better to use it on something useful. -
Erm.. get your facts right... The british troops clearly outnumbered the japanese in SG. They lost because their equipments and tactics were for wayang... Theybrought anti-tank guns into the jungles but they could not fire... and the soldiers who thought they would be fighting in deserts suddenly found themselves in the malayan jungle. I was a pure history student so please dun argue facts with me... Cheers...Originally posted by newmanmback:british were fighting hard against the Nazis over at their english channel...their resources distributions to her colonies are cut off esp with the Imperial Japanese troops presence in the pacific. the troops stationed in the lion city were few in numbers while the volunteers and resistence of multi-racial sgreans back then were ill-equipment and poorly trained as compared to the Imperial japanese soldiers. the japs were not testing the island's defence...they were sworned to conquer asia and meet hitler's troops at europe (russia).
one thing to take note in the recorded history of the jap invasion in WW2 over sg island. sg and brits troops did not wayang during that battle. the number of japs killed during the battle almost equals to that killed in capturing the whole of Malaya alone.
in times when a new adersary and threat has arise...not to sg alone but to the region and to the world, maintaining an army helps deter the agression from terrorists and organized crime groups and gangs. be it doc M or abdullah...it is not malaysia's business to question, to influence, to suggest or even to assure that sg need not step up and spend on military and security hardware, training and facilities. -
we are going to die anyway so why should we eat? why continue reproducing offsprings when we know they will die one day? we are not talking about war...who wants it when the majority are not suffering from any agression? we build and maintain a defence force to deter threats that are real and may be a hurt to our economy if they surface. Terror threats and piracy are just a couple of names i can give here. why maintain your car and clean them everyday? they will wear and die off one day. why periodically change your car's breaking components...wait till it wears and cannot perform the frictional grip on the flywheel to effectively stop the vehicle then say lorOriginally posted by dinky1409:Well, you say why spend so much when no war is going to happen? It is because that we spend so much that's why no war is happening to SG. It's a form of deterrence. And indirectly, buffing up our defence is also why you are able to rant about these kind of issues at your home on your computer without fearing any missles landing on your doorstep or whatsoever. It will only be a waste of money if a war happens now and for all the money spent on our defence, we would still get owned. That will be a waste of money indeed. -
cannot earn much lahOriginally posted by oxford mushroom:Defence industries earn money too....locally produced weapons have been sold to other nations, earning useful revenue
*bows to be humble* -
ORD loh!!!!!!
10billion is the est budget for FY 2006. 700milllion on permanent staff and other crap expediture. and 9.3billion on military expediture. It has been increasing every year. But our NSF pay doesn't seems to increase every year
haha. We are cheap soldier. 550 a month only for a corporal and we work like a slave. Don't know why need regular for what. I think they are redundant. but some really is an assest but ended up got kick out. LAME -
those missiles flying over the waters at Japan...u think no weapons can intercept and shoot down the incoming missiles? u think u can sleep peacefully every nite if our airforce boys and girls are not monitoring the skies? the sg armed forces buying weapons any old how? weapons require maintainence..using them requires skilled and familiar hands and brains that means training the user. most weapons (esp projectile and ranged types) explode on impact which means to test its effectiveness and accuracy they are destroyed after use. fuel to move vehicles, energy to power equipments, wages to pay all soldiers, spares to replace worned parts on battling machines all boils down to dollars and cents...its like we buying lots of new equipments and weapons meh?Originally posted by macjoe:We sure are spending heavily alright but I'm not sure if the NS defence system we have can defend and protect us from flying testing missiles by our neighbours (who are getting free ideas from North Korea).
If a testing misfires and lands on us, can our current defence system shield and protect us or do we need a more super-expensive defence system?
Does that mean we have to spend more to get a better defence system?
What do we really need to do?
Will more military defence spending deter or prompt others to arm themselves (and therefore do more test fires)?
Personally, I prefer to spur a dwindling than growing arms race here.
our armed forces and ST guys were so pickly when they choose new fighter jets to replace our older models... during our unit and BMT range shoot we pick up all empty cartridges and i believe they can be deformed and scrapped for a value of reloaded and reused again. -
i want links...and if its from text i want the text's title and edition...please for my ignorant's sake i would want to correct it...doing it like what u said u would be no difference from what i was described as, juggling facts with your myths.....how would anyone thought they wouuld be fighting in malayan lands when the troops are all in defensive position over at the shores before Johore and the jungles in Bt Timah? who wouldn't know that deserts do not exist both in Malaya and the Singapore?Originally posted by siaohaizhi:Erm.. get your facts right... The british troops clearly outnumbered the japanese in SG. They lost because their equipments and tactics were for wayang... Theybrought anti-tank guns into the jungles but they could not fire... and the soldiers who thought they would be fighting in deserts suddenly found themselves in the malayan jungle. I was a pure history student so please dun argue facts with me... Cheers...
http://www.spearhead.com/0303-jb.html
read the above links and see if we are out numbered or not...hostory text documents only such that are constructive but certain truths remains. if the source is inaccurate u can write to them and hopefully get it closed. i am waiting for your link...i wanna read what was injected into your brains as knowledge u learned as a history student
...so tell me were we outnumberd 100,000 to 50,000 or did we outnumbered the japs 90,000 to 60,000? -
what loa u 550 pm not bad lor...my time this one 550 's sergeant dun get orso...lanjiaopeng like me i think around 300 only u in luck now orediOriginally posted by raymond_sianz:ORD loh!!!!!!
10billion is the est budget for FY 2006. 700milllion on permanent staff and other crap expediture. and 9.3billion on military expediture. It has been increasing every year. But our NSF pay doesn't seems to increase every year haha. We are cheap soldier. 550 a month only for a corporal and we work like a slave. Don't know why need regular for what. I think they are redundant. but some really is an assest but ended up got kick out. LAME -
yeh provate sector u can earn money but in the end if u are ever pround of your achievements and promotions so be it.....at the end of the training in your regualr army life no matter how it suz esp the senoir officers drinking beer in the messes while u sweat and stink like h ell mayb just tell yourself u are doing it for your loved ones.Originally posted by SharkBoy87:Ya, perhaps I'm like this Owen Wilson character.
I'm a regular in the arm forces and I sometimes think that I'm wasting taxpayers money. I go for prepare for exercises, go for exercises but at the end of the day, I can't find a sense of satisfaction. After all, I can relate to the corparate world outside and I really feel not useful and not contributing to the society.
I thought of switching career to become a defence engineer in DSO but it boils down to the same thing. Doing research, but don't know for what..... Still waste money...... Or maybe I should go China buy spec and sell here, then I'll make money.( Check my other post).
Haiz....
why not sell specs lor -
if the threadstarter is an army regular like he claimed, he should all the more noe how impt is building up the defence of sg.. i m amused tat tis thread even exist..
tats a chinese saying "yang bing qian ri, yong zai yi zhao" meaning u train the troops for 1000 days so as to make them well-prepared when the time comes..
if the threadstarter dun understand tis, den i dun c the reason y he need to lock up his house or his car..