Cheating during exams
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ya.. i agree too.. i meant if u bring in those formulas, not knowing when to use them... is plainly stupid...Originally posted by hisoka:depends on how you cheat. if you cheat by bringing in the equations so you don't need to remember them, but have used them often, you get the good effect. besides, certain modules are just memory based and getting extra infor in helps
but the above doesnt mean i encourage cheating.. is wrong.. so dont try them. -
If you need to use these equations often and you cannot remember them, it simply shows that you aren't familiar with them enough. You definitely need more practice with them. Its absurd to hear that you need to write an equation somewhere on a paper when a module often requires you to use that equation.Originally posted by hisoka:depends on how you cheat. if you cheat by bringing in the equations so you don't need to remember them, but have used them often, you get the good effect. besides, certain modules are just memory based and getting extra infor in helps
For memory based modules, how much information can you get onto that tiny piece of paper? Take out your book and compare the amount you need to memorize to what you can put on the paper. what you got on the paper is pitiful. Perhaps it can only earn you 1 or 2 points. Is it worth it or not? -
either you are being obtuse or just too set in your views. just becuase you use an equation often doesn't mean you can remember them. i've seen plenty of formulas that are a real pain to remember whether you use them alot or not. Its absurd to hear that you can remember every formula some eith 20 terms easily if you are familiar with them.Originally posted by matleep:If you need to use these equations often and you cannot remember them, it simply shows that you aren't familiar with them enough. You definitely need more practice with them. Its absurd to hear that you need to write an equation somewhere on a paper when a module often requires you to use that equation.
For memory based modules, how much information can you get onto that tiny piece of paper? Take out your book and compare the amount you need to memorize to what you can put on the paper. what you got on the paper is pitiful. Perhaps it can only earn you 1 or 2 points. Is it worth it or not?
you can get alot of info into 2 side of an A4 paper. i've tried it for the helpsheets. and it would definitely help alot if you can get it in. obviously the book might have mroe information, but the point of a cheatsheet is to summarise and brign out the main points which you might forget. you read and get reminded of the main points and you can go on from there.
not all cheating in exams is jsut blindly copying whats on the sheet of paper.
and i assure you sometimes just one piece of information( can be jsut 1 short line) that you forgot can cost you 30 marks. i've experienced that b4. -
The cheating that I saw was someone blatantly asking his friend near him what's the answer to blah blah blah.
I shake my head...
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cheating is wrong.. it's really unfair to those who really studied and tried their best.
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cheating generally is wrong.Originally posted by crucifiedx:cheating is wrong.. it's really unfair to those who really studied and tried their best.
But if your friend cheats and you didn't cheat, you are in the wrong.
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on equations:Originally posted by hisoka:either you are being obtuse or just too set in your views. just becuase you use an equation often doesn't mean you can remember them. i've seen plenty of formulas that are a real pain to remember whether you use them alot or not. Its absurd to hear that you can remember every formula some eith 20 terms easily if you are familiar with them.
you can get alot of info into 2 side of an A4 paper. i've tried it for the helpsheets. and it would definitely help alot if you can get it in. obviously the book might have mroe information, but the point of a cheatsheet is to summarise and brign out the main points which you might forget. you read and get reminded of the main points and you can go on from there.
not all cheating in exams is jsut blindly copying whats on the sheet of paper.
and i assure you sometimes just one piece of information( can be jsut 1 short line) that you forgot can cost you 30 marks. i've experienced that b4.
I have never see a formula with 20 terms in it. And normally for those hard formula, it will be given in the exam script. Oh i forgot to add in, that is how i remember equations. I remembered them by using them. I don't have photographic memory nor have a better memory than your. Yet this method has never failed me during exams.
on A4 paper:
So far, i mainly heard people using much smaller piece of paper. Didn't hear them use A4. The example in page 1 concur with what i think.
on that 30 marks question:
I have never encounter a 30 marks question with a single line answer. -
Formulas with 20 terms is quite common for meOriginally posted by matleep:on remember equations:
I have never see a formula with 20 terms in it. And normally for those hard formula, it will be given in the exam script. .
on A4 paper:
So far, i mainly heard people using much smaller piece of paper. Didn't hear them use A4.
on that 30 marks question:
I have never encounter a 30 marks question with a single line answer.
The worse is to have 2 similar equations, but they use funny variables and terms inside it -
Well, I have never encountered such formula. Perhaps i did but i never count the number of terms inside. But if i am faced with such a formula, I seriously would do even more questions, try the same type of question over and over again until i can remember these equations without much sweat.Originally posted by deathscythe99:Formulas with 20 terms is quite common for me
The worse is to have 2 similar equations, but they use funny variables and terms inside it
Facing with similar equations is something I encountered as well. i would remember one of them, then use that one to convert to the second equation. Plus i would do questions for both equations to drill in these equations. In the end, it is still about practice and applying the equations. -
If it's just 10 equations, it's still ok...Originally posted by matleep:Well, I have never encountered such formula. Perhaps i did but i never count the number of terms inside. But if i am faced with such a formula, I seriously would do even more questions, try the same type of question over and over again until i can remember these equations without much sweat.
Facing with similar equations is something I encountered as well. i would remember one of them, then use that one to convert to the second equation. Plus i would do questions for both equations to drill in these equations. In the end, it is still about practice and applying the equations.
But if you're talking about 40++ equations with numerous more correlations required to know, what do you think?
That's probably the reason behind open book exams -
Well, interesting, I have yet to see any course that demands 40++ equations nor an equation that has 20 terms. imagine that you need to use terms from 'a' to 't' for that equation.Originally posted by deathscythe99:If it's just 10 equations, it's still ok...
But if you're talking about 40++ equations with numerous more correlations required to know, what do you think?
That's probably the reason behind open book exams
And more interesting because my course is the one that make uses of numerous equations and lengthy ones. Oh well.
Lets say you got all these 40 equations on a paper in the exams. Are you sure you will know how to apply without understanding what these equations mean? You got 40 equations, and you had only slight knowledge about them, so how are you going to tell which one to use? I have never been able to apply difficult equations in the first few tries. It is only after working and using them through a number of equations before i can use them with ease.
Therefore, i would still try to learn to use and apply these equations. Use them on questions. Understand them. In this way, you can use them for any sort of questions. And the important thing is, it works for me! why not you? -
you know what's the saddest thing here?
a lot of people justifying and rationalising cheating..
which part of "cheat" did you guys not understand? -
People cheat because they are just too desperate. They need to clear a module rather than aim for high score. I got a friend who was so tramatise by exams that he dreamt that he failed his exams. This shows how desperate they are. But anyway, I just want to point out that cheating is not useful. Your grades improve only marginally.Originally posted by the Bear:you know what's the saddest thing here?
a lot of people justifying and rationalising cheating..
which part of "cheat" did you guys not understand?
(For death) I think I had a module with lots of equations as well. No idea how many equations but a lot. I had to list out all these equations on a paper because they are all over the place in the notes. Then i use that paper to hit very hard on the questions.
Logic is still the same. Apply the equations and understand them. Slowly then you will remember these equations. And don't try to simply memorize these equations from the paper. It don't work. At least for me. -
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Originally posted by matleep:
How can you be any worse off than if you were to sit for the same exam - assuming you've prepared for it the same way - without resorting to cheating?
Thats what you think. When you cheat, you got a 10 marks headstart. But do you really get a 10 marks headstart? What i am arguing is that you are probably bringing some equations into the examination hall without any idea what the equation is suppose to do or how it can help you. You saw the question, just dump any equations and perhaps only get some smypathy points. But the problem is, you are [b]losing marks for inability to fully apply the equations nor the right variables to use to get to the answer. And who knows, it might be the wrong equation that you are using!
You lose 50% of the points just to get this 10 marks headstart. Is it really worth it?
Beside, I don't envy those who cheat. I pity them. They are only there to clear the exams and they are constantly worrying over whether they pass or fail. Its not like what most perceive, that if you cheat, you will surely pass. So why don't your try harder to understand these equations?[/b] -
Nah, no time cuz i will be doing the same thing
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actually i concentrate too much on the paper that i hardly notice ppl cheating.
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Hmm... cheating....interesting.
In my secondary school, people write on the bottoms of their shoes. Just have to be careful when u walk into exam hall. Easy to destroy evidence too.
In my uni, no one cheat, cos open book exam. You can bring anything you can carry into the exam hall.
What's the point of cheating? I get 100 marks. You get 90 marks. So?
It's just a false sense of greatness, false sense of success, false sense of security and much wanted attention.
If I see someone cheating, I won't report him/her. Because I'm a coward. I'm afraid he will get his guys to hit me afterwards, hide my books, burn my pencils. Life's too short for us, much less if we have to deal with things like this. Unless I send an anonymous letter, but then the exams will be over, and there will be no evidence to proof it. -
Originally posted by matleep:
matleep,
Well, interesting, I have yet to see any course that demands 40++ equations nor an equation that has 20 terms. imagine that you need to use terms from 'a' to 't' for that equation.
And more interesting because my course is the one that make uses of numerous equations and lengthy ones. Oh well.
Lets say you got all these 40 equations on a paper in the exams. Are you sure you will know how to apply without understanding what these equations mean? You got 40 equations, and you had only slight knowledge about them, so how are you going to tell which one to use? I have never been able to apply difficult equations in the first few tries. It is only after working and using them through a number of equations before i can use them with ease.
Therefore, i would still try to learn to use and apply these equations. Use them on questions. Understand them. In this way, you can use them for any sort of questions. And the important thing is, [b]it works for me! why not you?[/b]
r u tryin to say students who memorise the equations without understanding r better off being a cheater themselves?
actually i also feel understanding the concept n the understanding of the equations background are important. but given the constraints of time for students for exam preparation, it's very difficult for them to fully concentrate on one module n neglect the rest of them.
so for them they will need tis tactics to study smart in exam. -
my uni got plenty of ppl stil cheating. all want to get good GPA for coursework then can later get into spec of their choice or 1st class honours.
also alot of double standards among teachers, some i heard close one eye during tests when students confer among each other. some very strict
heard tt for some with written assignment, they even find students from other unis who have finished that course and pay them $50 per hour for 'consultation'. -
it really make me wonder education these days are such a failure. where r the integrity of these future leaders?Originally posted by mrwonderful:my uni got plenty of ppl stil cheating. all want to get good GPA for coursework then can later get into spec of their choice or 1st class honours.
also alot of double standards among teachers, some i heard close one eye during tests when students confer among each other. some very strict
heard tt for some with written assignment, they even find students from other unis who have finished that course and pay them $50 per hour for 'consultation'.
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lol i think in todays society, associating integrity and future leaders is likened to chalk and cheese.Originally posted by 798:it really make me wonder education these days are such a failure. where r the integrity of these future leaders? -
Nope. I am saying that cheating don't get you high grades as people here thought. there is no point in trying to cheat nor envy those who does. Basically, they may have the formulas, but can they use them or know when to use? So in the end, they are just using these formulas to earn sympathy points.Originally posted by 798:matleep,
r u tryin to say students who memorise the equations without understanding r better off being a cheater themselves?
actually i also feel understanding the concept n the understanding of the equations background are important. but given the constraints of time for students for exam preparation, it's very difficult for them to fully concentrate on one module n neglect the rest of them.
so for them they will need tis tactics to study smart in exam.
Let me illustrate with an example with driving a car. Lets say that there is this theory book that teach you how to drive a car. What you guys are doing is to memorise the theory book to take the driving test. Or to cheat by bringing that book into the test itself. What i am trying to tell you is to go and practice driving a car before you take on that test. After some practice, the theory of driving a car will more or less be inside your head already.
And I too face time constraint. But let me tell you, its way faster and more efficient to practice the equations than to memorise them. How many times have you forgot these equations after you try to memorise these equations? You read, remember and then forgot. How long did these equations stay in your memory?
By spending more time practicing on the equations, the equations stay in your head much longer than memorising it. And best of all, you know how to apply these equations! Two birds in one stone! Besides, you learn from the questions, which are the equations that is likely to be use more often and what are the types of questions set by the examiners! Two more birds again! So you are spending more time to get so much more results. This is way better than spending time in memorising equations that you will just forget in a day or two. -
exam hall or classroom should instal CCTV cameras to prevent cheaters...
then the teacher will sit on the table with TV screen of the cameras recordings -
practising on the formulas... & understanding the formulas.. is diff... at least from my perception...Originally posted by matleep:Nope. I am saying that cheating don't get you high grades as people here thought. there is no point in trying to cheat nor envy those who does. Basically, they may have the formulas, but can they use them or know when to use? So in the end, they are just using these formulas to earn sympathy points.
Let me illustrate with an example with driving a car. Lets say that there is this theory book that teach you how to drive a car. What you guys are doing is to memorise the theory book to take the driving test. Or to cheat by bringing that book into the test itself. What i am trying to tell you is to go and practice driving a car before you take on that test. After some practice, the theory of driving a car will more or less be inside your head already.
And I too face time constraint. But let me tell you, its way faster and more efficient to practice the equations than to memorise them. How many times have you forgot these equations after you try to memorise these equations? You read, remember and then forgot. How long did these equations stay in your memory?
By spending more time practicing on the equations, the equations stay in your head much longer than memorising it. And best of all, you know how to apply these equations! Two birds in one stone! Besides, you learn from the questions, which are the equations that is likely to be use more often and what are the types of questions set by the examiners! Two more birds again! So you are spending more time to get so much more results. This is way better than spending time in memorising equations that you will just forget in a day or two.
practising on the formulas/equations dont make u understand the formulas/equations... but of cos, i agree with u that we have to practise on it to let it stay in our memories for a longer time.. & also, memorising w/o practise at all, most of the time, it dont work especially for Poly, A level and Uni standards.
As for understanding of formulas, from what 798 is refering, "i guess" he is replying ur previous posts that u said understanding formulas is impt (abt the concept & backgnd etc). Yes, indeed it is impt, but in order to understand formulas, we need to know where the formulas are derived from. & from "original" formulas, by understanding the theories etc... & work the way thru to derive it into another formula & so on. These ways make us understand the concept & backgnd of formulas... But it takes a super long time to do so, especially if we are under time constaint. I tried it b4... its really time consuming... & during the exam, I have no time to derive the "original" formula to the formula I need in order to do the those questions for a 2 to 2.5 hr papers.
To conclude, yes, practising is impt, else is really hard to remember it to use them, but that doesnt mean we truly understand the formulas.