In memory of Shanmugam Murugesu
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"I may not like pot, but I will let you be a pothead for as long as you want, it's your life. "Originally posted by Fatum:*sniggers ...... Pothead ....
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think about that statement again .....Originally posted by LazerLordz:"I may not like pot, but I will let you be a pothead for as long as you want, it's your life. "
do you really believe in that ? .... -
we try..we all try.Originally posted by Fatum:think about that statement again .....
do you really believe in that ? .... -
There will be some who will say "THIS IS MADNESS!"
But what to do?
"MADNESS?
THIS
IS
SINGAPOOOOOOOOORE!!!!" -
then perhaps you've lost sight of the result, for the process .....Originally posted by LazerLordz:we try..we all try.
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I would rather he dies than my daughter and son and friend and many many more people fall into poverty and endless problems... Good reason enough?
If not i make it more clear, I like some aspect of USA but certainly not the crime rate, drugs, lousy education and guns in school... sorry we are just a small island... no risk to take. -
This is obviously not what the topic starter endeavoured to achieve, but on a sidenote, then why are cigarettes and alcohol legal? Let's use cigarettes as an example. I have no empirical evidence, but if we were to think about it, cigarettes damages the body as well, but why doesn't the government ban it? Is it because of the revenue it generates? Or is it because it is '' socially acceptable'' ? In Australia, weed/grass/marijuana, whatever u call it, is legal in certain states. Does the '' socially acceptable'' mindset apply here as well?Originally posted by Your_Father:In Singapore, the only natural resource is the people. Even if a small portion of this natural resource gets defective, its still treated with great importance. Lets say we legalize it, people get addicted to it. Wont the society crumble. If all you can think of is when is the next time u can smoke your pot, then there is something really wrong.
If our government is afraid of our people becoming defective, then why did they decide to bring in the casino? For revenues? Won't it cause our people to become defective as well? Gambling, just like smoking weed/cigarettes, is addictive as well. Or, is it because a casino is ''socially acceptable'' as well.
I'm also against the death penalty btw, it really is a cruel way of solving problems. Which of us, as humans, have the right to play God? And I'm sure some politicians would agree. But unfortunately, they would never vote it into law due to some economics principle that i studied. ( If they feel that the death penalty isn't right, politicians would still not voice it out to members of the public because the public would think they are not tough enough on laws and hence, not vote them into parliament) -
Very unfortunately, our country is not too well known for it's compassion as well as in giving people a second chance. Our education system is a pretty good example. Once you screw up in the earlier stages of education, u're pretty screwed all the way to tertiery level. U can still make amends, but it will take HELL ALOT OF TIME !!Originally posted by coffeegirl:As an American citizen, I was shocked to find out that a man was murdered by Singapore for having marijuana.
It is well known in the USA that this is a natural, non-addicting and very popular smokable plant. Many states have already legalized it for medicine, and much more is to come.
This is a bloodstain on Singapore, probably based on ignorance. Note we are not discussing opium here! I am sure many of you drink beer and wine but think nothing about doing that.
It also seems that the fact that two young children begged for their father's life meant nothing to Singapore. This a horror on top of a horror.
Fortunately, Mr. Murugesu and Singapore's horrific killing live on in Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanmugam_Murugesu -
and in america's history. There is rampant hanging of women, who are accused of practising witchcraft. What do you say about that?Originally posted by coffeegirl:A hundred fifty years ago, blacks were legal slaves in this country. When they tried to escape to freedom they were hanged. What do you say to that now?
Your reasoning would justify any action taken according to any law. That would include Hitler and a few other 'governments'. I hope that Mr. Murugesu's children will never read your chilling post about what is 'right'.
Them females was dabbling in drugs, some to save others. Some for medicinal purposes. Whats the deal on that instead?
and so what if Mr Murugesan children read the postings? Does it justify them to migrate to America instead? Are you going to hopefully do some good by helping them to your home country and protecting them against the barbaric Asia?
So please.....dont just talk. You do the walk, then you gets my thumbs up.
And for someone who claims to be a American Citizen, who mentioned about black slaves being hanged in history.
You are discussing apples & oranges?????
Are you for one, trying to suggest that marijauna transportting and possessions are legal recreational drugs in the United States and that DEA is a merely a front for whatever else in USA? -
how come no one wondered if TS's a clone so far ? ...
cos the nick's coffeegirl and not coffeeboy ? ... -
actually i'm not sure if that's american history. its more like a catholic history.Originally posted by viciouskitty74:and in america's history. There is rampant hanging of women, who are accused of practising witchcraft. What do you say about that?
Them females was dabbling in drugs, some to save others. Some for medicinal purposes. Whats the deal on that instead?
and so what if Mr Murugesan children read the postings? Does it justify them to migrate to America instead? Are you going to hopefully do some good by helping them to your home country and protecting them against the barbaric Asia?
So please.....dont just talk. You do the walk, then you gets my thumbs up.
And for someone who claims to be a American Citizen, who mentioned about black slaves being hanged in history.
You are discussing apples & oranges?????
Are you for one, trying to suggest that marijauna transportting and possessions are legal in the United States and that DEA is a merely a front for whatever else in USA?
but yeah.. i kinda hv to agree with the majority here.. sometimes u hv to use the "kill the monkey, scare the chicken" tactic to get things done.
i'm sure mr shanmugam didn't have medication in mind when he brought in 1kg worth of pot. -
Not surprising.Originally posted by Fatum:how come no one wondered if TS's a clone so far ? ...
cos the nick's coffeegirl and not coffeeboy ? ...
Lots of folks here create clones, for role play purposes.
And as long as some moderators feels that the 'agendas' is to their liking....so why not let that clone crap. -
Neither did Michael Fay when he defaces the cars with spray paint in Singapore.....he got how many strokes of canes?Originally posted by dumbdumb!:actually i'm not sure if that's american history. its more like a catholic history.
but yeah.. i kinda hv to agree with the majority here.. sometimes u hv to use the "kill the monkey, scare the chicken" tactic to get things done.
i'm sure mr shanmugam didn't have medication in mind when he brought in 1kg worth of pot.
I got a lot more old americans in america telling me that Singapore gahment should have given him more strokes. -
but, saying that, i'm not going to jump the gun and start judging him.. i feel sorry too. because i do not know the reasons why he did that. is it because he was desperate for money, he lost his job, etc?
sometimes society can be a really harsh place, and we're forced to do things we don't want to, in order to survive..
anyone knows the full story? was he in debt? lost his job, desperate or smth? -
can also do a wikipedia search: type Salem Witch trails.Originally posted by dumbdumb!:actually i'm not sure if that's american history. its more like a catholic history.
I was merely refering that to reply to the 'American coffeegal'. -
Maybe, or just as coffeegal suggested. He just was transporting the marijuana for his own consumption.Originally posted by dumbdumb!:but, saying that, i'm not going to jump the gun and start judging him.. i feel sorry too. because i do not know the reasons why he did that. is it because he was desperate for money, he lost his job, etc?
sometimes society can be a really harsh place, and we're forced to do things we don't want to, in order to survive..
anyone knows the full story? was he in debt? lost his job, desperate or smth?
Lots of folks, maybe like coffeegal has the norm to consume such items and is probably bringing the extras to share with his/her friends who can share his interest.
*snort* -
btw coffeegal....
here's a interesting law of Singapore you can truly make fun of, with those of your same mind.
In Singapore, it is unlawful to have/do a blow job without a intercourse.
Go look it up. americans & europeans really was seriously tickled by that tidbit. -
I did mean USA when referring to blacks being slaves. Both that and the witch trials are now a historic shame on this country. I expect the same will happen with Singapore in this killing.
I did not mix apples and oranges, I replied directly to the poster's comment about things being 'legal' or not, and that his position would justify any action.
Despite DEA's efforts, many states here have opened clinics to pass out marijuana to sick people, although it is well known that many of them probably don't 'need' it. There is some conflict between state and federal law here, no question about it.
I will add that you do not mention the many other countries going in the same direction.
Yes I am American and I live in Los Angeles, CA
I do not know 'coffeeman', sorry. -
behind every crime, there's always a personal tragedy, you can bet on it ....Originally posted by dumbdumb!:but, saying that, i'm not going to jump the gun and start judging him.. i feel sorry too. because i do not know the reasons why he did that. is it because he was desperate for money, he lost his job, etc?
sometimes society can be a really harsh place, and we're forced to do things we don't want to, in order to survive..
anyone knows the full story? was he in debt? lost his job, desperate or smth?
but that doesn't justify any crime .... we're not talking about the chap stealing a loaf of bread to feed his family here ... we're talking about smuggling a large amount of drugs here .... imagine the harm it can do ... the sight of emanciated drug addicts holding syringes to their arms while sitting on the steps of some shithole shop in a bad part of vancouver will always stay with me .... if we go the other way, then we'll be forgetting who the real victims are, eh ? ....
I do feel for his mother though ... remember when we hung that nyugen chap ? .... some farking assholes actually called up this chap's mother and used her for their agenda ! ... she's a simple folk, anyone could see that ... but those capital punishment campaigners actually looked her up and got her as their front person ... reopening her pain again ! .... blardy farkers, they should rot in hell ...
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Originally posted by coffeegirl:I do appreciate your replies in this matter.
I believe there is a failure to distinguish marijuana from other drugs. Singapore's view of it appears to be the same as heroin, instead of the appropriate beer/wine category. The USA and many European countries have not had this view since the 1930's. That was 70 years ago.
In any event the killing was in no way justified. Law does not justify itself.
What makes you think that just because usa and europe have this view, then the rest of the world must follow your view?
So you think your view is the de facto correct view? The fact that you so conveniently and in a natural way use that as an argument shows how deeply ingrained in your mind are the concept that western view is always the correct view.
You may not acknowledge or even know it, but deep down in your heart people like you are the worst racists in this world.
You try to champion for the "benefit" and "enlightenment " of other races or other countries. You go around educating people from other countries about what's right and what's wrong. You think that by default you always hold the correct view. You know what? Go get a life and don't think too highly of yourselves.
The way we see it, you are wrong. But we are not busybody. We don't want to waste our time going to your country and try to convince you that marijuana is drug.
And you can take your usa and european views and stick it up yours. We don't care.
Simply put, we don't agree with you. You are wrong. -
how much taxes have you paid to America that sponsors the free distribution of marijuana to 'sick' people?Originally posted by coffeegirl:I did mean USA when referring to blacks being slaves. Both that and the witch trials are now a historic shame on this country.
I did not mix apples and oranges, I replied directly to the poster's comment about things being 'legal' or not, and that his position would justify any action.
Despite DEA's efforts, many states here have opened clinics to pass out marijuana to sick people, although it is well known that many of them probably don't 'need' it. There is some conflict between state and federal law here, no question about it.
I will add that you do not mention the many other countries going in the same direction.
Other countries? Are they asia? are they Singapore? -
sigh .... why is it wrong to take away people's right to harm themselves ? ... why ? ....
cos no one lives for himself alone ... no one .... '
why do we intervene when someone becomes a gambling addict ? ... an alcholic ? .... a drug addict ? ..... it's certainly not about some gutless worm of a person who couldn't even take care of himself ... but about the people around him ... his family, his community ... cos in bring harm to himself, he has an impact on those around him too ....
THAT'S WHY WE DO THE THINGS WE DO ! ....
in spouting about individual rights, some of us forget about the people around us .... -
Well, that is you shame.Originally posted by coffeegirl:I did mean USA when referring to blacks being slaves. Both that and the witch trials are now a historic shame on this country.
I did not mix apples and oranges, I replied directly to the poster's comment about things being 'legal' or not, and that his position would justify any action.
Despite DEA's efforts, many states here have opened clinics to pass out marijuana to sick people, although it is well known that many of them probably don't 'need' it. There is some conflict between state and federal law here, no question about it.
I will add that you do not mention the many other countries going in the same direction.
Our 'shame in hanging Mr Shanmugam' is for our future to 'shame'.
frankly, it was none of your business iszit? You pointing fingers, trying to shame Singapore citizen into what?
So your own future generations can look back and feel ashame about your accusations and bigoty and lack of respect for other country laws and for other country's citizen when you have not even settled your home problem?
Are you helping to keep drugs away from your own children, so they wont be sleeping at the streets, begging for money, selling their backside so they can get more money for marijuana to keep them 'happily sick'? -
Oh yes.....LA, hows the smells at the streets so far?Originally posted by coffeegirl:Yes I am American and I live in Los Angeles, CA
The rain finally came down and washed off the urine dried on the pavements, rails & fences?
Summer can be real smelly isnt it?
And all those poor homeless roaming the streets.....and marijuana given free to 'sick' people to forget their 'troubles'.
I am sorry that you are sorry for Shanmugam.
But I am even sorry when I see pictures of missing children at the boards at Walmart.
Or those that survived and tells of how they were lured into perv's car with promises of drugs and has their backside totally ravished while in that drug induced stupor. -
First of all, I have absolute zilch knowledge on drugs, law and whatsoever. But here's my 2 cents worth.
Singapore & United States of America.
There are bound to have differences in the way these 2 countries are being governed. Simply because they are in 2 different environments. The environment and the physicality of the country determine how it is being governed. As mentioned by a fellow forumner, Singapore's greatest resource is its people.
Alcohol & Smoking VS Marijuana.
As mentioned by fellow forumners, despite alcohol and smoking having lots of defective effects on the human body, it is not banned here, perhaps because of it is "socially acceptable". Apparently, yeah. Probably. The society decides for itself. In the current society, smoking is probably still socially acceptable. Marijuana? If the society does not approve of it, so be it. Move on to another society that does. As argued, smoking is just as bad as marijuana but hey, the society's mindset takes time to adjust.
Some of you are probably right. Smoking should be totally banned as well. The government are probably not banning it due to economical, policital reasons. But you see, steps are taken to reduce smoking in Singapore. The gross pictures, the no-smoking areas. Why not just implement a total ban? That will be economical suicide. Just because smoking is not ban, it is not a reason for marijuana to be un-ban. 2 wrongs definitely do not make 2 rights.\
You see, to legalise marijuana now is to bring MORE detrimental to the society in terms of health. To illegalise alcohol and smoking now would also bring MORE detrimental to the society in various aspects.
The Topic.
What exactly is the argument here?
1) The fact that 2 children are pleading for their dad which should lead to the law making an exception?
2) Or the law itself being flawed?
3) Or down with capital punishment?
1) No arguments for the 1st. The law is the law. Many forumners have point out this point pretty well so no repeats.
2) Flawed law? Can be argued.
3) Yeah, down with capital punishment.
Regarding that black slavery thingie, you can't really use it as a comparison. It is as though you are trying to say, banning marijuana is an injustice done to the society. And even if alcohol and smoking is not being banned, it doesn't make marijuana any lesser evil.
Eh wait, are you arguing for marijuana to be made legal here in Singapore?
Pardon my bad english.